Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (7 Viewers)

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CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Why have we got so many cases then? You are telling me they are all unvaccinated people? Because they aren´t.

The vaccine does a wonderful job in limiting symptoms in the older and vulnerable, but it is not a replacement for a zero covid society.

As I mentioned the other day, two flights from South Africa landed in The Netherlands and 61 people tested positive. They then put everyone together whilst they waited for further results. This happened due to there being no requirement for negative tests before boarding (this has since changed). Instead people hide behind a QR code and think they are alright. There are some reasonable arguments to blame the unvaccinated for issues (including taking up beds in hospitals etc), but it is just common sense to see that it is still spreading like wildfire when you have had the jabs.

You cannot say ´the vaccines are effective in stopping transmission´ and then follow it up with ´conspiracy theory´ and ´that has never been the primary point of any vaccine ever´.
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A lot of this is correct ESB, as was Tony’s post. From what I’ve read the likelihood of catching it is reduced if you’re double/triple jabbed, so it helps slow the spread but many vaccinated people will still get it

This and NWs article is why vaccine passports dont really work for me other than to try to encourage people to get jabbed. If they were being used purely due to concern over transmission, you’d offer vaccine passport or a negative test...a negative test is likely to be far better guidance as to whether someone’s got Covid than a vaccine passport.

As Tony said though, the job of these vaccines is to keep people out of hospital and they’re doing a good job
 
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Deleted member 5849

Guest
CCFCSteve said:
A lot of this is correct ESB, as was Tony’s post. From what I’ve read the likelihood of catching it is reduced if you’re double/triple jabbed, so it helps slow the spread but many vaccinated people will still get it

This and NWs article is why vaccine passports dont really work for me other than to try to encourage people to get jabbed. If they were being used purely due to concern over transmission, you’d offer vaccine passport or a negative test...a negative test is likely to be far better guidance as to whether someone’s got Covid than a vaccine passport.

As Tony said though, the job of these vaccines is to keep people out of hospital and they’re doing a good job
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However, it's worth noting that if you have COvid, and the person next to you is vaccinated, they have an increased chance of not catching Covid. That, therefore, increases their chance if not passing it to the person sat next to them who, if *they're* vaccinated, have an increased chance of not catching it anyway.

Keep the chain going and you suppress transmission. Youdon'teliminate it, but you do pull it further towards a 'normality.'
 
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CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
Deleted member 5849 said:
However, it's worth noting that if you have COvid, and the person next to you is vaccinated, they have an increased chance of not catching Covid. That, therefore, increases their chance if not passing it to the person sat next to them who, if *they're* vaccinated, have an increased chance of not catching it anyway.

Keep the chain going and you suppress transmission. Youdon'teliminate it, but you do pull it further towards a 'normality.'
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I agree but as I say if the primary reason for vaccine passports is to suppress transmission in venues, they could offer negative test option as well. In some countries if you’ve recently recovered from Covid that’s seen/treated the same as being jabbed, which again feels sensible to me.

I’m saying that as someone who’s triple jabbed and had Covid so no skin off my nose either way
 
Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
In fairness, a few of the things that were said earlier on in the pandemic were categorised as ´conspiracy theories´ and they very much came true.

Vaccine passports
Contracts for MP´s mates
The vaccine not being effective in stopping transmission
The vaccine goalposts being moved regarding having freedoms back

There is a whole manner of things which raised eyebrows and just to call them ´conspiracies´ because they don´t align with ones own views is a bit dismissive and lazy really. It is the same with the ´anti-vaxx´ label. By all means, someone who is gluing vaccine clinic´s doors closed deserves that label, but it is being giving to anyone who is remotely skeptical to the vaccine and its roll out process.
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I agree that things like 'consipracy theory' are banded around far too much to cover things and try and discredit people by banding them in with a bunch of people who are looked upon as nutcases. It's a tactic that's becoming ever more prevalent in politics and thus normalising it for the public. Why have an honest and truthful debate when you can just label those arguing against you as crackpots and idiots?

I think with the vaccine goalposts being moved, it is a situation that is was always going to change constantly as so the goalposts were always going to be moving anyway. The problem there was that the likes of Johnson made 'set in stone' promises about return of freedoms that could never be said with any certainty because the situation is and was far too changeable. But for him doing something that plays well to the crowd is more important that telling the truth so he did it anyway. Then when the situation changes and restrictions are brought back it feeds into the 'conspiracy theories' and how government are using it purely as an excuse to control people because we were supposed to get these freedoms back by now. If they'd said the situation may change and measures may need to be brought back in after they've been returned if cases start to rise again that problem does not exist. So your issue shouldn't really be that the goalposts were moved, it should be that Johnson put those goalposts up in the first place.

The promise to return freedoms and not take them away again almost certainly helped create the situation whereby they had to be removed again, because it makes it seem like the problem is practically over, the virus is almost beaten and makes people get lax in their precautions, thus allowing it to spread again.
 
P

PVA

Well-Known Member
fernandopartridge said:
Work Christmas do cancelled already due to this variant. It feels like all sense of proportionality has been lost. The email talked about people in wanting to "feel safe", frankly, if feel that way they should just stay at home
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Ours has been cancelled too, but it was actually at the request of the staff rather than a decision by management.
 
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Deleted member 5849

Guest
Italian tries to dodge Covid jab using fake arm
Some may be accused of trying to dodge the system to get a vaccine certificate, but maybe none as resourceful at this Italian man.
He presented health workers in Biella, north-west Italy, with a fake arm made of silicon. But despite its realistic colour, nobody was fooled by the limb.
The man, in his 50s, was reported to local police on Thursday night, AFP news agency reports.
"The case borders on the ridiculous, if it were not for the fact we are talking about a gesture of enormous gravity," the head of the Piedmont regional government, Albert Cirio, said in a statement on Facebook.
Such an act was "unacceptable faced with the sacrifice that our entire community has paid during the pandemic, in terms of human lives, the social and economic cost", he added.
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fernandopartridge

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
My point is really why is it about risk avoidance rather than doing the best you can to carry on with mitigations, eg tell the staff to get vaccinated and take an LFT on the day of the party.

We've not been in the office since March 2020, I suspect some people who work for us have got so little risk appetite they're scared of leaving the house. I mentioned the stupid woman on my team who isolated her own young child in the household.
 
Skybluefaz

Skybluefaz

Well-Known Member
fernandopartridge said:
You'll increasingly see people being sent devices that can link up to a smart phone to monitor blood pressure, the smart phone app will transfer it to the GP record.
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Yeah I studied something related to this for my degree. Wearable tech was being touted as the answer to people having to go for regular check ups for heart conditions. Instead they would go when an anomaly was reported.
 
jimmyhillsfanclub

jimmyhillsfanclub

Well-Known Member

Top class....

Edit: I mean the story of the fake armed Italian posted by NW was top class but my quotes don't seem to be working
 
fernandopartridge

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
Skybluefaz said:
Yeah I studied something related to this for my degree. Wearable tech was being touted as the answer to people having to go for regular check ups for heart conditions. Instead they would go when an anomaly was reported.
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It's everywhere now mate, virtual wards they're called. I bought some (blood pressure monitors, pulse oximeters, spirometers) and the software to go with it.
 
Skybluefaz

Skybluefaz

Well-Known Member
fernandopartridge said:
It's everywhere now mate, virtual wards they're called. I bought some (blood pressure monitors, pulse oximeters, spirometers) and the software to go with it.
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Very much needed as well from what I was reading in terms of where the country is going with heart health. Mate of mine had a blood sugar monitor fitted so he can check his levels on his phone. Says its changed his life.
 
Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Saddlebrains

Saddlebrains

Well-Known Member
Kieranp96 said:
Why would the headline not be good? They're doing there job to protect the nhs.
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How is it good? It says people have the virus who have been double jabbed?

Which we were told was our way out.

If you're trying to get millions of people to have jab 3 it doesn't look great that you can still get the c**t with 2 jabs does it?
 
skybluetony176

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
Saddlebrains said:
How is it good? It says people have the virus who have been double jabbed?

Which we were told was our way out.

If you're trying to get millions of people to have jab 3 it doesn't look great that you can still get the c**t with 2 jabs does it?
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The purpose of a vaccine, any vaccine, is to prepare your immune system. In some people that will give them immunity but immunity isn’t the primary point of a vaccine, any vaccine. The vaccine is preparing people’s immune systems, it’s stopping a huge number of people getting seriously ill and that is a measurement of it working. That and the fact that the vast majority of people who are on ICU haven’t been vaccinated also proves it works.

In short it works. You just don’t seem to have understood the point of a vaccine so have jumped straight to it’s not working.
 
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