I said potentially elongated it because if the bill is amended it will have to then go back to the EU for agreement, unlike a normal bill which would just pass the house, pass the Lords and become law.
Yeah but that won’t be Boris’ fault. It will be (insert opposition party here)’s fault for fighting an election against Boris in the aim of winning seats to maintain the status quo in parliament as a deliberate attempt to block/delay Brexit. You just don’t get it do you. Anything other than rolling over and having your tummy tickled by Boris makes you an undemocratic, lesbian, lefty, communist, snowflake, climate change hoax buying vegan who will do anything to stop democracy # we know what we voted for.
No the opposition have said already they will add amendments which have not been agreed by the 27 other countries so it has in its pure form already been rejected
As are a great many bills at this stage. Even less surprising given that it has to be negotiated with the other 27 countries first rather than the usual domestic bills which are discussed and amended behind the scenes before even getting getting to the house for discussion. The fact it has to then go back to another parliament for agreement rather than just passing straight into law as a domestic bill would is unfortunate, infuriating but necessary
The fact is parliament have not threatened to end the process of passing a WA. Alexander has in favour of a GE because it potentially benefits him as he can play the victim role rather than because it will help get Brexit done. It is a position borne from self-interest, not national interest
That’s what Labour and Lib Dems are Hopi for. They (the anti Brexit parties) have support focused on different areas, Labour up north and Libs down south in a nutshell.
The only hope they have is that the Brexit vote, which is spread all between Tory shires where Lib Dem’s are strong and working class communities where Labour are, is split between Tory and BXP and lets through their candidate.
As an example, imagine a seat with these votes in 2017: Lab 6000, Con 8000
Then add in BXP and it might look like:
Lab 5500, Con 5000, BXP 3500. The Brexit vote increases but let’s Labour through as it’s split.
They’d need a pact before a GE and Boris has ruled that out and many Tory voters wouldn’t vote BXP just as many BXP voters won’t vote Tory. The Lib/Lab voters are a lot more well versed in tactical voting.
The other question is turnout, the Brexit vote contains a lot of people who have never voted before and may not turn out for a GE.
I’m expecting a Tory win whenever the GE is, but I’m not expecting BXP to have many seats because they don’t have localised support. I suspect because the country is split 50:50 we’ll end up with a similar split in parliament. SNP are likely to clean up in Scotland and cost the Tories seats for example.
There’s every likelihood that we end up with another hung parliament or near as damn it. That’s why we need a referendum to sort this out. The country is split 50:50
That’s not parliament though, that’s the EU and the nature of these sorts of trade negotiations. The parliamentary process is the normal length.
Let’s be honest here, Boris could get it through with a CU amendment and the EU would likely agree and it’d all be done. As always it’s his desire to suck up to the hard liners that’s causing the delay.
No the opposition have said already they will add amendments which have not been agreed by the 27 other countries so it has in its pure form already been rejected
how long did it take 27 different countries to read it? Also it’s the same as Mays deal other than slight amends according to most so it’s been read already
It’s the opposition that says it is and then oddly needs intense scrutinyBetter tell Alexander it's the same as May's deal with slight changes then as that's not how he's been selling it.
He can't claim that though because he'd look silly for rejecting May's deal when the changes made to it are ones he also outright rejected in the past and considered more unpalatable than May's backstop.
We did that and the county is split 52/48.
” we now need to define “something else” and see if it still has a majority.
No we don't, we had a vote with a majority in 2016, leave won get OVER it
It’s the opposition that says it is and then oddly needs intense scrutiny
Workers rights as you mention, they could thwart any negative changes by promising to repeal them immediately they gain power - any company taking advantage of the negative changes would have to for the bill for administrative changes for themselves...that would make an rogue businesses think twice before implementing any changes that were optional.I think there would be more chance of getting this sorted if he accepts the extension and allows a vote on the amendments. I'd imagine most of those proposed would relate to workers rights which he'd have to make concessions on but I don't think the EU would decline.
If the GE isn't the tory landslide that some people think it will be and I suspect it wont be, and the government has a small majority or needs to enter into an arrangement similar to the one it had with the DUP then we're back to square one.
So are you suggesting that the EU will vote against the amended bill because of things like alignment with the EU on workers rights are added to the bill? It’s seems obvious that any amendments to the bill are only going to make it more palatable to the EU and therefore the chances of leaving are increased.
They have elongated it. They could have shared the burden of dissecting it. Like they do with manifestos & other important billsPoint of order: Parliament hasn’t elongated the process, they’ve just not allowed it to be shortened.
Workers rights as you mention, they could thwart any negative changes by promising to repeal them immediately they gain power - any company taking advantage of the negative changes would have to for the bill for administrative changes for themselves...that would make an rogue businesses think twice before implementing any changes that were optional.
You forget that any amendments have to go through the EU too...that will take time. I thought we all accept it is the incertainty that is stifling businesses.
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They have elongated it. They could have shared the burden of dissecting it. Like they do with manifestos & other important bills
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Yeah but that won’t be Boris’ fault. It will be (insert opposition party here)’s fault for fighting an election against Boris in the aim of winning seats to maintain the status quo in parliament as a deliberate attempt to block/delay Brexit.
No we don't, we had a vote with a majority in 2016, leave won get OVER it
Not literally a page.What do you mean shared the burden?
Do you mean like each take a page? It doesn’t work like that, each part will interact with other parts as well as existing legislation.
Every time you end up going back to the same soundbites taken straight from the Farage/ right wing media:
"17.4million"
"will of the people"
"leave won. Get over it"
You even still persist with the Remoaner tag. It's almost like a bot from the Daily Mail/Sun
There's never much, if any, detailed discussion or debate. The others on this thread do at least go into some detail as to what they think should happen and why, or why something shouldn't have happened.
I get the impression you're the kind of person that shouts "put your foot through it!", "clear it!" and "forward!" at games. Never looking beyond the initial action as to what it may lead to later on.
Not literally a page.
Sections, then communicate with each other about perceived consequence & actions required.
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“Leave” isn’t a destination. Get in a taxi and just say “leave” and see how you get on. The reason we are still here is because the original referendum wasn’t clear.
You voted in a badly designed poll. Get OVER it.
Did what?
We had a vote on “Remain or something else” we now need to define “something else” and see if it still has a majority.
To be fair, it was Cameron who stated : "Leave or Stay, either way there is no going back"
So what’s the 50/50 split between then?
Well, quite. In reality it’s more like 50:30:20 or even 50:30:15:5. But I’m the abstract it’s between Remain and “something else”
It should be the deal vs no deal... no remain bullshit, the majority want to leave
Genuinely not sure what your point is here. He also said “Vote Conservative or get chaos with Ed Miliband”, I think it’s safe to say ol’ Spamface McPigfucker isn’t the oracle he makes out.
The point is, it was Cameron who instigated this whole debacle. He presented it as a simple leave/stay and the result would be binding.
It's only since the result went "the wrong way", that it was not binding and the goalposts can be moved.
*wanted
Most data shows new voters are overwhelmingly Remain.
And as I keep saying, lots of people voted Leave and would prefer Remain to either no deal or CU for example.
Why are you so scared of Remain being on the ballot? Don’t you want the will of the people?
Also no deal is suicide, even Boris admits that now. No sane government would risk that. And what deal?
This is the fundamental issue with Brexit: it only has a majority until someone defines it, then support falls away.
Just talking rubbish as usual, like all remoaners thinking more people now want to remain. Just isn't true is it
It should be the deal vs no deal... no remain bullshit, the majority want to leave
Do I need to post the polling again?
Here: Opinion polling for the United Kingdom European Union membership referendum - Wikipedia
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