How awful is this... (3 Viewers)

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chiefdave

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
This is one of those things where I struggle to comprehend what I'm reading. I guess sometimes you have to just come to the conclusion there's some deeply evil people out there.

That seems a low sentence given the judges comments, surely that can't be the top end of the sentencing guidelines for something as horrific as this.
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
chiefdave said:
This is one of those things where I struggle to comprehend what I'm reading. I guess sometimes you have to just come to the conclusion there's some deeply evil people out there.

That seems a low sentence given the judges comments, surely that can't be the top end of the sentencing guidelines for something as horrific as this.
Click to expand...

Trigger warning this is a fucking horrific read, but looks like it’s the lowest possible sentence for this, but reading the categories it would be a lower category.

Rape of a child under 13 – Sentencing

www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk

Same old issue with prison space, but really don’t get things like rape and murder having such low sentences. Build a big old nonce prison and lock them all up for life.
 
Sky Blue Pete

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
Trigger warning this is a fucking horrific read, but looks like it’s the lowest possible sentence for this, but reading the categories it would be a lower category.

Rape of a child under 13 – Sentencing

www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk

Same old issue with prison space, but really don’t get things like rape and murder having such low sentences. Build a big old nonce prison and lock them all up for life.
Click to expand...
That’s really useful
Don’t know how you think that would work shmmeee. I need some members of the board for the prison I volunteer at come and work with me and I’ll show you the issues of just locking people away for life
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sky Blue Pete said:
Really?
it’s a sickening crime and there is no defending what he’s done and the damage to the youngster in question but you think the solution is torture?
Help me of this train
Click to expand...

The solution clearly is not to let him out in 3 years
 
Sky Blue Pete

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
Grendel said:
The solution clearly is not to let him out in 3 years
Click to expand...
Well I hope for all he is because that would hopefully show he’s accepted his actions were horrific, the impact on the girl, he’s understood why he behaved in that way and how not to in the future
He would also be service the 3 years under license in the community rather than the expense of him being in prison
Again not defending his abhorrent actions or the impact on the girl and her friends and family but how long do you reckon you’d survive in a prison environment? What would be suitable given shmmeee’s sentencing guidelines?
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sky Blue Pete said:
Well I hope for all he is because that would hopefully show he’s accepted his actions were horrific, the impact on the girl, he’s understood why he behaved in that way and how not to in the future
He would also be service the 3 years under license in the community rather than the expense of him being in prison
Again not defending his abhorrent actions or the impact on the girl and her friends and family but how long do you reckon you’d survive in a prison environment? What would be suitable given shmmeee’s sentencing guidelines?
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Why would he accept his actions are horrific. Its very clear that anyone prepared to do this is very likely to re-offend.

He should have chemical castration before he is allowed to be considered for release.
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Sky Blue Pete said:
That’s really useful
Don’t know how you think that would work shmmeee. I need some members of the board for the prison I volunteer at come and work with me and I’ll show you the issues of just locking people away for life
Click to expand...

Equally I’ll take you to meet my ex whose mum was murdered and the perpetrator was out in four years making her life hell.

I think there’s some crimes that you need at least a decade of your life out of society. This girl could be 13 when he comes out on licence with good behaviour and he could strike the relationship straight back up again. That doesn’t seem right at all.
 
Sky Blue Pete

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
Grendel said:
Why would he accept his actions are horrific. Its very clear that anyone prepared to do this is very likely to re-offend.

He should have chemical castration before he is allowed to be considered for release.
Click to expand...
Why would he not?
Where are your stats from on reoffending?
Looks like you might be talking nonsense

Sexual Offence Recidivism: - Lantern Project

Sexual Offence Recidivism: Prediction versus understanding Source: http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/5761/RECIDIVI.htm FROM: Grubin,d & Wingate, S.; Criminal Behaviour …
lanternproject.org.uk lanternproject.org.uk
 
Sky Blue Pete

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
Equally I’ll take you to meet my ex whose mum was murdered and the perpetrator was out in four years making her life hell.

I think there’s some crimes that you need at least a decade of your life out of society. This girl could be 13 when he comes out on licence with good behaviour and he could strike the relationship straight back up again. That doesn’t seem right at all.
Click to expand...
I’m sorry about your ex’s mum
How did they manage to get away with that?
he’ll be on the sex offenders register for life and on licence conditions when released which will include no contact with the victim so don’t know how that would happen

Sexual Offence Recidivism: - Lantern Project

Sexual Offence Recidivism: Prediction versus understanding Source: http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/5761/RECIDIVI.htm FROM: Grubin,d & Wingate, S.; Criminal Behaviour …
lanternproject.org.uk lanternproject.org.uk
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sky Blue Pete said:
Why would he not?
Where are your stats from on reoffending?
Looks like you might be talking nonsense

Sexual Offence Recidivism: - Lantern Project

Sexual Offence Recidivism: Prediction versus understanding Source: http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/5761/RECIDIVI.htm FROM: Grubin,d & Wingate, S.; Criminal Behaviour …
lanternproject.org.uk lanternproject.org.uk
Click to expand...

Well we do not know if its his first offence do we?

If someone has sexual urges regarding a 10 year old you surely must accept these urges will not just go away after 3 years in the slammer?
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Sky Blue Pete said:
I’m sorry about your ex’s mum
How did they manage to get away with that?
he’ll be on the sex offenders register for life and on licence conditions when released which will include no contact with the victim so don’t know how that would happen

Sexual Offence Recidivism: - Lantern Project

Sexual Offence Recidivism: Prediction versus understanding Source: http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/5761/RECIDIVI.htm FROM: Grubin,d & Wingate, S.; Criminal Behaviour …
lanternproject.org.uk lanternproject.org.uk
Click to expand...

Come on man, how can those conditions ever be enforced? If threat of prison was a deterrent then he wouldn’t have groomed the girl in the first place. He’ll assume, probably correctly, that he’s unlikely to be caught. Child abuse is massively underreported like all sexual abuse.

Re: my ex. He got 8 years for man slaughter, out in 4, and was appearing in places she’d be, calling the house, etc. But hard to prove at that time so impossible to get the police interested (this was the 90s so hopefully things have improved but I’ve no massive faith in the system here to keep victims safe).
 
Sky Blue Pete

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
Come on man, how can those conditions ever be enforced? If threat of prison was a deterrent then he wouldn’t have groomed the girl in the first place. He’ll assume, probably correctly, that he’s unlikely to be caught. Child abuse is massively underreported like all sexual abuse.

Re: my ex. He got 8 years for man slaughter, out in 4, and was appearing in places she’d be, calling the house, etc. But hard to prove at that time so impossible to get the police interested (this was the 90s so hopefully things have improved but I’ve no massive faith in the system here to keep victims safe).
Click to expand...
Prison is shit
Even the best more restorative places are shit
If it’s a first time offence there are possibilities for changing things
I’ve shared the stats with you. First time sex offenders recidivism rates are 10-21% so way more likely than not to reoffend unlike what grendel states as fact
I can only go by what I’ve seen and the licence conditions are significant as is the register for life. He won’t be allowed to be in certain areas, limits on internet access. And lots more besides and quite rightly he will be a risk for probably his whole life.
Yep it is underreported
 
Sky Blue Pete

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
Grendel said:
Well we do not know if its his first offence do we?

If someone has sexual urges regarding a 10 year old you surely must accept these urges will not just go away after 3 years in the slammer?
Click to expand...
Im not an expert but I’m pretty certain that experts in the field like these guys would say it takes significantly less time that will the correct help
www.lucyfaithfull.org.uk

About us - Lucy Faithfull Foundation

Lucy Faithfull Foundation is a UK-wide charity that exists to prevent child sexual abuse and exploitation. We’re here for everyone who needs us. We protect children by working with people who pose a risk and diverting them from causing harm. We support individuals and families who have been...
www.lucyfaithfull.org.uk www.lucyfaithfull.org.uk
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sky Blue Pete said:
Im not an expert but I’m pretty certain that experts in the field like these guys would say it takes significantly less time that will the correct help
www.lucyfaithfull.org.uk

About us - Lucy Faithfull Foundation

Lucy Faithfull Foundation is a UK-wide charity that exists to prevent child sexual abuse and exploitation. We’re here for everyone who needs us. We protect children by working with people who pose a risk and diverting them from causing harm. We support individuals and families who have been...
www.lucyfaithfull.org.uk www.lucyfaithfull.org.uk
Click to expand...

It says sex offenders not this specific crime. Lets be honest society would be better off he was just found dead. He has no use in society.
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Sky Blue Pete said:
Prison is shit
Even the best more restorative places are shit
If it’s a first time offence there are possibilities for changing things
I’ve shared the stats with you. First time sex offenders recidivism rates are 10-21% so way more likely than not to reoffend unlike what grendel states as fact
I can only go by what I’ve seen and the licence conditions are significant as is the register for life. He won’t be allowed to be in certain areas, limits on internet access. And lots more besides and quite rightly he will be a risk for probably his whole life.
Yep it is underreported
Click to expand...

I just fundamentally don’t believe court orders work other than give you an extra stick on the slight off chance they’re stupid enough to get caught again.

And I think some crimes, like raping a ten year old, are so heinous that it doesn’t matter if you only do it once you should be removed so the victim and their family know they are safe for a given period of time.

We’re not talking about a kid mixed up in the wrong crowd here, but someone who fundamentally doesn’t care about right or wrong. Would a sentence until the victim is an adult really be so wrong?
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Sky Blue Pete said:
Im not an expert but I’m pretty certain that experts in the field like these guys would say it takes significantly less time that will the correct help
www.lucyfaithfull.org.uk

About us - Lucy Faithfull Foundation

Lucy Faithfull Foundation is a UK-wide charity that exists to prevent child sexual abuse and exploitation. We’re here for everyone who needs us. We protect children by working with people who pose a risk and diverting them from causing harm. We support individuals and families who have been...
www.lucyfaithfull.org.uk www.lucyfaithfull.org.uk
Click to expand...

Reading this: https://www.csacentre.org.uk/app/up...rom-research-on-CSA-perpetrated-by-adults.pdf

IMG_2765.jpeg
 
Nick

Nick

Administrator
Sky Blue Pete said:
Really?
it’s a sickening crime and there is no defending what he’s done and the damage to the youngster in question but you think the solution is torture?
Help me of this train
Click to expand...

Because he will say what he can and what people want to hear for him to be out in 3 years.

Yeah, I'd say the solution is to kick him about every day and hopefully he will hang himself.

Prisons are meant to be shit, that's the fucking idea.
 
Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
There's no way someone like this belongs in a functioning society. The sentence is a joke and you can't have him walking the streets in three years. It's actually an insult to the victim.

I'm very much of the view of rehabilitation and second chances, but I can't see how that works with someone like this.
 
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Sky Blue Pete

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
I just fundamentally don’t believe court orders work other than give you an extra stick on the slight off chance they’re stupid enough to get caught again.

And I think some crimes, like raping a ten year old, are so heinous that it doesn’t matter if you only do it once you should be removed so the victim and their family know they are safe for a given period of time.

We’re not talking about a kid mixed up in the wrong crowd here, but someone who fundamentally doesn’t care about right or wrong. Would a sentence until the victim is an adult really be so wrong?
Click to expand...
Probably not no
 
Sky Blue Pete

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
Nick said:
Because he will say what he can and what people want to hear for him to be out in 3 years.

Yeah, I'd say the solution is to kick him about every day and hopefully he will hang himself.

Prisons are meant to be shit, that's the fucking idea.
Click to expand...
Well it’s not actually
It’s meant to be about many things
Main one being people being released less of a danger than when they went in
 
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