Shamima Begum Not Allowed Back. (6 Viewers)
- Thread starter pastythegreat
- Start date
hill83
Well-Known Member
Think it was one bloke and it wasn't specifically because he was fighting Isis, anyone can still crack on and do that I believe.
Although it wasn't presented that way in all the usual suspect locations.
Cheeky link
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larry_david
Well-Known Member
No time for her. Made her fucking choice, deal with the consequences.
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
Have a bit of a read about the UK government knowledge of / relationship with the Manchester bombers
Nick
Administrator
I am not sure if he is the one, I think I read about it in a book about Broadmoor or Strangeways recently
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
Executing 15 year olds, is this the UK or the Islamic state?
Nick
Administrator
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
You know what i meanShe's 20
Marty
Well-Known Member
As Nick said, she's not 15, shes an enemy of state and should be treated like one. This is exactly the sort of person we shouldn't be showing compassion too, Her own layer hints at she can't be trusted.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
It adds more fuel to their warped mindset though and makes martyrs out of them. As I mentioned before, in court the UK is not going to be able to charge her with a crime that is going to hand her a long-term custodial sentence.
The stripping of citizenship was always going to lead to this situation though.
Marty
Well-Known Member
Once shes back on these shores its game over, even if the removal of her citizenship holds up she'll just claim asylum and never leave. The safety of the population need to come before her rights.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
Making martyrs out of these people only adds more fuel to the fire and continues their warped way of thinking - they’d be delighted if the state started executing the likes of her.
What does need to be addressed is tackling the cause of how and why a 15 year was groomed to such an extent and making sure that it’s being stamped out.
Executing them would just lead to even more instances of deaths of innocent people.
Marty
Well-Known Member
It's not our fault, I know people like to push the blame onto the west for everything, but she was given the best start in life, It was her father that caused this, he went to hate rally's with Anjem Choudary. Look no further then him.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
Exactly, it took place within the UK, until this is tackled and the root cause stamped out, it’ll keep happening. Burying your head in the sand and thinking the west has no part to play in tackling a problem that is happening and being created in the west isn’t going to help either.
Marty
Well-Known Member
It may have happened in the UK, but it's not our fault, her parents are immigrants and they brought their vile ideology with them, she got it from them.
If these people hate the west so much, then why don't they go elsewhere? There's plenty of other countries who's views more align with their own. I do agree we shouldn't get involved in the middle east though.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
She’s as much of a British citizen as you are, she was groomed within the UK and its a problem in the UK and west in general and the root cause needs to be tackled.
The attitude of ‘them’ and the west absolving itself of any responsibility is only going to make it much, much worse.
Ian1779
Well-Known Member
The ‘west’ created a huge void in the Middle East that allowed ISIS to flourish. We should have kept out of there. Although the west isn’t directly responsible, there is some culpability.
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Marty
Well-Known Member
Don't get me wrong, I fully agree that the west has some blame and 100% we shouldn't get even involved.
Marty
Well-Known Member
It's an issue that has been imported. If they didn't emigrate here, then they'd just be doing the exact same thing in Bangladesh. It's not our fault and we haven't failed her, her parents failed her and the buck stops with them.
Sky Blue Pete
Well-Known Member
Treating her through the legal system is the best way to protect our rights
Grendel
Well-Known Member
She’s obviously not going to be executed but I highly doubt for example the execution of Lee Rigbys murderers would lead to lore deaths it would just save the country a lifelong cost of keeping two worthless individuals housed in prison.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
It would add further fuel to their warped fire and they’d be made martyrs and used for grooming future generations to come. It’d be exactly what they want to happen as well.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
It really wouldn’t - there is zero evidence it would and these people are not brave soldiers but usually mindless dope heads. I highly doubt those two were groomed for anything just high on drugs with a thirst for violence and blood.
If Joe Cox murderer hung from a rope would he be a martyr? No just another waste of tax payer money gone
No doubt this pointless individual will be allowed back and thousands spent on her to protect her and give her a new identity
Sky Blue Pete
Well-Known Member
It would demean us
Marty
Well-Known Member
It'll be grossly expensive, she'll be given a new identity, round the clock protection, likely groom others, all at the tax payers expense. Finish her and it's done, make her go 'missing' job done.
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
Yeah well let one of our courts decide that
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
You want to live in a country where the state disappears people?
I'd rather live in a functioning democracy with rules and laws. Even.if 5hey sometimes afford protection to the likes of her.
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
5 Myths About the Death Penalty - Draft for Spanish Translation
deathpenalty.org
Death Penalty Cost
Recent Cost Studies A 2003 legislative audit in Kansas found that the estimated cost of a death penalty case was 70% more than the cost of a comparable
www.amnestyusa.org
Costs
Studies consistently find that the death penalty is more expensive than alternative punishments.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
5 Myths About the Death Penalty - Draft for Spanish Translation
Death Penalty Cost
Recent Cost Studies A 2003 legislative audit in Kansas found that the estimated cost of a death penalty case was 70% more than the cost of a comparable
Costs
Studies consistently find that the death penalty is more expensive than alternative punishments.deathpenaltyinfo.org
You are quoting the US system the cost of the rugby murderers if they live a normal lifespan would be £1.9m each
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
So what system would you like me to quote? Sudan? Iraq? Libya?
The US shows that the death penalty is *not* the cheap option - not that justice should be about cost, anyway. You can twist and turn all you like, but the evidence is that if you want to have a fair death penalty (and arguably the US one needs *more* checks!) then it costs you more money than other systems.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
Of course the Rigby killers were groomed into extremists, there was a lot more to it than them simply being on drugs and feeling like killing someone.
A lot of them are given drugs to take beforehand to try and make sure they carry out the abhorrent acts, again, supplied by those behind it all.
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
Nobody wants her back here but those in charge can't just decide to ignore the law when it doesn't suit, where does that path end?
The law doesn't allow for making someone stateless so this was always going to rest of proving she has Bangladeshi citizenship and that was always going to be a stretch. As much as we don't want her here the Bangladeshi government don't want her there and who can blame them.
If she does win her case, and it seems likely, then again the law of the land has to apply and she will be put on trial for the offences committed. Now if people think the sentencing guidelines are incorrect for those offences that's a whole different discussion, and of course there is still time to review those before any potential trial.
This again raises questions about the removal of indefinite imprisonment for public protection in 2012 and the ineffectiveness of the Healthy Identities Intervention scheme used in our prisons.
The law doesn't allow for making someone stateless so this was always going to rest of proving she has Bangladeshi citizenship and that was always going to be a stretch. As much as we don't want her here the Bangladeshi government don't want her there and who can blame them.
If she does win her case, and it seems likely, then again the law of the land has to apply and she will be put on trial for the offences committed. Now if people think the sentencing guidelines are incorrect for those offences that's a whole different discussion, and of course there is still time to review those before any potential trial.
This again raises questions about the removal of indefinite imprisonment for public protection in 2012 and the ineffectiveness of the Healthy Identities Intervention scheme used in our prisons.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
It also doesn’t work as a deterrent. Which only leaves revenge, which is a really ugly characteristic to have in a decent functioning society. You’re lowering yourself as a nation basically to the level of the perpetrator.
