I could forgive him for welcoming a right wing tory, but the rape case shenanigans, not a fucking chance.
What concessions did Cameron make exactly? Vowing to continue austerity and hold a Brexit vote?
Not answering the question but hey HoBrexit and austerity. The entirely of politics.
Not answering the question but hey Ho
Google your own shit if you aren’t old enough to remember 2010 man. But climate, social policy, tax rates, to name but three things that the right wing equivalent of you are currently upset about.
The Tories spent years rehabilitating their image after being right wing nutters so they could get a hearing with the electorate.
This is all very very basic politics. I’m genuinely a bit shocked stating it gets so much push back on here. The cycle is the same for every party: lose election, only base left, they say “be more like us it’s the only way”, lose election even harder, possibly repeat, eventually moderate towards the median voter to get elected again, base claims you’ve sold out, eventually lose election, only base left, they say “be more like us it’s the only way”, and the cycle begins anew.
I assume he’s gotten drunk off Daily Mail approvalThe decision for “Sir Softie” to recruit Elphick is just bizarre.
She is on the right of the Tory party
It’s pissed off many of his own MPs and says what? Labour are the party of the right? Is Baker and Reece Mogg the next two?
Google your own shit if you aren’t old enough to remember 2010 man. But climate, social policy, tax rates, to name but three things that the right wing equivalent of you are currently upset about.
The Tories spent years rehabilitating their image after being right wing nutters so they could get a hearing with the electorate.
This is all very very basic politics. I’m genuinely a bit shocked stating it gets so much push back on here. The cycle is the same for every party: lose election, only base left, they say “be more like us it’s the only way”, lose election even harder, possibly repeat, eventually moderate towards the median voter to get elected again, base claims you’ve sold out, eventually lose election, only base left, they say “be more like us it’s the only way”, and the cycle begins anew.
The decision for “Sir Softie” to recruit Elphick is just bizarre.
She is on the right of the Tory party
It’s pissed off many of his own MPs and says what? Labour are the party of the right? Is Baker and Reece Mogg the next two?
Agree with this. Political parties need to shift sufficiently to secure enough of a proportion of the vote to win the election. As you say, it’s basic politics.
Elphicke’s defection doesn’t reflect this though. All I’m thinking about when I see this and people like Zahawi stepping down at next election (no great shame) is that many politicians are just in it for themselves and lack any principles or willingness to fight for them
Having more MPs is better than having fewer.
Seriously guys, can you just all take ten minutes on here and then we can talk?
Easy peasy politics: How it all works - BBC Bitesize
Easy peasy politics for 11-14 year olds in Wales.www.bbc.co.uk
Shock, likely next foreign sec. doesn't want to piss off potential next us presidentMore good news for the Tory Labour boys -
David Lammy tells US Republicans he can find ‘common cause’ with Trump
In Washington DC speech, shadow foreign secretary says Labour ‘will always work with US, whoever wins’www.theguardian.com
It's absolutely crackers isn't it.
No one is going to have to put a X next to her name. Nobody is going to have to vote for a Labour Party containing Natalie Elphicke.
Everyone in here:
It's absolutely crackers isn't it.
No one is going to have to put a X next to her name. Nobody is going to have to vote for a Labour Party containing Natalie Elphicke.
Everyone in here:
If its "crackers" why are his own MPs pissed off with Sir Softie?
My reply was to BSB claiming the Tories never have to moderate.
On this: Nah it’s a PR play and that’s it. But are you going to turn down the MP for Dover saying the Tories are a bust when stopping boats is their big thing?
She’s gone at the next election. She’s already elected. I really don’t get the pearl clutching.
Literally first post I see opening Twitter.
Why would anyone with principles do that? If Neil Kinnock and Denis Healey took that approach there would not be a Labour Party anymoreIf they're so concerned and so principled I guess they'll be resigning in their droves right?
Or the Labour Party are now the Tory Party under a red rossette with Sir Softie the true new Cameron
For those “let’s win Tories over” people. Can I please ask where the limit is?
Would you take Reece-Mogg? Would a Tommy Robinson endorsement be ok?
I get winning over undecideds and doing damage to your rivals but surely there is a limit to what you take without abandoning your principles.
I don’t see the point in winning if your party contains the views of Rees-Mogg and Robinson though. The point is to win and make the change you want based on what you genuinely believe is best for the country. Not win at any means necessary and end up following the same failed model as the last lot.Yes. I want a Labour government. Ideally I want only Labour MPs and only Labour votes. I believe left wing policies can serve everyone. I think Robinson and Mogg are wrong with their current hypotheses on how to fix society and then signing up for Labour instead would be good news.
You see electoral politics as a badge of honour, I see it as a tool for change. That’s the fundamental difference here.
I don’t see the point in winning if your party contains the views of Rees-Mogg and Robinson though. The point is to win and make the change you want based on what you genuinely believe is best for the country. Not win at any means necessary and end up following the same failed model as the last lot.
I eagerly await to see all of those things in the manifesto. At the moment he flys by the wind so much nobody can be sure.Whoever is in the party signs up for the whip and the manifesto. We are talking about the most left wing Labour leader bar Corbyn since Foot here. Going in promising nationalisation, workers rights, climate action, house building. What principle exactly do you hold so dear it trumps those?
But her defection isn’t enough to make a meaningful difference in a vote if all tories vote with the whip. Having slept on it it makes less sense than it did yesterday. If she’d gone and worked Tice’s company I’d have understood her quitting the Tories, she’s right up their street. No sign she’s had a road to Damascus conversion to the left. I’m not sure who she intended to do the most damage too by defecting. Sunak or Starmer.Having more MPs is better than having fewer.
Seriously guys, can you just all take ten minutes on here and then we can talk?
Easy peasy politics: How it all works - BBC Bitesize
Easy peasy politics for 11-14 year olds in Wales.www.bbc.co.uk
I eagerly await to see all of those things in the manifesto. At the moment he flys by the wind so much nobody can be sure.
My mum is one that has always voted Labour her whole life but said she won’t vote for Starmer because he lacks principle. She’s not some old socialist either. I think it’s a big gamble to be sucking up the rightest of right wingers when you can just convince people of positive change.
But her defection isn’t enough to make a meaningful difference in a vote if all tories vote with the whip. Having slept on it it makes less sense than it did yesterday. If she’d gone and worked Tice’s company I’d have understood her quitting the Tories, she’s right up their street. No sign she’s had a road to Damascus conversion to the left. I’m not sure who she intended to do the most damage too by defecting. Sunak or Starmer.
It's absolutely crackers isn't it.
No one is going to have to put a X next to her name. Nobody is going to have to vote for a Labour Party containing Natalie Elphicke.
Everyone in here:
More good news for the Tory Labour boys -
David Lammy tells US Republicans he can find ‘common cause’ with Trump
In Washington DC speech, shadow foreign secretary says Labour ‘will always work with US, whoever wins’www.theguardian.com
Your second paragraph shows how she will indeed fit right into Kier's Labour partyAgree with this. Political parties need to shift sufficiently to secure enough of a proportion of the vote to win the election. As you say, it’s basic politics.
Elphicke’s defection doesn’t reflect this though. All I’m thinking about when I see this and people like Zahawi stepping down at next election (no great shame) is that many politicians are just in it for themselves and lack any principles or willingness to fight for them
Okay, I’ll get the crayons out too. Sunak’s small boat/Rwanda policy isn’t cutting through except with the biggest frothers who were most likely going to vote for anyone but Labour anyway. The message you’re talking about is being lost anyway in the noise about Labour welcoming a far right nutter into the party with a history of victim blaming and trying to influence legal proceedings. It’s an own goal, a hollow victory, is more negative than positive. A mistake.I’ll break out the crayons and primary colours.
The Tories are making immigration via small boats their tentpole issue.
This is the Tory MP for Dover
Dover is a place on the south coast that is often strongly linked with small boat migration.
Having the MP for the place emblematic of what you say if your big issue defect to the opposition looks bad.
The opposition looking bad depresses their vote and may even improve yours.
Getting more votes than the opposition means the MPs under your whip get elected.
The party that can command the most MPs gets to be the government.
The government gets to enact policy and spend tax money towards its aims and priorities.
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