Do you want to discuss boring politics? (17 Viewers)

[Grendel]

Ah you got me. I'm secretly a life long Tory voter.

Bring back are Boris!

Well

Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics)

Deflect avoid avoid - at least I tried No you didn't- you've just asked loads of questions, you have not made any statement on what you think should happen, you have asked multiple leading questions geared to try and make people feel stupid for the choices they have made, & for some bizarre...

www.skybluestalk.co.uk

 

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[Deleted member 5849]

The objective of me voting is not to vote against the Tories - I am never going to vote for them so it's irrelevant to me if they are worse.

This site is interesting: UK Predictions

This the prediction for my constituency:

View attachment 33941

If by default not voting for the Tories' main opposition means the Tories get in, then effectively you may as well have voted for them however.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Well

Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics)

Deflect avoid avoid - at least I tried No you didn't- you've just asked loads of questions, you have not made any statement on what you think should happen, you have asked multiple leading questions geared to try and make people feel stupid for the choices they have made, & for some bizarre...

www.skybluestalk.co.uk

I'm feeling very much a minority around here in having never voted Tory!

And to think people like to claim this is a lefty area...

 

[PVA]

Well

Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics)

Deflect avoid avoid - at least I tried No you didn't- you've just asked loads of questions, you have not made any statement on what you think should happen, you have asked multiple leading questions geared to try and make people feel stupid for the choices they have made, & for some bizarre...

www.skybluestalk.co.uk

And?

I voted Tory when I was 19 because I was a naive kid who knew nothing of the world and thought they were the good guys because that's what my dad told me.

 

[Grendel]

It is fair to say that Edward Heath would have been called a raging lefty by a fair few on here!

Heath would definitely be a labour politician today.

 

[CCFCSteve]

I'm feeling very much a minority around here in having never voted Tory!

And to think people like to claim this is a lefty area...

That was before you had the opportunity to vote for Leadsom though

 

[Deleted member 5849]

That was before you had the opportunity to vote for Leadsom though

She's not reactionary enough for a sizeable minority in her constituency

 

[Deleted member 9744]

I'm feeling very much a minority around here in having never voted Tory!

And to think people like to claim this is a lefty area...

I have certainly never voted Tory nor for Brexit.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

I have certainly never voted Tory

Solidarity, comrade!

 

[fernandopartridge]

And?

I voted Tory when I was 19 because I was a naive kid who knew nothing of the world and thought they were the good guys because that's what my dad told me.

and the name of my father? Jacob Rees Mogg

 

[PVA]

and the name of my father? Jacob Rees Mogg

'A kinder, gentler politics'.

Piss off.

 

[shmmeee]

Thing is though, Starmer's leadership election was left enough for me. I understand having to ditch a couple of things too but, honestly, what remains?

Not a lot. When running a campaign like he is saying nothing is the safest strategy. But what are you gonna do? Bring back Rebecca Wrong-Daily? Actually fucking listen to me and elect Nandy? The ship has sailed. All that moaning now does is potentially reduce Labours majority, which would make it have to be even more “right wing”

 

[fernandopartridge]

Piss off.

Lighten up Tarquin

 

[Northants Sky Blue]

The GE will be a binary decision between a party containing:

Rees-Mogg, Braverman, Truss (funded by vested interests/dark money)

or

Bryant, Cooper, Phillips (funded by trade unions/publicly declared conations)


Only one could drag the Overton window back to some semblance of normality

 

[PVA]

Lighten up Tarquin

Say what you like about me, I don't really care, just stop bringing my family and my upbringing into it.

 

[shmmeee]

tbf, shmmeee does have a point that the current crop of insane Tories are worse than even a centre-right leaning Labour Party, so that's the point.

Also easier to influence from a position of power than on the margins, so better to start there really.

But I do agree it's frustrating. tbh Starmer's leadership campaign was about right for me - progressive, vaguely left policies dressed up in a respectable intelligent suit who'd shown he could argue well, and ditching the more wild areas of policy and rhetoric for electability. The thrall to focus groups is disappointing, as there has been an opportunity to lead the conversation that hasn't been taken. You'd think a manifesto has to say something about going forward as people do need to be inspired with a bit of hope - Johnson may be an incompetent womaniser, but he's always understood that you offer people promises of hope and things happening, and people vote for you!

Anyway, I reckon my seat will stay Tory regardless (UKIP always seemed to run strongly here too!) so I'll be voting Labour out of tokenism unless somebody really moves me from the margins - and no, it won't be Reform!

The thing is until someone on the left produces an exemplar to follow to get elected that isn’t tacking to the centre, Labour politicians who want to get elected will use the only playbook that’s worked.

 

[shmmeee]

Say what you like about me, I don't really care, just stop bringing my family and my upbringing into it.

Nothing more privileged than being happy to carry on decimating public services and having poverty and homelessness rise so that you don’t have to sully your principles.

 

[PVA]

Nothing more privileged than being happy to carry on decimating public services and having poverty and homelessness rise so that you don’t have to sully your principles.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

The thing is until someone on the left produces an exemplar to follow to get elected that isn’t tacking to the centre, Labour politicians who want to get elected will use the only playbook that’s worked.

I thought Starmer's leadership manifesto was tacking pretty centrally tbh!

 

[shmmeee]

I thought Starmer's leadership manifesto was tacking pretty centrally tbh!

I think that says more about you than the centre of British politics.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

I think that says more about you than the centre of British politics.

Where it currently is as defined by the parties, maybe.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Nothing more privileged than being happy to carry on decimating public services and having poverty and homelessness rise so that you don’t have to sully your principles.

How are the cast iron fiscal rules going to repair public services or address poverty? Please do explain. At the moment the Conservative government runs a budget deficit and always has even with services cut to the bone - Labour is promising to cut that deficit to zero in five years. It has to address revenue spending and a massive capital backlog, how is it going to do it?

 

[shmmeee]

Where it currently is as defined by the parties, maybe.

The parties are defined by the electorate.

 

[shmmeee]

How are the cast iron fiscal rules going to repair public services or address poverty? Please do explain. At the moment the Conservative government runs a budget deficit and always has even with services cut to the bone - Labour is promising to cut that deficit to zero in five years. It has to address revenue spending and a massive capital backlog, how is it going to do it?

Charity bet that by any reasonable metric poverty and homelessness will fall and public service satisfaction will rise within three years of a Labour victory?

 

[Grendel]

The guy who posted it is now a Tory, a conflicted Tory but he doesn’t want a left wing government so sorry Posh Boy there is no life raft there

 

[shmmeee]

The guy who posted it is now a Tory, a conflicted Tory but he doesn’t want a left wing government so sorry Posh Boy there is no life raft there

Harsh on FP

 

[shmmeee]

Charity bet that by any reasonable metric poverty and homelessness will fall and public service satisfaction will rise within three years of a Labour victory?

Grendel is laughing because like FP the idea of measuring political ideology by results is scary to them. Much better to stay in the safety of internet comments where you can claim you’d have solved everything and everyone else is stupid and corrupt.

 

[duffer]

Everyone will have to pay more and generally people don’t want to….like the uproar when the NIC was increased to supplement social care. We all want better services but someone else has to pay

It could be that everyone does have to pay a bit more, but to have that conversation without talking about redistribution is madness.

 

[shmmeee]

Wealth is the key there. But no one wants to tackle that.

I’d be happy as a higher rate income tax payer to pay a bit more. I can afford it and the country is in the toilet, but it’s wealth that really matters.

 

[Grendel]

Grendel is laughing because like FP the idea of measuring political ideology by results is scary to them. Much better to stay in the safety of internet comments where you can claim you’d have solved everything and everyone else is stupid and corrupt.

No I’m laughing about a socialist who started a thread on a football forum to explore if there was a loophole to escape paying higher rate tax.

 

[shmmeee]

No I’m laughing about a socialist who started a thread on a football forum to explore if there was a loophole to escape paying higher rate tax.

My position on tax has always been the same: it’s the governments job to collect it. The idea socialists should pay more than legally required because of their beliefs about what tax legislation should be is some of your more weird bullshit.

 

[Grendel]

My position on tax has always been the same: it’s the governments job to collect it. The idea socialists should pay more than legally required because of their beliefs about what tax legislation should be is some of your more weird bullshit.

No - it was the legally required amount and you wanted to see if loopholes were available so you didn’t pay it. Classic Tory ideology. Just own what you now are. Your beliefs are in the dustbin.

 

[PVA]

The guy who posted it is now a Tory, a conflicted Tory but he doesn’t want a left wing government so sorry Posh Boy there is no life raft there

There's only one person in here who likes to portray themselves as a posh boy.

 

[Grendel]

There's only one person in here who likes to portray themselves as a posh boy.

I came from a council estate and went to a failing comp and was only one of a handful who went to Uni.

My family all voted labour - oddly at 18 I could think for myself - unlike you it seems

 

[shmmeee]

No - it was the legally required amount and you wanted to see if loopholes were available so you didn’t pay it. Classic Tory ideology. Just own what you now are. Your beliefs are in the dustbin.

I wasn’t looking to break the law Grendel. I was asking what the tax law was.

Tax evasion is a moral failing, tax avoidance is a government failing. You just think the plebs shouldn’t be allowed to use the same tax law as everyone else.