Fisher on new stadium (7 Viewers)

[steveecov]

Stubbornness Is Sinking Us .....SISU


Hoisted by their own petard....never more apt..

 

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[Deleted member 5849]

It's very hard to make a case, financially, for the new stadium.

For that matter, the very fact the case comes down to finances shows that SISU have, in a way, won.

And that football is dead.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

But the fact is the facts and figures don't add up with ccfc involved in a scrap for league 1 status.

Seems to for Scunthorpe.

 

[Jack Griffin]

For that matter, the very fact the case comes down to finances shows that SISU have, in a way, won.

And that football is dead.

Leaving it for someone else to breath life into an almost cold body?

 

[Grendel]

Nah they would just be sensible and do a deal with Wasps. Hopefully not having all that luggage would allow them to be trusted

Grow up - you are embarrassing yourself. There is no deal and never will be a deal.

 

[Grendel]

Seems to for Scunthorpe.

Also Bristol rovers who have now received plannimg permission for a 21,000 seater stadium also York

 

[Ian1779]

That plan has more holes than Oscar Pitourius' bathroom door.

I'll keep asking the same question from the start of this: what actual figures do you expect? It's easy to go "revenues" and hope for the best, but seriously how much cash do you think we'll make? How much more would we have to spend on players after rent?

Personally until I see even fag packet figures its pie in the sky.

If it was that easy to increase revenue every club in the league would be doing it. There must be a reason they're not. And if they are it won't give us a competitive advantage as claimed.

Maybe my rough plan has lots of holes in it... but it's rough and does show an idea of what could be done.

What it does show is that a new owner would have those kind of decisions to take.... unless they were happy chucking millions and millions at the club with no intention of getting it back. We are very very unlikely to get one of those owners.

 

[Kingokings204]

Seems to for Scunthorpe.

Go on? I will listen

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

Ah, it's easy to just "do a deal with Wasps" then, is it? They'll be quite happy to give away their revenues will they? They're loss making (yes, they are MMM), their crowds are falling and they have a big loan to pay back. I wouldn't hold my breath over a deal with Wasps.

What evidence do you have that Wasps are currently still loss making?

 

[Grendel]

What evidence do you have that Wasps are currently still loss making?

Given they have made a purchase of a management company, were £14 million in debt before the take over, used to charge an average of £25 per head to watch a game and own a management company that had 10% profit margin you'd be pretty dumb to think otherwise.

 

[skybluetony176]

Given they have made a purchase of a management company, were £14 million in debt before the take over, used to charge an average of £25 per head to watch a game and own a management company that had 10% profit margin you'd be pretty dumb to think otherwise.

What was the JLR sponsorship deal worth to them that they attracted after taking over at the Ricoh?

 

[Broken Hearted Sky Blue]

Hey Tim I've got a great idea just came to me how about we try to engage with the fans give them something to cheer about, you know and try and get another 10000 in the ground sorry Tim forgot 4 pies a bovril and two weddings are worth a lot more,what was I thinking:facepalm:

OK.OK got another one how about a shop where we could sell all sorts of stuff the fans would like to buy,we could do what other football clubs do,yes I'm sure I've seen it at away grounds revolutionary you know a shop at the ground sorry Tim forgot thats so yesterday,I know I'll try to come back with something more realistic.

I've got it now Tim how about we phone Rhodri,there must be somebody we haven't taken to court,sorry it took so long Tim bit slow on the uptake.

 

[Grendel]

What was the JLR sponsorship deal worth to them that they attracted after taking over at the Ricoh?

It's not jlr is it and it's hardly going to be £14 million either is it?

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

Given they have made a purchase of a management company, were £14 million in debt before the take over, used to charge an average of £25 per head to watch a game and own a management company that had 10% profit margin you'd be pretty dumb to think otherwise.

So you have no evidence whatsoever that it's currently loss making? It's guess work, eh?

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

So you have no evidence whatsoever that it's currently loss making? It's guess work, eh?

It's more common sense than guess work.

 

[Grendel]

So you have no evidence whatsoever that it's currently loss making? It's guess work, eh?

Well only in the sense I will not be landing on Mars tomorrow or that CCFC are now making £100 million profit

Still - it's if interest you only now post in defence of your new friends.

Seems the peasants are revolting as well looking at the forums expressing disgust at the freebies being handed out.

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

It's more common sense than guess work.

No its not. You don't know. I don't know. Grendel has got so many things wrong over the years, I'm not taking his word for it.

The Wasps people I speak to are very, very pleased with the way things are looking

 

[Broken Hearted Sky Blue]

Seems to for Scunthorpe.

It did for Darlington as well didn't it? Mind you they are moving back to another new ground.

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

Well only in the sense I will not be landing on Mars tomorrow or that CCFC are now making £100 million profit

Still - it's if interest you only now post in defence of your new friends.

Seems the peasants are revolting as well looking at the forums expressing disgust at the freebies being handed out.

I'm not defending anyone. Just pulling people up when they state 'facts' that are simply opinion. Caveat some of these statements with 'I think' and I have no issue with them

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

No its not. You don't know. I don't know. Grendel has got so many things wrong over the years, I'm not taking his word for it.

The Wasps people I speak to are very, very pleased with the way things are looking

Right and ready to leave Coventry when a more lucrative venue becomes available no doubt.

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

No its not. You don't know. I don't know. Grendel has got so many things wrong over the years, I'm not taking his word for it.

The Wasps people I speak to are very, very pleased with the way things are looking

Are they very pleased with it in the same way that the council said ACL was very profitable after the football club left?

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

Are they very pleased with it in the same way that the council said ACL was very profitable after the football club left?

That's irrelevant. What an idiotic statement

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

That's irrelevant. What an idiotic statement

It's not, people have been wrong (I would say lied but you will probably take issue with that) about the profitability of ACL in the past so the fact that you've been told its going very well holds little credibility.

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

I'm not defending anyone. Just pulling people up when they state 'facts' that are simply opinion. Caveat some of these statements with 'I think' and I have no issue with them

So do you go around pulling people up on stating there opinions as facts all the time? Its funny how you only seem to do it when it's something negative about ACL or Wasps is posted, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you missed the other 99% of posts whilst you were doing your patrol.

 

[skybluetony176]

It's not jlr is it and it's hardly going to be £14 million either is it?

Isn't it? Who is it then?

I'm not suggesting it is going to pay off the debt but what it does show is that Wasps are clearly more marketable now they have a permanent home in a top class stadium and likewise it's probably fair to say that the same goes for the Ricoh by having a top class Rugby team as a permanent resident raising it's profile all across Europe. Its easy to see how both businesses are going to and have benefited from each others presence.

 

[chiefdave]

No its not. You don't know. I don't know.

You make it sound like people are making wild claims. The available evidence such as previous Wasps accounts, previous ACL accounts, availability of free tickets etc makes it highly unlikely they are now making a profit. That's not anyone saying they won't make a profit in the future just that they aren't now.

If I was Wasps I'd be very concerned. No one in their right mind would suggest that they were intending to give out this many free tickets over such a large number of matches. In fact many 'experts' pointed to the Saracens game as an example of a huge game that wouldn't need freebies yet even with thousands of free tickets available it was less than half full.

They are devaluing their product and you only have to take a brief look at their own forum to see it is having an impact. Posts saying things like what is the point of buying a ticket. Next season will be vital for them. Without the free transport and F&B to existing ST holders, which isn't sustainable over the long term, they will have to convert locals to ST holders in big numbers, problem is pretty much every local person who is attending is getting used to being given a free ticket every game, will they go back when they have to pay? It's a big gamble and one that could yet backfire on Wasps.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Isn't it? Who is it then?

Given it was a no comment thanks to commercial confidentiality as to when the Ricoh deal actually expired...

 

[steveecov]

For that matter, the very fact the case comes down to finances shows that SISU have, in a way, won.

And that football is dead.

Just real football NW. You'll still have your prima donna loving, plastic, 2 dimensional type. SISU have done to us what SKY did to real football. R.I.P

 

[stupot07]

No its not. You don't know. I don't know. Grendel has got so many things wrong over the years, I'm not taking his word for it.

The Wasps people I speak to are very, very pleased with the way things are looking

Eastwood told the SBT it would take 3-4 years for them to break even. So yes, common sense tells us they are still making a loss.

Unless it's another one of his embellishments.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Just real football NW. You'll still have your prima donna loving, plastic, 2 dimensional type. SISU have done to us what SKY did to real football. R.I.P

Real football still exists elsewhere, though Richard Scudamore doesn't want you to know about it. If Sky keep calling it the best league on the planet then it must be so.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Eastwood told the SBT it would take 3-4 years for them to break even. So yes, common sense tells us they are still making a loss.

Unless it's another one of his embellishments.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

He did also say that it wasn't franchising so a bucket of salt needed on what he says Stu.

 

[shmmeee]

Seems to for Scunthorpe.

Just the man. Give me some examples of clubs who have gone from renting to owning their own grounds. Preferably clubs that publish their accounts for free I know you've mentioned some before. Ideally ones in their new ground not ones planning to move in.

I'm having no luck from the Wiki page of ground developments, most seem to have been funded by someone else (Donny I think) or were redevelopments of existing grounds they owned.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Just the man. Give me some examples of clubs who have gone from renting to owning their own grounds. Preferably clubs that publish their accounts for free I know you've mentioned some before. Ideally ones in their new ground not ones planning to move in.

I'm having no luck from the Wiki page of ground developments, most seem to have been funded by someone else (Donny I think) or were redevelopments of existing grounds they owned.

CCFC bought the freehold for HR back in the pre-war(?) days, of that counts

tbf it was usually a desire to own rather than actual ownership It's easier to give examples of clubs who no onger own their ground and decline, although whether the loss of the ground is the symptom or the cause is a moot point.

Not sure if Plymouth just got a lease on Home Park, or if they bought it cheap off their council back in the day. It worked out well for them under Stephenson, until they then sold out and went through exactly the same again!

Brighton are an obvious choice!

Rotherham too...

Bournemouth sold their ground in the mid 2000s, think they bought it back (they certainly intended to).

Leicester of course had their ground owned by a Pensin fund, and is now owned by a prop-co

Molyneux was all set to become an Asda in the mid 80s, and was bought back by the club (I think!)

Can't be arsed to check the ownership of Chesterfield and COlchester's stadiums, but you might like to... along with Oxford and whether they ever actually bought it back off Kassam.

Then there's Crystal Palace, who now do indeed own the Selhurts Park freehold (I think!)

All a bit rough and ready but hey, I'm ill and it's late-ish.

 

[shmmeee]

Cheers, some late night research when the kid inevitably gets me up again.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

If in doubt, grounds tend to move in and out of club ownership remarkably frequently!

Could also add Northampton, who got a massive lease off their council for Sixfields, allowing them to redevelop in a half-arsed manner.