You should get involved Nick, I agree with some of your criticisms, (I'm not a member of the trust), but one thing I took away from tonight is they need as many people as possible and a wide range of opinions need to be canvased.What about the bit where the speaker said you can pretty much forget Championship when it was fan owned?
What about the bit where it was said somebody was a troll because they were unhappy about players being sold to break even at a fan owned club?
What about the bit where the supporters direct guy pretty much echo'd the things Fisher says about needing to be break even?
What about when the SD guy said that the trust need to distance themselves and be professional? (he didn't say they weren't now, but that was confirmed just after by the Trust anyway).
What about the bit where the Pompey guy (I think it was) said that things need to be taken on board from fans even if not agreed with?
Plenty of other bits.
Think Fisher knows who he is so would be straight out with it before it had started.
If you're prepared to chuck a grand in for a share I'm sure you'd buy a season ticket but doesn't that make the assumption that 7000 people would buy a share?
Oh cmon let's try and be positive and give him the chance to ask the question and not write it off before the question is asked. I know I'm getting ahead of myself here!!
Trust this Trust that Moz this Moz that Jan said this.Moz was on the phone to Fisher on Saturday, yes he isn't "strictly" SISU but how much of it was discussed with him? Fisher has offered a fans forum that was rejected, take him up on it and at least put things learnt from supports direct to him?
I haven't missed it, I have just watched it?
David Johnson said it didn't he? Saying how it was a way to get the club if they weren't going to sell.
People said about a boycott and everybody on the stage is sat there nodding with it.
Trust this Trust that Moz this Moz that Jan said this.
I can see where this thread is going also Nick.
That's not the same as being there and contributing is it? Whether you like it or not you run this site so should use it responsibly... to just sit at home making click bate comments isn't in the best interests of the fans.
I'm not sure how you can be there and not pick up on a push to boycott.
Dave Johnson talked about it in one sentence and it was in response to a question from the floor. It was also pointed out by the floor that there's no need to organise a boycott as SISU TF are doing a perfectly good job of organising it all by themselves and that is what the panel were nodding in agreement with.
No one is organising a boycott of season tickets. It's an organic response by fans to what is happening at the club. Why you're trying to spin it any other way is mind boggling.
So what have I missed to do with being able to pick the club up in admin, then asking how many people are renewing season tickets and talking about boycotts?
Tell me why I am wrong to get that impression?
It's more relevant than listening to what pompey did, when it's a completely different situation to ours.
The supporters direct is saying you need to have a good relationship with the club, meanwhile trust members sit there firing digs.
Both the speakers have pretty much ruled out the championship under fan ownership, they have said how it needs to be break even. A guy got called a troll because he was moaning about players being sold and not understanding the club need to break even.
Just come back in from the meeting. The talk of boycotts came from people in the crowd, not from the guys on the stage. Should the meeting have been censored so that CCFC fans present couldn't give their views? Also the call to ask for a show of hands as to who were current season ticket holders ( about 75% of those there) and who would not be buying a season ticket next season, came from the floor not the Trust board. It was also mentioned that the Trust had tried on several occasions to engage with Sisu about the possibility of selling the club but all approaches had been angrily rebuffed through solicitors and through Fisher at the SCG. ( Requests were apparently made politely, again through a solicitor) and was not about the Trust buying the club but the general concept of selling the club.
Fan ownership is a great concept but I really struggle to see how we can do it with the unique position we are in. Hopefully the Trust have a workable plan they can share with us.
The Portsmouth fans played a big part in rescuing their club and fair play to them for that but it is vastly different to our situation.
They purchased out of administration and the FL openly stated they would only issue the golden share to a bid involving the trust despite other, higher, bids being made.
The administrator took the former owner to court and got the ground for £3m, the local council then loaned the club the money to buy it.
A local property developer (a Spurs fan so not even a supporter) put in a large amount in return for the club requesting the council remove a usage restriction on land belonging to the club adjacent to Fratton Park, they then sold that land to him and its now a Tesco.
At the point of the takeover they were also still due £9m in parachute payments.
Despite all that and the fans raising £2m they only briefly had majority ownership. Not long afterwards they had to dilute their 51% as more money was needed.
And as you say after that and having over 12K season ticket holders they still can't get out of L2.
Can anyone realistically see us getting 12K for a game, let alone in season tickets, for a third season in L2?
Thing that immediately jumps out to me is £1.2m hospitality income. Anyone who has been to Fratton Park will tell you how poor their facilities are and how unsuitable they are for generating non-matchday income. Really highlights one of the big issues we face.
So to sum up so far:
We need a willing seller;
Important for the Trust to maintain a good relationship with the owner / chairman;
Important to have a council supportive of the football club;
Club would need to run at break even;
Wouldn't be able to compete above L1 / L2 level as clubs spend too much money.
It all sounds very much like the same things Fisher says and gets blasted for.
The trust plan appears to be, and I hope I've got this very wrong, to drive the club into administration, pick it up for next to nothing with no debt and then suddenly there will be 20K in the ground the next week.
We've been down the road of trying to force a change through administration and it failed spectacularly and we know people will turn up for one offs but they don't turn up the next week.
So to sum up so far:
We need a willing seller;
Important for the Trust to maintain a good relationship with the owner / chairman;
Important to have a council supportive of the football club;
Club would need to run at break even;
Wouldn't be able to compete above L1 / L2 level as clubs spend too much money.
It all sounds very much like the same things Fisher says and gets blasted for.
The trust plan appears to be, and I hope I've got this very wrong, to drive the club into administration, pick it up for next to nothing with no debt and then suddenly there will be 20K in the ground the next week.
We've been down the road of trying to force a change through administration and it failed spectacularly and we know people will turn up for one offs but they don't turn up the next week.
Seems you are deluded or couldn't hear properly but was definitely not there
Yes funny they all missed that when the Trust approched Sisu to talk they were rebuffed but are then criticised by people for not wanting to talk.Just come back in from the meeting. The talk of boycotts came from people in the crowd, not from the guys on the stage. Should the meeting have been censored so that CCFC fans present couldn't give their views? Also the call to ask for a show of hands as to who were current season ticket holders ( about 75% of those there) and who would not be buying a season ticket next season, came from the floor not the Trust board. It was also mentioned that the Trust had tried on several occasions to engage with Sisu about the possibility of selling the club but all approaches had been angrily rebuffed through solicitors and through Fisher at the SCG. ( Requests were apparently made politely, again through a solicitor) and was not about the Trust buying the club but the general concept of selling the club.
Yes funny they all missed that when the Trust approched Sisu to talk they were rebuffed but are then criticised by people for not wanting to talk.
What's a click bait comment?
I'd say I'm much more constructive than empty back pats and cheers because somebody says something about Tim Fisher.
Well if you are on about David then he is the chair of the protest group not on the Trust Board.Who said anything about the crowd? I'm talking about the guy on the stage who has insinuated the same thing twice today?
Can people really not see how dangerous even insinuating that is when they would be the ones trying to by it on the cheap? The same as the trust on TV calling for administration last time.
I've also mentioned other points so I am not saying this was what the whole meeting was about, nobody has replied to those yet though
The big difference would be having people in charge of the club who have it's best interests at heart. Do you think the Pompey supporters would go back to the days when their club was run by faceless money men ? They now have the choice of the way forward and who they might allow to invest in their club in future.Thing is though, you listen to Jan pushing it and he talks about the Championship and then the Premier League but then you listen to the speakers and they pretty much rule out the Championship, never mind the Premier League because of the money there. The scenarios they have explained pretty much say you are limited, so the only difference there is going to be is communication with the fans which can only go so far (although it would be very welcome). Players will still need to be sold to balance the books.
They plainly said they were not advocating boycotts and also said that they were working on plans ref viable fan ownership etcIf the trust are listening to the people they had along to the meeting as experts then they need to greatly distance themselves from protests and boycott (anyone else notice Moz get JHW and SBT mixed up at the end, doesn't give a big impression of separation). Need to work on repairing the relationship with Fisher and Sepalla so that civil talks can be held, even if just an informal chat. And need to work out what could be a viable exit strategy for SISU that the Trust has a realistic chance of being able to achieve.
To the supporters they need to put forward a viable plan for running the club should fan ownership be obtaining. I'm not talking cashflow forecasts and every little detail, just a general overview of how the major obstacles will be overcome. We don't want to end up in a position where fans are chucking a grand in thinking we'll be in the PL in 3 or 4 years. It has to be made very clear how fan ownership will work and what is possible. And of course is it a stopping point to getting a new owner.
Stop taking the easy option Nick of sitting back and slagging people off. Do the hard thing and get involved and try and find solutions.
no he never said have a boycott stop lying the fans are voting with there feet next season they don't need to be told by anyone other than their own mind /decisionhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p04nw4hd
2 hours 11 in.
David Johnson going on about a boycott as a scenario as the fans buying the club because they can pick the club up via administration.
Pretty much the same thing as insinuated tonight.
OYou're being selective about what conversations you're covering and then you're quoting sound bites of the conversations you're interested in.
no he never said have a boycott stop lying the fans are voting with there feet next season they don't need to be told by anyone other than their own mind /decision
For me now I'd like to see something from the Trust to outline the major scenarios. Buying from SISU, buying from admin and liquidation. What is required for each and what as supporters we could expect to be the outcome.
There's no way the fans are buying off SISU without some serious investment from wealthy fans so we need to know if they exist and are prepared to basically gift their money or are we just waiting for SISU to put us into administration at some point down the line.
If the clubs not going into admin you have to give SISU an exit strategy. For example Ryton was said to be worth £8m for housing wasn't it. You could say to SISU give us the club and you keep Ryton. Ask the council for a loan to build training facilities to complement those at Warwick Uni, so we'd basically own the same as we do now but also have use of their facilities for the academy. Then pressure can be put on Wasps to give us a better deal as we are potentially fan owned.
Something like that and you might get SISU's interest.
David Johnson of The Jimmy Hill Way, Jan from the Trust. Two different organisations. As the guy from Portsmouth said protest leading organisation needs to be separate from the Trust.I think also is to have 1 voice as a spokesperson. You have David Johnson saying 1 thing, Jan saying about the Premier League, statements on the website etc. It needs some PR and for things to go through others before statements are given out.
probably scared to go, only because of embarrassmentThat's not the same as being there and contributing is it? Whether you like it or not you run this site so should use it responsibly... to just sit at home making click bate comments isn't in the best interests of the fans.
David Johnson of The Jimmy Hill Way, Jan from the Trust. Two different organisations. As the guy from Portsmouth said protest leading organisation needs to be separate from the Trust.
probably scared to go, only because of embarrassment
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