Coronation (5 Viewers)

[skybluetony176]

Were Liverpool fans markedly worse for hooliganism in the 80s than other English teams?

People seem to forget that for a period of time some people didn’t go to watch the game even, they went for a fight/riot. Football was little more than a vehicle to do that.

 

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[GIMOC]

It’s a historically accurate take. English football fans were the worst hooligans in the world at the time. It might have come to a head at Heysel but it was a long time coming. Maybe you’re too young to remember what it was like but I’m not. It got that bad in domestic English football that families stopped going, the government set up a “war cabinet” to deal with it, fans had to be caged in like animals, because large numbers were etc etc etc. it was wank and a national embarrassment.

You’re also looking at it the wrong way. The fact is if Heysel was an isolated incident English clubs wouldn’t have been banned. As it was Liverpool got an extra ban on top of the ban the rest of English clubs got. Initially they had an indefinite ban.

There’s also the small fact that going to watch a game now is a completely different experience to what it was in the 80’s. The ban from European football like it or not played a part in that. Yes it’s shit we lost out on European football but if something didn’t happen things were never going to change and they most certainly had to change.

i can’t help but laugh at that. if you believe England fans worse in the world back then, then you are very gullible. the media portrayed us that way but back then, loads of countries especially South America where killings at football occurred on a regularly basis. Liverpool fans in the 80’s were the biggest scumbag going. Carrying knives, looting shops etc… Liverpool fully to blame for us not getting into Europe and the fact you try and justify them is quite frankly embarrassing.

 

[GIMOC]

Better a fool than a bigot mate, though I get the sense you're going for a little from column A and a bit from column B.

Explain your masterful genius to us then. In what way is booing the anthem make someone "self righteous" (or a murderer)? This should be interesting.

a bigot? Explain? Liverpool fans are well known to be self righteous. always the victims but never their fault is the saying and it’s true. the fact I see cov fans justifying Liverpool fans when the scumbags wrecked our chances of playing in Europe is embarrassing.

 

[skybluetony176]

You didn’t attend a football match until you were in your mid twenties Tony - the 80s passed you by

I was born in 73. I remember the 80’s clearly. The hooliganism for me like many was a turnoff when it came to football. I’m lucky I started watching in a different time, if things had have continued like they were I like many, especially families would never have gone. I certainly wouldn’t have taken my children and young nephews. Both of which I’ve done. Football was in danger of losing a generation of fans had things continued.

 

[skybluetony176]

i can’t help but laugh at that. if you believe England fans worse in the world back then, then you are very gullible. the media portrayed us that way but back then, loads of countries especially South America where killings at football occurred on a regularly basis. Liverpool fans in the 80’s were the biggest scumbag going. Carrying knives, looting shops etc… Liverpool fully to blame for us not getting into Europe and the fact you try and justify them is quite frankly embarrassing.

You can laugh all you like mate. It’s still accurate. You can choose your own opinions but you can’t choose your own facts.

 

[Grendel]

I was born in 73. I remember the 80’s clearly. The hooliganism for me like many was a turnoff when it came to football. I’m lucky I started watching in a different time, if things had have continued like they were I like many, especially families would never have gone. I certainly wouldn’t have taken my children and young nephews. Both of which I’ve done. Football was in danger of losing a generation of fans had things continued.

So you didn’t go to games in the 80’s lol

 

[skybluetony176]

So you didn’t go to games in the 80’s lol

Why did I have to go to games in the 80’s to understand how bad it was? Anyone alive in that era knew exactly what it was like.

 

[rob9872]

It's worse now imo. In the 80s if you didn't want trouble you didn't get any. I was born in 72 and dad took me to Highfield Road throughout. We never had trouble or went looking for it. Now anyone is fair game to some of the young lads all coked up and carrying weapons. They'd happily do a family over to claim a victory on social media.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Were Liverpool fans markedly worse for hooliganism in the 80s than other English teams?

I don't think so, they just played abroad more than anybody else.

 

[SBT]

It's worse now imo. In the 80s if you didn't want trouble you didn't get any. I was born in 72 and dad took me to Highfield Road throughout. We never had trouble or went looking for it. Now anyone is fair game to some of the young lads all coked up and carrying weapons. They'd happily do a family over to claim a victory on social media.

When was the last time you saw a family set upon by a coked up mob with weapons at a game? Or on social media?

 

[rob9872]

When was the last time you saw a family set upon by a coked up mob with weapons at a game? Or on social media?

Reports on here of it in our very last game home to brum!

 

[SBT]

Reports on here of it in our very last game home to brum!

Wtf…..totally missed that. Link?

 

[rob9872]

I'm not certain where it is tbf hopefully someone who recalls it can but something about the underpass and k8ds running off with the old man left on the floor.

Tbf most of the footage I've found after that game seems to be the police causing the trouble.

 

[rob9872]

I'd also add goading as seen that first hand with kids trying to get a reaction out of you almost as an excuse to have a go and have shouted stuff when been with wife and daughter who I'm obviously not going to leave alone to fight with idiots. If they started on them I'd defend of course, but had to bite lip a few times.

 

[Grendel]

Why did I have to go to games in the 80’s to understand how bad it was? Anyone alive in that era knew exactly what it was like.

you tried to patronise someone saying they were too young and admit you never attended games as - I assume - you were too young? I used to go to every home and away game virtually most seasons Tony - so ask me

 

[Grendel]

I don't think so, they just played abroad more than anybody else.

It was Roma and Hysel back to back that caused the ban

 

[GIMOC]

You can laugh all you like mate. It’s still accurate. You can choose your own opinions but you can’t choose your own facts.

let’s deal with the facts. Liverpool murder Italians in the ground. Next 5 seasons English clubs banned. Banned because of heysel. That’s a fact

 

[Grendel]

let’s deal with the facts. Liverpool murder Italians in the ground. Next 5 seasons English clubs banned. Banned because of heysel. That’s a fact

a fact is Tony never went to a game in the 80’s - he was too scared

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

let’s deal with the facts. Liverpool murder Italians in the ground. Next 5 seasons English clubs banned. Banned because of heysel. That’s a fact

Then 96 die at Hillsborough and the police and right wing press tell lies for decades after. I’d say any debt incurred at Heysel has been repaid

 

[skybluetony176]

you tried to patronise someone saying they were too young and admit you never attended games as - I assume - you were too young? I used to go to every home and away game virtually most seasons Tony - so ask me

I wasn’t patronising them. I was pointing out that I was alive at the time. Why would I ask you? Going to games doesn’t help you understand shit. You’re the poster who starts multiple threads a season calling for the most successful manager we’ve had in generations to be sacked. If people listened to your opinions we’d still be in league 2. You’re an idiot.

 

[skybluetony176]

a fact is Tony never went to a game in the 80’s - he was too scared

You do know that you’re a grown man?

 

[David O'Day]

grenners ruining another thread shock

he needs banning

 

[clint van damme]

It's worse now imo. In the 80s if you didn't want trouble you didn't get any. I was born in 72 and dad took me to Highfield Road throughout. We never had trouble or went looking for it. Now anyone is fair game to some of the young lads all coked up and carrying weapons. They'd happily do a family over to claim a victory on social media.

That's wasn't my experience Rob. Thought it was much worse back then.

 

[Grendel]

I wasn’t patronising them. I was pointing out that I was alive at the time. Why would I ask you? Going to games doesn’t help you understand shit. You’re the poster who starts multiple threads a season calling for the most successful manager we’ve had in generations to be sacked. If people listened to your opinions we’d still be in league 2. You’re an idiot.

Tony you didn’t go to games. There was very little issue unless you wanted it - which oddly isn’t much different to now. In fact the Birmingham game and post match action was pretty much the same

 

[clint van damme]

i can’t help but laugh at that. if you believe England fans worse in the world back then, then you are very gullible. the media portrayed us that way but back then, loads of countries especially South America where killings at football occurred on a regularly basis. Liverpool fans in the 80’s were the biggest scumbag going. Carrying knives, looting shops etc… Liverpool fully to blame for us not getting into Europe and the fact you try and justify them is quite frankly embarrassing.

Liverpool were not fully to blame, that's nonsense, otherwise they'd have just banned Liverpool, (who did get an extended ban).

They certainly played a big part that's undeniable.

But every time English fans went abroad there was bother, its a miracle the national side never got a ban.

 

[Deleted member 9744]

The ban was directly because of Heysel. However that was far from the only serious outbreak of football related violence at the time. A couple of weeks earlier there was massive trouble when Leeds were relegated when they lost at Birmingham and that included at least one death from memory.

That said I went to most Cov matches in the 80s and I think the amount of trouble at that time is massively over played. I can only remember a couple of major incidents. Usually any trouble could easily be avoided.

Us going on about being banned from Europe because of Liverpool is about as relevant today as Sunderland going on about 1977.

I have no problem with Liverpool fans booing, but then again I would abolish the monarchy. A king that is happy to live in a palace, (and own other palaces) just because of who he was born to when there are people literally sleeping in the streets nearby, doesn't have my support.

 

[GIMOC]

Then 96 die at Hillsborough and the police and right wing press tell lies for decades after. I’d say any debt incurred at Heysel has been repaid

so heysel is irrelevant? Based on that argument. the fact remains, if it wasn’t for heysel cov would be in Europe. Simple as that and fact cov fans try and defend Liverpool is embarrassing

 

[skybluetony176]

Tony you didn’t go to games. There was very little issue unless you wanted it - which oddly isn’t much different to now. In fact the Birmingham game and post match action was pretty much the same

Did the family at the Birmingham game want it?

 

[GIMOC]

Liverpool were not fully to blame, that's nonsense, otherwise they'd have just banned Liverpool, (who did get an extended ban).

They certainly played a big part that's undeniable.

But every time English fans went abroad there was bother, its a miracle the national side never got a ban.

if heysel didn’t happen we wouldn’t have been banned. Simple as that. At the time Liverpool were in Europe every year. Weren’t many teams in Europe then. Only champions and cup winners compared to now.

 

[skybluetony176]

so heysel is irrelevant? Based on that argument. the fact remains, if it wasn’t for heysel cov would be in Europe. Simple as that and fact cov fans try and defend Liverpool is embarrassing

No one’s trying to defend Liverpool. Just pointing out that it was part of a bigger issue and Heysel was the straw that broke the camel’s back.

 

[TomRad85]

Ewww Liverpool apologists. Almost as many of those on this group as there are old firm lovers.

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk

 

[clint van damme]

if heysel didn’t happen we wouldn’t have been banned. Simple as that. At the time Liverpool were in Europe every year. Weren’t many teams in Europe then. Only champions and cup winners compared to now.

There were at least 3 or 4 English teams in Europe every year, (it was probably more because we just missed out in 77-78 when we finished,I think, 7th), but Liverpool were pretty much a constant.
I can even remeber problems abroad involving Southampton!
My biggest city related wish left is to watch h us in Europe but I don't bang on out missing out because given 39 people died I don't think me not getting the chance to get pissed up on the continent with my mates is the worse consequence of the fall out.

 

[Otis]

It's worse now imo. In the 80s if you didn't want trouble you didn't get any. I was born in 72 and dad took me to Highfield Road throughout. We never had trouble or went looking for it. Now anyone is fair game to some of the young lads all coked up and carrying weapons. They'd happily do a family over to claim a victory on social media.

Sorry, Rob, but that is wrong. I got set upon by a car full of Leeds fans. I was simply walking home from the game with my girlfriend. I was doing nothing other than just have a City scarf on and walking down the road. The car was driving by, saw I was a City fan and all they all jumped out of the car and attacked me, breaking my nose.


On another occasion, I was with friends, again, just walking, this time TO a game and this was Man U.

There were 4 of us and a group of what must have been 40 or 50 Man U fans saw us and ran towards us. We had to run like crazy and we saw a pub and and went to hide in there.

The locals had to put the door bolt across, because these Man U fans were then trying to break the door down.

So it's untrue to say if you didn't want trouble you didn't get any.

 

[chiefdave]

But every time English fans went abroad there was bother, its a miracle the national side never got a ban.

There was a documentary on the BBC about Italia 90 not long ago and they mentioned on there the national team was very close to being banned from tournaments. Seemingly the situation wasn’t helped by the government of the time having little objection to such a ban

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

so heysel is irrelevant? Based on that argument. the fact remains, if it wasn’t for heysel cov would be in Europe. Simple as that and fact cov fans try and defend Liverpool is embarrassing

It isn’t, but if you’re going to criticise them for Heysel you can still empathise for Hillsborough.