clint van damme
Well-Known Member
Can I get an evo seal of approval badge and certificate please?
Israel - Palestinian Conflict (31 Viewers)
- Thread starter napolimp
- Start date
Can I get an evo seal of approval badge and certificate please?
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
You can , nobody else
ms639
Well-Known Member
Life is all about cause and effect. Israel has wilfully constructed an apartheid state within Gaza. Violent resistance throughout history has consistently been the way people have sought change.
What hamas did was abhorrent and should be condemned at every turn however…
2.2 million people living in a state whereby a government whom they cannot vote for controls 5 out of 6 borders, controls water supply, energy supply etc.
The Palestinians are the victims here and anybody that thinks otherwise are deluded or wilfully ignorant.
The elephant in the room with all of this is that it’s another example of colonial / post colonial failure, arbitrarily drawing lines on maps to divide territory that should never have been britains in the first place.
Also louder for the people at the back
You can be anti the Israeli government without being a terrorist sympathiser or anti semitic
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
What hamas did was abhorrent and should be condemned at every turn however…
2.2 million people living in a state whereby a government whom they cannot vote for controls 5 out of 6 borders, controls water supply, energy supply etc.
The Palestinians are the victims here and anybody that thinks otherwise are deluded or wilfully ignorant.
The elephant in the room with all of this is that it’s another example of colonial / post colonial failure, arbitrarily drawing lines on maps to divide territory that should never have been britains in the first place.
Also louder for the people at the back
You can be anti the Israeli government without being a terrorist sympathiser or anti semitic
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
Well... I'd say everybody is the victims.
If you really wanted to do general black and white then Britain's the baddies for dumping a group that has traditionally been oppressed and victimised into an area where somebody else called it home, and into an area where they'd be almost universally reviled and hated too! Of course it's more complex than that, especially post world war two. Maybe the USA are the baddies for not providing an area among their vast lands? Maybe we have to accept, to move forward, that the foundation of Israel was a maybe naive attempt to find a solution to a big problem that needed solving, but that was maybe unsolvable in itself. Every action has an effect and all that.
Nobody comes out the winner in this. You can see why Israel develops a siege mentality and a need to defend itself, you can see why its neighbours are less than impressed and can see why they are not happy now being oppressed and occupied (and of course from a certain perspective, some would consider themselves occupied from the very formation of Israel - that of course is not the fault of the settlers looking for safety and a safe haven to call home, any more than it is the people displaced for them)... but of course Israel still needs that siege mentality or it'd be wiped from the face of the earth.
The solution? We looked like we were getting somewhere when the PLO morphed from terrorists to diplomats, and a two-state solution but... there were too many entrenched in the concept of needing to 'win' for it to gain the traction it needed so here we are, where acts of violence from both sides pass without comment because they're the everyday, and every so often it *really* explodes like now.
So you understand why people on both sides become rather more hardline than they would if they were in a country such as Britain, but it won't be solved until the everyday people get the voice, that it's recognised the people just wanting to work a living, provide for their family and be content are the ones that suffer, time and time again.
And they won't be helped until people talk, openly, about what to do without having their entrenched positions from the start.
Possible? Not yet, that's for sure - but never say never!
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
Had this pop up on my feed, not much changes does it.
In fact just this week all members apart from the US, UK and Russia voted in favour of a UN Security Council resolution calling for a humanitarian pauses to deliver aid to Gaza, the US actually voting against to veto it.
In fact just this week all members apart from the US, UK and Russia voted in favour of a UN Security Council resolution calling for a humanitarian pauses to deliver aid to Gaza, the US actually voting against to veto it.
duffer
Well-Known Member
That's purely your opinion based on a single person's statement. Where's your evidence?
You're accusing thousands of people you've never met and don't know, of something pretty offensive.
I could just as easily say that I think that there's a hate for Muslims that runs deep. And based on one or two posters in this thread I could claim there are plenty here who feel that way but won't say it.
I wouldn't though, because most people don't like being accused of racism/anti-Semitism/Islamophobia, especially when there's literally no evidence to support it.
duffer
Well-Known Member
Cool. You're a poster here, and at least one other poster has expressed a racist opinion at some point.
Therefore I think you're a racist. I don't need any actual evidence of your racism, you're in the room, I know there must be some more racists here, and I think it's you. You don't mind do you?
This is like the old Tommy Cooper joke about one in four people in the world being Chinese. I'll let you Google it.
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
That's fine , problem is duffer , who is calling who a racist ?
I'm saying there will be racists in the 100 not pointing to you directly..
Therefore I have to ask , what on earth was all that writing for and how did it get 3 likes ?
duffer
Well-Known Member
Anyways apologies to @Evo1883 , who I also think it's a decent poster most of the time, but is dead wrong here imho.
Anyway, back to the issues, I watched an interview yesterday that made a very good point (again imho). The interviewee, might have been an NGO or UN type, said that the country that holds the key to resolving all this is America.
The point he made was that the only time in recent years when Israel has been close to discussing a two state solution is when America has made its financial and military support (both of which are very substantial) has been contingent on negotiations occurring.
I don't know where this leaves us at the moment, but I suspect not in a good place given America's reluctance to support any kind of humanitarian efforts (beyond the twenty trucks which were themselves delayed).
Anyway, back to the issues, I watched an interview yesterday that made a very good point (again imho). The interviewee, might have been an NGO or UN type, said that the country that holds the key to resolving all this is America.
The point he made was that the only time in recent years when Israel has been close to discussing a two state solution is when America has made its financial and military support (both of which are very substantial) has been contingent on negotiations occurring.
I don't know where this leaves us at the moment, but I suspect not in a good place given America's reluctance to support any kind of humanitarian efforts (beyond the twenty trucks which were themselves delayed).
duffer
Well-Known Member
Are you offended by being called a racist, based on literally no evidence, by simply being present in a group of people? That's what you're doing here.
Now be honest, you don't like it.
It's a lot of writing because I'm trying to offer a considered, reasoned opinion rather than just chucking something out there without thought, which I'm afraid is what I think you've done here. Are you upset that others might agree with me?
duffer
Well-Known Member
Don't care what you think? This is the usual response when someone gets called out and can't defend their point of view. Easier than admitting they might not have thought it through.
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
No disrespect , saying there's a possibility more people will think like the racist is not calling you a racist .. so I'm not sure where you're going with it
duffer
Well-Known Member
The haha emoji is basically the same as the don't care response. That is "I've said something daft, I'm struggling to defend it", so I'll hide behind a laughing emoji. Understood.
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
The haha response is because you're talking about something that hasn't happened
But please carry on
I'm sat here ready to defend it all day
duffer
Well-Known Member
Politely, you're not saying there's a possibility, you started off with there must be people on here quietly supporting Hamas without any evidence of it being true. That made no sense to me and it's quite an unfair accusation in my book. Apologies again for getting drawn into it. I'm leaving it there.
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
And politely there are 7000 members here and we already have a poster say they back hamas over israel .. saying there are going to be more isn't calling YOU a hamas supporter directly..
So again , what are you on about
You said I've said something daft , where
duffer
Well-Known Member
One question.
What actual evidence do you have that a single person that you've accused of supporting Hamas in this, of the 7000 posters does so?
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
duffer
Well-Known Member
HH I think we accepted. Anyone else?
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
Otis
Well-Known Member
Tarring so many people with the same brush, obviously.
Seems to me that throughout the entire thread, criticism of Israel and their military response, has been somehow interpreted as support for Hamas.
You can think you are right all your want, Evo, that's your prerogative, but just about everyone else thinks you are wrong.
I think we need to stop going around in circles on this and move on.
It's fine if you think you are right. Just thinking you are right doesn't make you right though.
I hope the attacks from both sides will stop soon and a start to a pathway can commence as a matter of urgency. Not counting my chickens though.
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
Tarring so many people with the same brush, obviously.
Seems to me that throughout the entire thread, criticism of Israel and their military response, has been somehow interpreted as support for Hamas.
You can think you are right all your want, Evo, that's your prerogative, but just about everyone else thinks you are wrong.
I think we need to stop going around in circles on this and move on.
It's fine if you think you are right. Just thinking you re right doesn't make you right though.
I hope the attacks from both sides will stop soon and a start to a pathway can commence as a matter of urgency. Not counting my chickens though.
Wrong about what ?
duffer
Well-Known Member
Ah that's OK then , accepted
There will be more , no doubt
How many more would you say? And again your evidence for this is?
Sorry mate, I'm happy to leave it there if you are.
Otis
Well-Known Member
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
Ofcourse you want to leave it there
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
No
Tell me I'm wrong , wrong about what
Thinking more people would want hamas to beat Israel?
duffer
Well-Known Member
Evidence then please?
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
Evidence they don't , go ask all 7000 , 1 in 217 who has viewed this thread has admitted to it , the odds are against you
That's how it works , a big sample size too
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
Telling me I'm wrong to suggest more people would back hamas over israel is the same as suggesting you're right for telling me its not possible ..
You've also NO evidence it's an opinion , but fuck me the odds are against you
So again i ask , what have I said that's daft .............
Try make me look silly and pile on
You've also NO evidence it's an opinion , but fuck me the odds are against you
So again i ask , what have I said that's daft .............
Try make me look silly and pile on