Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (171 Viewers)

Sky Blue Harry H · Mar 15, 2021

clint van damme said:
Several EU countries suspended it's use though most are predominantly using Pfizer.
But in the UK there have been more incidents of clotting from Pfizer than AZ though both numbers are still incredibly small and in my opinion the risks from interrupting the vaccine program are far greater

I was watching an interview about the Grey War (misinformation via social media/internet) from a former GCHQ employee, and it strikes me that this might be an example of it (maybe my post is even adding to it!), but you have interviewer after interviewer asking 'experts' whether vaccines are safe, as people are worried, yet due to politeness etc, the 'expert' and interviewer always acknowledges the real concern, instead of boldly saying 'it's bl**dy safe - take it!' It strikes me that vaccine misinformation is a potential abhorrent 'weapon' by mischievous nations.

fernandopartridge · Mar 15, 2021

David O'Day said:
Ministers frustrated with PM's 'mistakes' ahead of Covid second wave

Senior figures tell the BBC Boris Johnson should have been tougher in the autumn to prevent more deaths.

www.bbc.co.uk

Tory ministers look to protect themselves and throw Boris to the wolves

The whole party will be in on it, it's been the plan all along.

fernandopartridge · Mar 15, 2021

covmark said:
Spain now the latest to suspend the AZ vaccine. Anyone else finding all this a bit odd. 40 cases of blood clots out of 17 million vaccinations. With AZ saying according to their data, you're less likely to have a blood clot after having the vaccine, than if you haven't had it.

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

It's one of the EU related problems that the UK is normally at the poor end of. EU members generally giving up regulatory powers to the EU means they have lost a lot of expertise. The UK was the home to the EMA pre Brexit and is a leader in the field. I don't think member state regulators have got the same level of confidence in their own decision making.

Deleted member 4439 · Mar 15, 2021

Ccfcisparks said:
I’d imagine the chances of catching corona are far greater than any side effects anyway. To me it seems purely coincidental

Careful, not necessarily side-effects at all, simply chance. Around 1 in 1000 get a blood clot every year. Even on chance, 17,000 receiving a vaccination will have a blood clot within a year, and 325 or so will have a blood clot in the week of receiving the vaccination.

Evo1883 · Mar 15, 2021

Hey maybe the Europeans can send their doses of the vaccine to poorer countries that would appreciate them very very much

They are potentially setting themselves back months

shmmeee · Mar 15, 2021

Interesting thread on how the US and Canada have basically acted the same way as EU countries towards the AZ vaccine and no one gave a shit.

Brylowes · Mar 15, 2021

Ian1779 said:
We did over 2000 tests on kids over the last week, and didn’t have a single positive. Let’s hope that’s a flavour of what’s happening across the country.

I live on the east Suffolk coast and a local primary school was closed today and is remaining closed for the rest of this week at least, apparently they had a spike of positive cases last week and have closed as a precaution.
No idea of numbers involved or whether the cases were among children, teaching staff or both.
hopefully it’s not as worrying as I think it sounds.

Ian1779 · Mar 15, 2021

Brylowes said:
I live on the east Suffolk coast and a local primary school was closed today and is remaining closed for the rest of this week at least, apparently they had a spike of positive cases last week and have closed as a precaution.
No idea of numbers involved or whether the cases were among children, teaching staff or both.
hopefully it’s not as worrying as I think it sounds.

As I understood it, there was no testing of primary school children happening. So this must have come from staff testing themselves or a community infection brought into school via the students. Let’s hope it’s a isolated case that they jumped on quickly.

CCFCSteve · Mar 16, 2021

shmmeee said:
Interesting thread on how the US and Canada have basically acted the same way as EU countries towards the AZ vaccine and no one gave a shit.

Think it’s more a combination of things with regard to the EUs vaccine behaviour shmmeee. Slow regarding procurement, then blaming everyone else because of it, threatening AZ, saying the AZ jab was quasi ineffective/questioning its efficacy, then not being able to administer the AZ jabs due to (unsurprisingly) increased anti vax sentiment on the continent and then withholding/threatening to withhold supplies - not necessarily all in that order

Agree though, if US isn’t planning on using those AZ jabs soon, get them to places that need them...and quick !

ps Fauci’s initial comments regarding the UK potentially rushing vaccine approval was condemned and from memory he apologised/clarified immediately

Skybluefaz · Mar 16, 2021

The right wing Johnson apologists on Facebook aren't going to like that. 'he did all he could, don't blame Boris' blah blah.

SBAndy · Mar 16, 2021

Skybluefaz said:
The right wing Johnson apologists on Facebook aren't going to like that. 'he did all he could, don't blame Boris' blah blah.

Just a build-on to that ministers’ nonsense yesterday/earlier today. Which is crazy considering half of them are arguing for re-opening early again this time.

shmmeee · Mar 16, 2021

CCFCSteve said:
Think it’s more a combination of things with regard to the EUs vaccine behaviour shmmeee. Slow regarding procurement, then blaming everyone else because of it, threatening AZ, saying the AZ jab was quasi ineffective/questioning its efficacy, then not being able to administer the AZ jabs due to (unsurprisingly) increased anti vax sentiment on the continent and then withholding/threatening to withhold supplies - not necessarily all in that order

Agree though, if US isn’t planning on using those AZ jabs soon, get them to places that need them...and quick !

ps Fauci’s initial comments regarding the UK potentially rushing vaccine approval was condemned and from memory he apologised/clarified immediately

No I agree. Just thought it was an interesting point that we barely hear about Canada blocking it or the US not using its supplies.

I also think there’s a bit of eurosceptic inversion going on here. The actual EU bodies like the EMA are being reasonably sensible from what I can tell, the member states are acting like fucking lunatics though.

jimmyhillsfanclub · Mar 16, 2021

covmark said:
Spain now the latest to suspend the AZ vaccine. Anyone else finding all this a bit odd. 40 cases of blood clots out of 17 million vaccinations. With AZ saying according to their data, you're less likely to have a blood clot after having the vaccine, than if you haven't had it.

This is truly bizarre.....collective madness coupled with appalling leadership.
Absolutely no scientific reason or fact behind it whatsoever. Just fucking weird behaviour that will leave thousands more dead.

Brylowes · Mar 16, 2021

jimmyhillsfanclub said:
This is truly bizarre.....collective madness coupled with appalling leadership.
Absolutely no scientific reason or fact behind it whatsoever. Just fucking weird behaviour that will leave thousands more dead.

I’ve already had it, but it would be very strange for all these different countries to raise serious concerns, let alone taking it out of use.

ajsccfc · Mar 16, 2021

While Pedro, Pierre and Hans are left waiting, I've just got my appointment booking through to get jabbed up real nice next week. Surprised by how relieved I suddenly feel

eastwoodsdustman · Mar 16, 2021

Had mine on Sunday and it kicked the shit out of me yesterday. Feel really great today though.

Personally I think the EU countries are using the Oxford AZ side effects as an excuse to help cover up their ineffective roll out to their public. By looking like they're taking precautions they are buying themselves a bit more time to try and get stuff in place.

Could you imagine the outcry here if the British public could see the French and Germans all getting vaccinated and us not?

shmmeee · Mar 16, 2021

Saw reports of people in the U.K. asking questions of nurses about blood clots and the like, slowing down the throughput having to be reassured if nothing else.

Bloody statistically illiterate idiots are going to cost lives.

wingy · Mar 16, 2021

I thought Sweden was in the initial Nordic group, but have paused it this morning
That's quite interesting as a Swedish company was involved in it's development

I'll go somewhere here ,were not we on this thread sceptical of AZ's presentation on the data , IE over 55 and mixed presentation on dosages and results

I know I did but might have been alone

Don't think they helped themselves.from the start tbf

clint van damme · Mar 16, 2021

jimmyhillsfanclub said:
This is truly bizarre.....collective madness coupled with appalling leadership.
Absolutely no scientific reason or fact behind it whatsoever. Just fucking weird behaviour that will leave thousands more dead.

Coupled with the fact that there has also been clotting reported in people who have had pfizer. But again, no more than than normal in a population sample of that size but they're carrying on using it

AOM · Mar 16, 2021

shmmeee said:
Saw reports of people in the U.K. asking questions of nurses about blood clots and the like, slowing down the throughput having to be reassured if nothing else.

Bloody statistically illiterate idiots are going to cost lives.

Yep, I've heard people here now are requesting for the Pfizer one too and are willing to delay their appointments for it. Scary

jordan210 · Mar 16, 2021

What the gov needs to do. Is open up the bookings to 30+ to keep numbers high.

The whole EU vs AZ thing doest sit right with me. Almost as if its being played out to drum up business for vacancies that cost a damn site more and will make someone a lot of money.

wingy · Mar 16, 2021

AOM said:
Yep, I've heard people here now are requesting for the Pfizer one too and are willing to delay their appointments for it. Scary

Think I read an article the other day that we were expected to shift to one of the others for the under 40's .
Which must be pretty imminent.

Saddlebrains · Mar 16, 2021

The contraceptive pill has a higher percentage blood clot rate than AZ vaccine

I feel the media need to push a line similar to this to stop people panicking

Deleted member 5849 · Mar 16, 2021

Saddlebrains said:
The contraceptive pill has a higher percentage blood clot rate than AZ vaccine

I feel the media need to push a line similar to this to stop people panicking

Got no problem with them pausing it to check things out if they like but yes, when all the numbers suggest there's no issue here, it would be nice not to wake up each morning to the news that there might be a problem!

chiefdave · Mar 16, 2021

There's something not right here. The basic numbers don't seem cause to halt everything yet why are more and more countries doing it?

Are we really saying this is something being coordinated by the EU to deflect blame from themselves? Why would all these countries just fall in line and put their own citizens at risk for that?

The first countries that paused the vaccine were talking about higher instances of clotting that all traced back to the same batch of vaccines but that doesn't seem to be mentioned now.

skybluetony176 · Mar 16, 2021

chiefdave said:
There's something not right here. The basic numbers don't seem cause to halt everything yet why are more and more countries doing it?

Are we really saying this is something being coordinated by the EU to deflect blame from themselves? Why would all these countries just fall in line and put their own citizens at risk for that?

The first countries that paused the vaccine were talking about higher instances of clotting that all traced back to the same batch of vaccines but that doesn't seem to be mentioned now.

They’ve had enough of experts. Brexititis is catching

wingy · Mar 16, 2021

Some perspective from a nuetralish media source .

Coronavirus | Denmark, Norway, Iceland suspend use of AstraZeneca vaccine

Denmark was first to announce its suspension, "following reports of serious cases of blood clots" among people who had received the vaccine.

www.thehindu.com

Sky Blue Pete · Mar 16, 2021

I’m holding on to other countries being more risk averse and it’s a data issue not a safety issue. I wouldn’t put it past our or any government to ignore extra clotting issues if it was for the greater food and let’s face it there are many many examples of safe drugs not being safe at all

Deleted member 5849 · Mar 16, 2021

Sky Blue Pete said:
I’m holding on to other countries being more risk averse and it’s a data issue not a safety issue. I wouldn’t put it past our or any government to ignore extra clotting issues if it was for the greater food and let’s face it there are many many examples of safe drugs not being safe at all

As I said, happy for the risk averse approach, especially when something's new. The numbers do seem *very* small though so, you'd expect it to resume in a few days. Radio 2's news has not been a good start to the day the past few days, however!

wingy · Mar 16, 2021

Deleted member 5849 said:
As I said, happy for the risk averse approach, especially when something's new. The numbers do seem *very* small though so, you'd expect it to resume in a few days. Radio 2's news has not been a good start to the day the past few days, however!

How could it ever be when it's sandwiched into the Zoe Ball show for god's sake lol.

Nick · Mar 16, 2021

Anybody know Jamaica's approach to the blood clots?

shmmeee · Mar 16, 2021

jordan210 said:
What the gov needs to do. Is open up the bookings to 30+ to keep numbers high.

The whole EU vs AZ thing doest sit right with me. Almost as if its being played out to drum up business for vacancies that cost a damn site more and will make someone a lot of money.

EU is fine with it. It’s random countries in the EU plus a few elsewhere vs AZ it seems.

shmmeee · Mar 16, 2021

Deleted member 5849 said:
As I said, happy for the risk averse approach, especially when something's new. The numbers do seem *very* small though so, you'd expect it to resume in a few days. Radio 2's news has not been a good start to the day the past few days, however!

Its not risk averse. It’s very very risky to pause vaccine rollout for anything you’re not 100% of. More will die and be disabled from COVID than any of these side effects even if true.

I’m not one for nationalism, but I can’t help but feel other countries have got this very very wrong. FWIW I don’t think we got it right intentionally, it’s just this decision lined up with our own childish need to press ahead regardless and open the economy.

Grendel · Mar 16, 2021

Deleted member 5849 said:
As I said, happy for the risk averse approach, especially when something's new. The numbers do seem *very* small though so, you'd expect it to resume in a few days. Radio 2's news has not been a good start to the day the past few days, however!

Its not risk adverse it’s just illogical

chiefdave · Mar 16, 2021

This doesn't look good. Study showing the UK variant to be around 55% more lethal. As we already know its also more transmissible.

Increased mortality in community-tested cases of SARS-CoV-2 lineage B.1.1.7 - Nature

Analysis of community-tested cases of SARS-CoV-2 indicates that the B.1.1.7 variant is not only more transmissible than pre-existing variants, but may also cause more severe illness, and is associated with a higher risk of death.

www.nature.com

Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (171 Viewers)

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