Do you want to discuss boring politics? (43 Viewers)

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Nuskyblue

Nuskyblue

Well-Known Member
Brighton Sky Blue said:
It gives the wrong impression and makes it seem simpler than it is. It’s emphatically not the thing to tell someone trying to lose weight.
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At a nuts an bolts level ot sort of is that easy but I know what you mean, there is more to it than that. Some really struggle with it. There is so much info out there it can be bewildering and probably overwhelming.
 
Sick Boy

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
Brighton Sky Blue said:
This is an age where people are handsomely rewarded for recording themselves making disgusting eating noises on the internet.

In my own case, as a postgraduate student and my wife working full time we are eligible for £0 in support for childcare costs. So I suppose come not too long we’ll burn through our savings courtesy of that and a £300 monthly mortgage increase.

It’s OK, we’ll just be in the ‘bone idle’ category.
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Apart from the wealthy, the majority of people have savings because they’ve worked hard or made sacrifices, including not having children.
 
MalcSB

MalcSB

Well-Known Member
Nuskyblue said:
I have an electric car, every mile I drive is taxed at 20%, as would anyone that is unable to charge at home (which is >50% off the population).
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The problem is you don’t pay VED ( road fund tax) which is what the road pricing would be needed to make up for. Why should ICE drivers pay bot?
 
MalcSB

MalcSB

Well-Known Member
fernandopartridge said:
They are not paying the train drivers, they don't employ them. I suspect that the franchise agreements require that the DfT has to approve the award but not pay it.

In any event, it isn't train drivers vs other workers or pensioners. The standalone point is strong enough, the government has decided to cut benefits for elderly people on the eve of winter and ahead of a forthcoming rise in the price of energy.
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That’s not entirely true. From the BBC

“The government believes the majority of funding for a pay offer for train drivers will come from train operating company budgets.

Ministers intend to set out where the rest of the money will come from at the Budget in October.

It is understood ministers believe most of the funding can come from money already budgeted for pay rises since 2022.

But the government has not provided figures to back this up.

It also leaves open the option that taxpayers pick up part of the pay bill at a time where other services are being cut to save money.”

What a surprise, no figures provided to back up their assertion that the companies will be able to cover the costs. I think that since covid the government covers train companies overspends: in any event this government intends to privatise rail so will have responsibility for all associated financial matters.

The attached shows that £11.9 billion of government money supported the rail industry in 2023

Regulator’s report shows rail industry continues recovery from the pandemic with increased fares revenue and reduced government support | Office of Rail and Road

The Office of Rail and Road (ORR) has today published its annual Rail Industry Finance (UK) statistical report.
www.orr.gov.uk www.orr.gov.uk
 
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duffer

duffer

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
The numbers in fuel poverty decreased last year because of insulation efforts and increased income outweighing energy cost increases.

There are genuine issues with a small number just above the threshold clearly. That doesn’t change the fact that giving Elton John £300 a year isn’t a wise use of public funds.

Pensioners are doing well. Far far better than when the WFP was introduced. They are insulated from housing costs and have income guaranteed to rise above everyone else’s in perpetuity. Reducing their benefits isn’t akin to murdering them and I’d take you a lot more seriously if you felt that way about working age benefits too, who have none of those advantages.
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Not all pensioners are insulated from housing costs. Some pay rent, some have mortgages.

In itself that doesn't put them on pension credit, if you weren't aware.

As with most things, the ones with the least will have the poorer, least insulated housing, and no mechanism for improving it. Not being on pension credit does not equate to rich.

There might well be a reasonable case for altering who gets the WFA, but this blanket approach is ill considered and unnecessarily cruel.

To do it without even considering the impact, is frankly, callous.

Again, if the Tories had done this in the last government, then politely, I seriously doubt you'd be making the same arguments.

www.theguardian.com

We did not do impact assessment of winter fuel payment cut, No 10 admits

Spokesperson for Keir Starmer says focus was instead on encouraging pensioners to seek additional support
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
duffer said:
Not all pensioners are insulated from housing costs. Some pay rent, some have mortgages.

In itself that doesn't put them on pension credit, if you weren't aware.

As with most things, the ones with the least will have the poorer, least insulated housing, and no mechanism for improving it. Not being on pension credit does not equate to rich.

There might well be a reasonable case for altering who gets the WFA, but this blanket approach is ill considered and unnecessarily cruel.

To do it without even considering the impact, is frankly, callous.

Again, if the Tories had done this in the last government, then politely, I seriously doubt you'd be making the same arguments.

www.theguardian.com

We did not do impact assessment of winter fuel payment cut, No 10 admits

Spokesperson for Keir Starmer says focus was instead on encouraging pensioners to seek additional support
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
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I’d argue that if being just above the fuel poverty line without pension credit then the pension credit threshold is too low regardless of the winter fuel payment. But right now 25% of recipients of it are literal millionaires and that can’t be right either.
 
Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
fernandopartridge said:
Parliament needs to be moved away from London and its city-driven opulence to bring MPs into the real world.
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Definitely. Should be moved around the country. Could get cities to bid for it - City of Cu*ture.

Personally I think it should be forced to go to a place that is deprived. Get them to see the reality. Plus it'd help regenerate the places.
 
Nuskyblue

Nuskyblue

Well-Known Member
MalcSB said:
The problem is you don’t pay VED ( road fund tax) which is what the road pricing would be needed to make up for. Why should ICE drivers pay bot?
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Tbh I've not paid road tax for ages now, they used to do it based on emissions didn't they, I'm fairly sure the last car I owned I had to pay something like £30 a year on. I'm guessing this is no longer the case?

Personally I think tax should be calculated by cost when new, size and weight. That seems fair to me.
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
Definitely. Should be moved around the country. Could get cities to bid for it - City of Cu*ture.

Personally I think it should be forced to go to a place that is deprived. Get them to see the reality. Plus it'd help regenerate the places.
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Some of the most deprived areas in the UK are in London, it hasn’t helped them.
 
fernandopartridge

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
Gynnsthetonic said:
View attachment 38435
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It's funny how a lot of right wingers have woken up to the impact of austerity now the 'other side' is doing it. One study found that it had killed about 190k people between 2010 and 2019.

blogs.lse.ac.uk

The cost of austerity: How UK public spending cuts led to 190,000 excess deaths

The austerity measures introduced by the UK government in 2010 had severe consequences for the British population. Yonatan Berman and Tora Hovland find that these spending cuts cost the average per…
blogs.lse.ac.uk blogs.lse.ac.uk
 
Como

Como

Well-Known Member
Nuskyblue said:
Tbh I've not paid road tax for ages now, they used to do it based on emissions didn't they, I'm fairly sure the last car I owned I had to pay something like £30 a year on. I'm guessing this is no longer the case?

Personally I think tax should be calculated by cost when new, size and weight. That seems fair to me.
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Where I am it is based on the original list price discounted for age. Weight makes sense as the heavier the vehicle the more damage is done, but that would hit EVs.
 
Gynnsthetonic

Gynnsthetonic

Well-Known Member
fernandopartridge said:
It's funny how a lot of right wingers have woken up to the impact of austerity now the 'other side' is doing it. One study found that it had killed about 190k people between 2010 and 2019.

blogs.lse.ac.uk

The cost of austerity: How UK public spending cuts led to 190,000 excess deaths

The austerity measures introduced by the UK government in 2010 had severe consequences for the British population. Yonatan Berman and Tora Hovland find that these spending cuts cost the average per…
blogs.lse.ac.uk blogs.lse.ac.uk
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They're all as bad as each other, I saw a video of Sir Kier the other day chatting to an old lady before being elected about how she can't afford to put the heating on and how disgusted he was. I don't trust any of them
 
MalcSB

MalcSB

Well-Known Member
Nuskyblue said:
Tbh I've not paid road tax for ages now, they used to do it based on emissions didn't they, I'm fairly sure the last car I owned I had to pay something like £30 a year on. I'm guessing this is no longer the case?

Personally I think tax should be calculated by cost when new, size and weight. That seems fair to me.
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That would ma’e EVs pretty expensive. There’s already an additional tax f9r the first 5 years if the cars list price is over £40,000.
 
MalcSB

MalcSB

Well-Known Member
Como said:
Where I am it is based on the original list price discounted for age. Weight makes sense as the heavier the vehicle the more damage is done, but that would hit EVs.
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Trouble is, it’s fuck all to do with maintaining roads these days hence it’s called Vehicle Exise Duty and not Road Fund Tax.
 
MalcSB

MalcSB

Well-Known Member
They won’t release the books which reveal what comprises the alleged £22 billion black hole. They haven’t been in the oven long enough yet.
 
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Nuskyblue

Nuskyblue

Well-Known Member
MalcSB said:
That would ma’e EVs pretty expensive. There’s already an additional tax f9r the first 5 years if the cars list price is over £40,000.
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The sounds coming from the manufacturers make it seem like they're not viable commercially.

We'll all have to drive the cheap imports from China at this rate!
 
MalcSB

MalcSB

Well-Known Member
Nuskyblue said:
The sounds coming from the manufacturers make it seem like they're not viable commercially.

We'll all have to drive the cheap imports from China at this rate!
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People don't want them. Most manufacturers have abandoned their ambitions for 100% EV production by 2030/35.
 
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