General Election 2019 thread (23 Viewers)

[Astute]

personal. Debt. Is. Not. Like. National. Debt.

Also LOL at “77%” as if you’ve got a figure that exact.

So you know better than the world bank?

Long term debt is the point.

Ah America. The place they can afford to look after their own people as you like to keep showing us.........

So what you are saying is you think we can look after people here and have our debt to GDP go shooting up as well? Currently 5% of the government budget.. 48 billion a year goes on interest payments. How high would you like this to go?

 

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[SBAndy]

OK. How about your take on government debt? Is it good that 5% of the whole budget goes on interest alone on the present debt?

Is it good that we stand at 81% of GDP when the internationally recognised amount manageable is 77% and Labour have promised to spend hundreds of billions?

What do you know to show the experts wrong? Found this for you.

What the Debt-to-GDP Ratio Tells Us

Will put a paragraph of it here for you so you can see it.

A study by the World Bank found that countries whose debt-to-GDP ratios exceeds 77% for prolonged periods, experience significant slowdowns in economic growth. Pointedly: every percentage point of debt above this level costs countries 1.7% in economic growth. This phenomenon is even more pronounced in emerging markets, where each additional percentage point of debt over 64%, annually slows growth by 2%.

Latest figures available in June 2019 (as per the ONS) show us to actually be at 84% debt-to-GDP ratio. Why is it you’re acting as though the Tories haven’t announced spending plans of their own? Since 2010 they’ve seen government borrowing increase from around 60% to 84%, all the while slashing budgets all over the shop, and this is the party you keep telling us are financially responsible and clean up after Labour. It’s bullshit, frankly.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Fair play Boris, dunno how many more times he needs to say it

It's semantics.

 

[Astute]

Latest figures available in June 2019 (as per the ONS) show us to actually be at 84% debt-to-GDP ratio. Why is it you’re acting as though the Tories haven’t announced spending plans of their own? Since 2010 they’ve seen government borrowing increase from around 60% to 84%, all the while slashing budgets all over the shop, and this is the party you keep telling us are financially responsible and clean up after Labour. It’s bullshit, frankly.

Can you remind me what kind if economy did the Tories take over? What would the national debt be like if there hadn't been cuts? And before you start I don't agree with all the cuts.

So the spending plans of Labour are sensible?

The Tories are full of shit. They have to offer a carrot. Labour have offered much more. Even free internet for the rich. Labour have offered so much that the experts in each field they have plans for gave said it can't be done in the timescale given. So are they being over ambitious, don't know what they are doing.....or even lying like the Tories?

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Whatever gets the pork pies to America fastest!!!!

Well Trump and Johnson are the two biggest pork pie salesmen in the world right now.

 

[Astute]

Well Trump and Johnson are the two biggest pork pie salesmen in the world right now.

They make a good pair. Neither respected or believed by the public but somehow run their countries. The world is becoming a mess.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Trustworthiness: Corbyn 48 Johnson 38
In touch with ordinary people: Corbyn 57 Johnson 29
Likeability: Corbyn 36 Johnson 55
Overall performance: Statistical tie

In other words fatty cracking off jokes matters more than honesty and relating to the average person.

They could just be cracking off and their fanclubs would still vote for them!

 

[Astute]

They could just be cracking off and their fanclubs would still vote for them!

The problem is neither of them have much opposition.

Trump....let's build a wall.

Boris....let's get Brexit done.

And people vote for them :shifty:

 

[Ian1779]

There are more food banks than McDonalds in the UK.

Another Tory masterclass....

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

If you go into a hospital you will see most people are not old.

If you're sitting in A&E/Casualty yes. On the wards it's very different.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Boris is a blundering, mixed up so and so....but someone is pulling his strings.

Yes, a disaster capitalist who has no concern for society or public well-being, just his own bank balance.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

OK. How about your take on government debt? Is it good that 5% of the whole budget goes on interest alone on the present debt?

Is it good that we stand at 81% of GDP when the internationally recognised amount manageable is 77% and Labour have promised to spend hundreds of billions?

What do you know to show the experts wrong? Found this for you.

What the Debt-to-GDP Ratio Tells Us

Will put a paragraph of it here for you so you can see it.

A study by the World Bank found that countries whose debt-to-GDP ratios exceeds 77% for prolonged periods, experience significant slowdowns in economic growth. Pointedly: every percentage point of debt above this level costs countries 1.7% in economic growth. This phenomenon is even more pronounced in emerging markets, where each additional percentage point of debt over 64%, annually slows growth by 2%.

It's the equivalent of the gearing ratio in business analysis and the acceptable level changes over time dependent on what you can borrow at and also has an upward trend due to perception and availability of debt.

In years gone by people looked upon debt in any form as a terrible thing (maybe partly due to strong religious beliefs). That has steadily changed with people accepting debt for mortgages due to the capital investment making it worthwhile but this has since skyrocketed and now people use debt to pay for everyday things and the availability has also gone through the roof, first with loans, then credit cards, then payday lenders. It used to be needing to meet your bank manager and assessing what the debt was for etc, now it's a few clicks of a button and an algorithm.

That's personal debt, but it's worth remembering that the people who benefited from this are now those in charge and their perception of debt has been altered by it so when it comes to making decisions on acceptable debt levels to GDP their going to look at it far more favourably than their forebears ever would.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Fair play Boris, dunno how many more times he needs to say it

Dunno. How many times did he say there would definitely be no border in the Irish Sea or customs checks? He's still repeating 40 new hospitals and 50k new nurses even though one has been totally debunked and the other has no evidence for whatsoever. He's even mentioned the £350m on the side of the bus recently!

Judge someone by their actions, not their words. Alexander's actions show him to be a liar, so why wouldn't he be lying? Someone resigned yesterday because they "could no longer peddle half-truths". As I've said before I don't the "NHS" as a whole is up for sale, just every part of it will be on the table separately. As someone one here said I've sold the engine, wheels, brakes, steering and bodywork of the car. I HAVEN'T sold the car......

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Shame Farage isn’t doing better tbh, he’d be the best leader out of all of them....

would be a pointless vote as the polls suggest the brexit party are doing shite

He’s not even standing as an mp. Populist shyster

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

There are more food banks than McDonalds in the UK.

Another Tory masterclass....

Good to see food standards are improving them!

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

You and the dullard who made the meme don't understand PFI (the Tory designed system).
The worst thing New Labour did was embrace PFI but they did it to appease the ridiculous right wing press obsessed with keeping public spending down, as by its nature PFI stays off the treasury balance sheet.

We are looking at it with the benefit of hindsight. PFI at the time was seen as this great way of capital investment in new hospitals/schools etc. Most of the papers were firmly behind it, including our own local rag when Walsgrave was rebuilt.

It's also worth remembering that the Labour party at the time were under Blair. The left of the party at the time were opposed to it saying the private sector won't be doing this for nothing and while we're not paying for it now we will pay for it later because they'll be wanting a nice fat profit. It's also had the problem of moving the payment from capital expenditure into everyday spending so the budgets of the hospitals themselves have to take into account these payments, directly taking spending away from front-line services.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Frankie Boyle’s election countdown: 'You’ll be praying they prorogue the next parliament'

 

[Astute]

There are more food banks than McDonalds in the UK.

Another Tory masterclass....

And Germany helps even more people than the UK does. So what is going on?

 

[Ian1779]

And Germany helps even more people than the UK does. So what is going on?

Neoliberalism - it’s shit.

 

[SeaSeeEffCee]

Hope none of you Tory voters have disabled kids or have any mates with disabled kids

 

[Astute]

It's the equivalent of the gearing ratio in business analysis and the acceptable level changes over time dependent on what you can borrow at and also has an upward trend due to perception and availability of debt.

In years gone by people looked upon debt in any form as a terrible thing (maybe partly due to strong religious beliefs). That has steadily changed with people accepting debt for mortgages due to the capital investment making it worthwhile but this has since skyrocketed and now people use debt to pay for everyday things and the availability has also gone through the roof, first with loans, then credit cards, then payday lenders. It used to be needing to meet your bank manager and assessing what the debt was for etc, now it's a few clicks of a button and an algorithm.

That's personal debt, but it's worth remembering that the people who benefited from this are now those in charge and their perception of debt has been altered by it so when it comes to making decisions on acceptable debt levels to GDP their going to look at it far more favourably than their forebears ever would.

High debt isn't good for anyone or anything. As I said we are having to pay 48 billion a year in interest alone. That miney comes out of the budget that pays for everything. So £1 out of every £20 to run all services and everything else goes to paying interest. How many hospitals would 48 billion pay for?

 

[Otis]

It's semantics.

Or, as with the Labour Party...
Anti-semantics.

 

[chiefdave]

Interesting that Labour beat the Greens
Labour 'beats other parties on climate change'

 

[chiefdave]

Three more Conservative candidates in trouble for anti-semitism, think thats five now not including Johnson's anit-semitic novel.
Tories investigate three candidates over alleged antisemitism

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Ah yes accusing him of being racist, typical leftie behaviour..... my dad is foreign and I’m half polish yet I still think he’s the best candidate.... just no point in voting for them sadly

Never used the word racist, just he’s on the record with his views that those from Eastern Europe are of ‘lower class’

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

High debt isn't good for anyone or anything. As I said we are having to pay 48 billion a year in interest alone. That miney comes out of the budget that pays for everything. So £1 out of every £20 to run all services and everything else goes to paying interest. How many hospitals would 48 billion pay for?

No it isn't, the point is that was is considered 'high debt' changes over time. Also what is an acceptable level depends on what you're spending on - if it's day-to-day spending then IMO any deficit is bad, infrastructure and investment far more acceptable and in cases of recession etc should even be encouraged to a degree..

Like getting a £10k loan for a car to help you with work rather than a £10k loan for a holiday of a lifetime.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Three more Conservative candidates in trouble for anti-semitism, think thats five now not including Johnson's anit-semitic novel.
Tories investigate three candidates over alleged antisemitism

Tumbleweed

 

[Otis]

Three more Conservative candidates in trouble for anti-semitism, think thats five now not including Johnson's anit-semitic novel.
Tories investigate three candidates over alleged antisemitism

Investigate? What happened to out first bounce?

 

[Grendel]

Investigate? What happened to out first bounce?

well I guess even investigating would be unique from a labour perspective

 

[Astute]

No it isn't, the point is that was is considered 'high debt' changes over time. Also what is an acceptable level depends on what you're spending on - if it's day-to-day spending then IMO any deficit is bad, infrastructure and investment far more acceptable and in cases of recession etc should even be encouraged to a degree..

Like getting a £10k loan for a car to help you with work rather than a £10k loan for a holiday of a lifetime.

10k car loan is good?

And here you have it. Everyone has a different idea on what is good and what is bad.

My car cost me 3k. It was up for more but cash under their nose was too much to resist. Is now 11 years old. Never had a problem. Never failed an MOT. Cheap to run for the size. Could have bought a new one for about 30k though.

So what better could a 10k car do?

 

[stupot07]

Hope none of you Tory voters have disabled kids or have any mates with disabled kids

C*nts. That makes me so angry.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

10k car loan is good?

And here you have it. Everyone has a different idea on what is good and what is bad.

My car cost me 3k. It was up for more but cash under their nose was too much to resist. Is now 11 years old. Never had a problem. Never failed an MOT. Cheap to run for the size. Could have bought a new one for about 30k though.

So what better could a 10k car do?

My car cost me £4k a decade ago and is still running, but will need replacing soon. The point was that if you're using it for work (and the type of work and if it involves a lot of journeys esp with passengers) it would still be sensible for a car to get something a bit newer and likely to last a bit longer. £10k on a car these days isn't seen as a huge amount. Maybe it was just the work I used to be in but sadly there are some who would get their first impression from the vehicle and an old car, regardless of working condition, would affect their decision as it'd be seen as a window into how well you're business is doing and thus your ability to do that job.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

well I guess even investigating would be unique from a labour perspective

Must have sore arms from all this moving of goalposts

 

[Mcbean]

Will this thread be locked 24 hours before the 12th so there’s no more please

 

[Otis]

Will this thread be locked 24 hours before the 12th so there’s no more please

Oh, you need to get the browser I have I think. What browser are you using?

With mine I can just choose to not look or follow threads and they are not compulsory reading.