Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (5 Viewers)

[jimmyhillsfanclub]

I'm 49....full of vaccine envy....and getting a bit pissed off with the ever increasing anecdotal evidence that loads of people are now effectively queue jumping by blagging.....or living somewhere posh....or being registered with a family GP practice instead of a community health centre....or suddenly claiming to be unpaid carers cos they did their Ma's shopping a couple times.....

 

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[Grendel]

I am referring to the total number of people actually fully vaccinated.

Total number of vaccinations in Italy - 3.03 million
Total number of vaccinations in UK - 3.6 million

Ministero della Salute - Report Vaccini Anti Covid-19

www.governo.it

Official UK Coronavirus Dashboard

GOV.UK Coronavirus dashboard

coronavirus.data.gov.uk

Lol I’d rather have 90% protection from hospitalisation for 30 million people

 

[Sick Boy]

Lol I’d rather have 90% protection from hospitalisation for 30 million people

As I said, things are starting to get moving much quicker now but the big problem has been the lack of proper lockdown for a year and following a bodged tier system that was based upon the UK one. Up until a few weeks ago it was possible to drink inside inside bars here.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Canada suspends use of AstraZeneca Covid vaccine for those under 55

Immunisation panel says there is ‘substantial uncertainty about the benefit’ of the vaccine given risk of rare type of blood clot

www.theguardian.com

Not that I agree with this but did people say that actions like this were just the EU trying to get back at AZ?

It’s unsubstantiated nonsense from any government incapable of interpreting statistics or biology

 

[Sick Boy]

Right, but represents less protection overall.

This is a genuine scientific question, if it represents better overall protection then why are other countries not copying what the UK is doing with the 12 week window? I am genuinely curious as to why you think this is the case.

 

[Grendel]

This is a genuine scientific question, if it represents better overall protection then why are other countries not copying what the UK is doing with the 12 week window? I am genuinely curious as to why you think this is the case.

the WHO have said 12 weeks is fine and an article in the BMJ also supports it. Given the majority of Europe have decided to ignore evidence of its effectiveness it’s safety and pretty much everything else they’ve ignored scientific advice all along the way - it’s also rather ridiculous to compare 33 million vaccines to 9 million and say they are comparable- we’d have done 15 million if we’d have had a shorter time frame of both doses

 

[hill83]

“LOL ITALY IS SHIT LETS ARGUE ABOUT IT”

 

[Grendel]

“LOL ITALY IS SHIT LETS ARGUE ABOUT IT”

Not really but for someone to claim the countries are comparable is ludicrous- the Eu have shown their true nationalism and grotesque incompetence in this process and yet still defence shields are on

 

[Evo1883]

Actually quite fancy visiting Italy once this is all simmered.

 

[Grendel]

Actually quite fancy visiting Italy once this is all simmered.

On current levels of climb they will be fully protected by 2023

 

[hill83]

Not really but for someone to claim the countries are comparable is ludicrous- the Eu have shown their true nationalism and grotesque incompetence in this process and yet still defence shields are on

He explained what he meant. Full vaccinations. Comparable. I’d prefer the route we have taken. But that’s it.

LOL

 

[Sick Boy]

Not really but for someone to claim the countries are comparable is ludicrous- the Eu have shown their true nationalism and grotesque incompetence in this process and yet still defence shields are on

Trying to score cheap political points is pretty crass, especially as most countries across Europe are not going to come out of it in a good light.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Canada suspends use of AstraZeneca Covid vaccine for those under 55

Immunisation panel says there is ‘substantial uncertainty about the benefit’ of the vaccine given risk of rare type of blood clot

www.theguardian.com

Not that I agree with this but did people say that actions like this were just the EU trying to get back at AZ?

It can be both tbh, though I've said previously what the real reason is and it is EU design related.

 

[Sick Boy]

Actually quite fancy visiting Italy once this is all simmered.

Come to Verona and i'll buy you a few Tennent's Super.

 

[shmmeee]

This is a genuine scientific question, if it represents better overall protection then why are other countries not copying what the UK is doing with the 12 week window? I am genuinely curious as to why you think this is the case.

A massive misunderstanding of how harm reduction calculus works in a pandemic is my guess. Same as the morons who halted because of blood clots.

The 12 week thing was a gamble, but one that anyone sensible knew was likely to pay off. To not do it now we have the evidence is downright negligent IMO.

The maths is very clear, it’s always better to give twice as many people more than half as much protection as visa versa.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

I'm 49....full of vaccine envy....and getting a bit pissed off with the ever increasing anecdotal evidence that loads of people are now effectively queue jumping by blagging.....or living somewhere posh....or being registered with a family GP practice instead of a community health centre....or suddenly claiming to be unpaid carers cos they did their Ma's shopping a couple times.....

Given your circumstances, frankly they should be classifying you with the people who get it *now*.

 

[shmmeee]

Not really but for someone to claim the countries are comparable is ludicrous- the Eu have shown their true nationalism and grotesque incompetence in this process and yet still defence shields are on

Were talking about member state decisions, the EU approved AZ before most places and has been clear it’s safe and effective.

 

[Marty]

Got my vaccine booked in for next week.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

This is a genuine scientific question, if it represents better overall protection then why are other countries not copying what the UK is doing with the 12 week window? I am genuinely curious as to why you think this is the case.

You would have to ask the other countries. We have given good protection to twice as many people which is a perfectly sound strategy.

 

[jimmyhillsfanclub]

This is a genuine scientific question, if it represents better overall protection then why are other countries not copying what the UK is doing with the 12 week window? I am genuinely curious as to why you think this is the case.

I can't remember if I read or heard it, but a virologist mentioned that the 12 week gap has actually improved efficacy...basically (and apologies for my layman's terminology) the 1st dose prompts the growth/activation of a whole load of antibodies....many of which are weak or non-critical.....if they are boosted after say 3 weeks, some of that boost is wasted on these unnecessary antibodies....whereas after 12 weeks, the weak & non-critical antibodies have decayed or died away....so all the boost power of the 2nd dose is better targeted to the key antibodies.

double bubble...win win.

 

[jimmyhillsfanclub]

Given your circumstances, frankly they should be classifying you with the people who get it *now*.

I've tried....but cant get past the "computer says no" gatekeeper.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

I've tried....but cant get past the "computer says no" gatekeeper.

I've got a response I *want* to give now, but fear the crass labelling from certain posters, so will avoid for now. It's a sunny day and I'd rather spend it of sunny mind.

 

[shmmeee]

Great news

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Great news

Certainly is!

 

[Sick Boy]

Great news

Excellent!!

 

[clint van damme]

I can't remember if I read or heard it, but a virologist mentioned that the 12 week gap has actually improved efficacy...basically (and apologies for my layman's terminology) the 1st dose prompts the growth/activation of a whole load of antibodies....many of which are weak or non-critical.....if they are boosted after say 3 weeks, some of that boost is wasted on these unnecessary antibodies....whereas after 12 weeks, the weak & non-critical antibodies have decayed or died away....so all the boost power of the 2nd dose is better targeted to the key antibodies.

double bubble...win win.

I've heard that about the 12 week gap before.
They also said that some of the vaccines we have where the gap is less would be better extending to 12 weeks but there are practical reasons rather than medical why they're not.

 

[RegTheDonk]

Needs must with reduced supplies, second jabs have to take priority if it's a choice between the two. When supplies are back up I don't have an issue with waiting further down the queue to keep it going down the ages.

Yes. The younger people my spread it but its those who in theory who've already had 1st jab (older and medically vulnerable) who are more at risk. Better to give a 2nd jab and keep more people alive or out of hospital.

 

[CCFCSteve]

A massive misunderstanding of how harm reduction calculus works in a pandemic is my guess. Same as the morons who halted because of blood clots.

The 12 week thing was a gamble, but one that anyone sensible knew was likely to pay off. To not do it now we have the evidence is downright negligent IMO.

The maths is very clear, it’s always better to give twice as many people more than half as much protection as visa versa.

Agree mate, from memory we did the 12 week dose gap because (or at least one of the main reasons*) we were in the midst of a massive wave, like mainland Europe is now. From my limited scientific knowledge surely they should be getting those at higher risk at least partially protected asap ?!

* I also think Oxford indicated their vaccine efficacy was likely to improve with the extended gap, although this hadn’t been confirmed by regulators

ps amazing news from Israel. Fingers crossed that replicated elsewhere

 

[fernandopartridge]

Great news

I did read something, might have posted it on here which suggested that the variants we've got are likely to be as bad as they'll get, can't recall the reason but it might have been Mac and Chise who posted it.

 

[fernandopartridge]

This is also positive as the other week it was being reported that the B117 variant was more deadly :

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Agree mate, from memory we did the 12 week dose gap because (or at least one of the main reasons*) we were in the midst of a massive wave, like mainland Europe is now. From my limited scientific knowledge surely they should be getting those at higher risk at least partially protected asap ?!

* I also think Oxford indicated their vaccine efficacy was likely to improve with the extended gap, although this hadn’t been confirmed by regulators

ps amazing news from Israel. Fingers crossed that replicated elsewhere

Oxford said it would probably be alright, Pfizer warned against it.

tbh, it's... risky going against the medical tests; in effect you make us the live trial, which is... fraught with danger. Now it looks like it might well come off, which is great, but it's still risky. Was nervous at the time with it and the only reason I wouldn't go on the offensive then, or now for that matter, is because it did seem, at least, to be led by the medical advice (you know, Mr negative Whitty )

As for variants, wouldn't it be nice if what we ended up with next was a nice weak, easily transmissable variant. Go on Covid, you know you want to!

 

[CCFCSteve]

Also almost 55% in England have antibodies (and that figure was from two weeks ago !). It’s says people rather than adults (if it is, thats stunning, even if not, it’s still very good news)

www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/health-56576094

 

[CCFCSteve]

Oxford said it would probably be alright, Pfizer warned against it.

tbh, it's... risky going against the medical tests; in effect you make us the live trial, which is... fraught with danger. Now it looks like it might well come off, which is great, but it's still risky. Was nervous at the time with it and the only reason I wouldn't go on the offensive then, or now for that matter, is because it did seem, at least, to be led by the medical advice (you know, Mr negative Whitty )

As for variants, wouldn't it be nice if what we ended up with next was a nice weak, easily transmissable variant. Go on Covid, you know you want to!

Yeah, Pfizer couldnt/wouldn’t confirm but Ox/AZ said longer wait was probably beneficial. I might be wrong but I got the impression all senior PHE inc Whitty bought into decision ie weighing up risk v benefit of approach

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

I'm 49....full of vaccine envy....and getting a bit pissed off with the ever increasing anecdotal evidence that loads of people are now effectively queue jumping by blagging.....or living somewhere posh....or being registered with a family GP practice instead of a community health centre....or suddenly claiming to be unpaid carers cos they did their Ma's shopping a couple times.....

Sorry Jimmy hill I got a text from my forum health centre and booked straight away. I’m 49 too

 

[LastGarrison]

My Old Man just had the phone call for his second jab.

A week early so 11 weeks after his first jab (for those shit at maths ).