I have no idea if the FA has that many refs floating around that they're able to do this. But I don't imagine that a 'top' ref is much more likely to deliberately perform badly to help out a local team than a player is.
Replays of incidents (10 Viewers)
- Thread starter Nick
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I don't think it's necessarily that straightforward, but more than anything I think people just need to accept that when referees are crap it's almost always for non-nefarious reasons.
Sky Blue Pete
Well-Known Member
Eccles after the 90 and Allen after the goal were very annoyed at the ref
Yes - even David Coote, the most famous of all compromised refs in the history of shit refs, didn't make decisions based on which local team he supported.
rob9872
Well-Known Member
At Cardiff away they delayed the game for a while and asked if there was a qualified ref in the stands. That surely can't be right even for 4th duties but what I dont understand is that the appointed ref who got injured, why cant he then become the 4th? Basically the job is hold up the number for the subs and tell the coaching staff to keep in their lines. He could do that sitting down.
MalcSB
Well-Known Member
Many year ago, a colleague recounted a conversation he had had with a crap ref, along these lines. No idea if it is apochryphal or not, but it amused me at the time.
Player - “ If I called you a c unit would you book me?”
Ref - “Yes”
Player - “If I thought you were a c unit would you book me?”
Ref - “No”
Player - “ In that case, I think you are a c-unit”
Supposedly no booking
Player - “ If I called you a c unit would you book me?”
Ref - “Yes”
Player - “If I thought you were a c unit would you book me?”
Ref - “No”
Player - “ In that case, I think you are a c-unit”
Supposedly no booking
How many proven cases have there been in this country in the last 25 years?
You tell me, was he? He wasn't removed from his job for anything he did during a game.
MalcSB
Well-Known Member
How often are complaints actually investigated beyond the “ referees decision is final?”
My problem is that I am a cynical, suspicious bastard who finds it very difficult to understand why identical fouls within 5 minutes of each other are given to one team but not the other.
To take it away from my Sky Blue specs, how was Dragusic not given at least a second yellow yesterday. Spurs should have been down to 10 men in normal time. The ref gave Spurs far too much respect - in my view. Some of Spurs tackling was far more agricultural than Tamworth’s.
Sky Blue Pete
Well-Known Member
I’d laugh at that too depending on the gameMany year ago, a colleague recounted a conversation he had had with a crap ref, along these lines. No idea if it is apochryphal or not, but it amused me at the time.
Player - “ If I called you a c unit would you book me?”
Ref - “Yes”
Player - “If I thought you were a c unit would you book me?”
Ref - “No”
Player - “ In that case, I think you are a c-unit”
Supposedly no booking
My lad far braver than me. He’s not as assertive as me but he’s only just 18
Free kick not given
Player - ref you’re a speccy twat
My lad ref - red card for abusive language
Player - walks off
Coach (u16) I think - you can’t send a player off for questioning a decision
My lad - I didn’t he called me a speccy twat
Coach - ah ok
lol
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David O'Day
Well-Known Member
"To be fair" there's no proof that Coote was doing anything other than mouthing off in private about a known douchebag who had given him shit over a contentious decision.
Sky Blue Pete
Well-Known Member
The two decisions were the foul not given for the shoulder in the back at one end and two seconds later decision given spurs way
Both clear free kicks
Same in our game - lots of occasions where the same incident recieved a different sanction
I’m fine with that during a game with different levels of aggression or time of the game but this was in the same minute
both refs were lucky things didn’t escalate but aren’t we all
Potbellypig
Well-Known Member
Sub-conscious bias. We all have it in us, one way or another. We'll of course never know if Tom Kirk was driving back down the motorway laughing to himself that he very nearly got his mates Sheffield Wednesday team into the next round, but I know what I watched on Saturday evening.
He got a lot wrong, was extremely biased to one team and his mark from the assessors will be low, and that's a slight consolation I suppose.
Sub-conscious bias obviously exists, but I'm not aware of any meaningful way we can control for it, and filtering referees according to where they live certainly doesn't. It makes no more sense to assume a referee from Yorkshire will perform badly in Saturday's game than it does to assume that Yorkshire's own Liam Kitching will do the same.
Potbellypig
Well-Known Member
Apart from that is complete and utter bollocks.
Michael Oliver from Ashington - Never refereed a Newcastle or Sunderland match
Martin Atkinson from Bradford - Never refereed a Bradford or Leeds match
Craig Pawson from Sheffield - Never refereed a Sheff Utd, Sheff Wed, Doncaster or Rotherham match, refereed 1 Barnsley match
Peter Bankes from Merseyside - Never refereed a Liverpool, Everton or Tranmere match
Robert Jones from Merseyside - Never refereed a Liverpool, Everton or Tranmere match
Seems the FA think you can control it.
So none of these referees have ever shown unconscious bias during a game?
If the FA want to stop certain referees from refereeing certain games to protect them from the howls of complaint from hyper-partisan fans then that's fine. But I don't think it's doing anything to improve the actual standard of refereeing.
I think referees should be able to speak to the press if they want to, and I'm all for more transparency with refs explaining how/why they made certain decisions. But if the intention is explicitly to "embarass them" then obviously it's not going to help anyone. I respect anyone who faces the press after a bad game, but no player, manager or referee is going to rush to speak if they know that copping to an honest mistake is going to result in people demanding they're instantly sacked for it.
MalcSB
Well-Known Member
Mind you, VAR might have helped
If you can prove that it's a big factor in referees underperforming then I'm all for action to stamp it out - what's your evidence though?
The status quo seems pretty good to me....if you want to tinker further with how to officiate the world's most popular game then be my guest, VAR is working just great after all.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
He’s refereed games recently including Huddersfield and Barnsley. I’m sure we could have a referee from Wolverhampton couldn’t we?
Just read on the Football Insider website that:
"Coventry were rightly disallowed a second goal in normal time before being taken to extra time and penalties in their FA Cup third round win over Sheffield Wednesday, Keith Hackett has said."
Three guesses where Keith Hackett is from... you got it in one... Sheffield!
"Coventry were rightly disallowed a second goal in normal time before being taken to extra time and penalties in their FA Cup third round win over Sheffield Wednesday, Keith Hackett has said."
Three guesses where Keith Hackett is from... you got it in one... Sheffield!
Oh yeah it’s a breeze this refereeing lark
Mental. I couldn’t see a foul from the other end and nor can I on any of the replays/angles. BTA doesn’t even jump into the keeper - if anything his own player impedes him.
But again, I don’t know what a foul is any more.
MalcSB
Well-Known Member
Neither do PGMOL referees
They don't seem to notice shirt pulling either
Or GK wasting time
Or the tactical GK "injury"
Or substituted players leaving the pitch by the longest possible route at the slowest possible shuffle.
Or fouls on Eccles in the penalty box (I would like to see an "independent view" on that one)
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Potbellypig
Well-Known Member
Picking out stats for stats sake, Tom Kirk has refereed 11 games involving South Yorkshire teams in the past 12 months, with the South Yorkshire team only losing one of those games.
Nothing to see here.
Nothing to see here.