Sick Boy
Super Moderator
You're getting more and more Farage-like with each month that goes by!
See Europe? I though one of the many slogans of the leave campaign was 'love eu rope not the eu'?
Who would have thought it - the most gushing and dribbling euriphile on the planet launches an attack on Mr Junker
Sadly the dimwit doesn't realise he is the norm not the exception on the euro gravy train
Of course Mr Euro only wants to hide him away as he might damage his undemocratic idea of having a second referendum. People may see Europe for what it is
More Mr Junker please
Lib Dem leader on Juncker: ‘Pompous, self-important and overpaid’
What happened to your sneering predictions of a Tory landslide? May's/The Tories' lack of authority has made a final vote on the deal more than likely.
I'm just glad that the Tories will forever own Brexit.
Oh yes talking of sneering predictions you'll owe a charity of my choice £20 soon. I'm sure I'll find a worthwhile public school that needs the money.
So if the vote goes the other way by 52 48 it's one all - what then - do it again? Toss a coin euro were in the pound we are out?
I'm sorry that's democracy Zimbabwe style - abuse and brainwash the electorate until they get it right
I honestly genuinely thought you were better than that
I honestly thought you were better than denying the people a say.So if the vote goes the other way by 52 48 it's one all - what then - do it again? Toss a coin euro were in the pound we are out?
I'm sorry that's democracy Zimbabwe style - abuse and brainwash the electorate until they get it right
I honestly genuinely thought you were better than that
I have absolutely no idea why we wouldn't have one to ratify we were actually happy with any deal made to leave the EU, given there were so many different reasons people voted as they did.I have to admit, I'm not very comfortable with the idea of a second referendum no matter how much my disdain for the leading brexit campaigners and the type of campaign they conducted.
I wasn't impressed by the way the Irish Government held a 2nd vote on the Lisbon treaty when the vote didn't go their way a few years ago so it would be hypocritical to support one on Brexit.
I agree with Sick boy as well, think this could be an albatross round tory necks for a long time to come.
I have absolutely no idea why we wouldn't have one to ratify we were actually happy with any deal made to leave the EU, given there were so many different reasons people voted as they did.
Sure if it's the great deal for the UK we've been promised, it'll be an overwhelming majority after all...
I have absolutely no idea why we wouldn't have one to ratify we were actually happy with any deal made to leave the EU, given there were so many different reasons people voted as they did.
Sure if it's the great deal for the UK we've been promised, it'll be an overwhelming majority after all...
We haven't had a result about the deal.Which is exactly what Robert Mugawbwe says when he gets the wrong result.
We had a vote. Actually we had two votes as in the general election a party stood for a second referendum - they didn't do that well
Just let Mr £300k a year Junker (plus expenses) keep talking - that's democracy isn't it?
Indeed. In fact in the 'second vote', 80% of those who voted, voted for a party who pledged to honour the result of the referendum.
It seems that's not enough for some.
In the BBC today (2016 weekly figures)
£350m budgeted to the EU
£327m actual figure
-£75m rebate
-£87m subsidies
-£19m direct to U.K. private sector
=£146m per week
65.64m population estimate for 2016
That works out at £115m per head we pay annually to the EU.
Contrast that with figures from fullfact about Norway who contribute £740m annually with an estimated 12% of that coming back. Leaving a figure of £651.2m split between a poppulation of 5.23m - a total contribution of £125 per head. This is just for access to the EEA. They still have to abide by all EU regulations while have no say in them whatsoever. Still, they see this as a price worth paying for access to the worlds largest trading bloc, somewhere that Canada and Japan are desperate to be involved in.
To my mind I can see no sound economic logic to leaving the EU. We've been told that it will free us to make deals around the world, what happened when we tried to court India? They asked for visa requirements to be loosened meaning more migration.
I just can't see how we're better off outside the EU than in.
That's what's always struck me.In the BBC today (2016 weekly figures)
£350m budgeted to the EU
£327m actual figure
-£75m rebate
-£87m subsidies
-£19m direct to U.K. private sector
=£146m per week
65.64m population estimate for 2016
That works out at £115m per head we pay annually to the EU.
Contrast that with figures from fullfact about Norway who contribute £740m annually with an estimated 12% of that coming back. Leaving a figure of £651.2m split between a poppulation of 5.23m - a total contribution of £125 per head. This is just for access to the EEA. They still have to abide by all EU regulations while have no say in them whatsoever. Still, they see this as a price worth paying for access to the worlds largest trading bloc, somewhere that Canada and Japan are desperate to be involved in.
To my mind I can see no sound economic logic to leaving the EU. We've been told that it will free us to make deals around the world, what happened when we tried to court India? They asked for visa requirements to be loosened meaning more migration.
I just can't see how we're better off outside the EU than in.
In the BBC today (2016 weekly figures)
£350m budgeted to the EU
£327m actual figure
-£75m rebate
-£87m subsidies
-£19m direct to U.K. private sector
=£146m per week
65.64m population estimate for 2016
That works out at £115m per head we pay annually to the EU.
Contrast that with figures from fullfact about Norway who contribute £740m annually with an estimated 12% of that coming back. Leaving a figure of £651.2m split between a poppulation of 5.23m - a total contribution of £125 per head. This is just for access to the EEA. They still have to abide by all EU regulations while have no say in them whatsoever. Still, they see this as a price worth paying for access to the worlds largest trading bloc, somewhere that Canada and Japan are desperate to be involved in.
To my mind I can see no sound economic logic to leaving the EU. We've been told that it will free us to make deals around the world, what happened when we tried to court India? They asked for visa requirements to be loosened meaning more migration.
I just can't see how we're better off outside the EU than in.
If what you're saying is correct re the reasons for the vote, and I suspect it is, then the claims made by the foreign secretary can only be viewed as personally politically motivated. In what possible world does he think now is a good time to start undermining the PM. I'm no Conservative, as you know, so the infighting looks good for Labour but how the man can put himself before his party and his country is beyond me.I honestly believe the vote was not an economical one whatsoever. It was a cultural one combined with an up yours to the establishment.
Maybe there is a thought that we will be worse short term but better long term economic wise, but if you are trying to make sense of the vote or argue staying in is better, I think you are looking in the wrong place if you're going down the economics route. Not saying you're wrong at all by the way.
I honestly believe the vote was not an economical one whatsoever. It was a cultural one combined with an up yours to the establishment.
Maybe there is a thought that we will be worse short term but better long term economic wise, but if you are trying to make sense of the vote or argue staying in is better, I think you are looking in the wrong place if you're going down the economics route. Not saying you're wrong at all by the way.
How much longer is the EU going to last anyway? Surely, it's better to be one of the first rats to leave the sinking ship.
...and this is probably the most pertinent question of all.
I must say I did smile when the preening Barnier smugly announced that all he could hear was a clock ticking...how profound.
How much longer is the EU going to last anyway? Surely, it's better to be one of the first rats to leave the sinking ship.
Assume you got your wish, & the deal was rejected. Then we would need to negotiate another & another & another etc. OR have another in/out referendum.I have absolutely no idea why we wouldn't have one to ratify we were actually happy with any deal made to leave the EU, given there were so many different reasons people voted as they did.
Sure if it's the great deal for the UK we've been promised, it'll be an overwhelming majority after all...
I remember hearing Cameron & the remain team saying as part of project fear that this is "a one-off in or out referendum".I have absolutely no idea why we wouldn't have one to ratify we were actually happy with any deal made to leave the EU, given there were so many different reasons people voted as they did.
Sure if it's the great deal for the UK we've been promised, it'll be an overwhelming majority after all...
I won a lot of money on people voting to leave. I won a lot of money on the Tories not getting the majority.They're full of nasty self-serving scumbags and should be nowhere near these negotiations. Still, 'the experts' on here backed them to win by a landslide at the last election, so I'd pay little attention to their predictions about how this will pan out.
Oh yes. Forgot all is well in the EU.Ahhh yes, Britain was supposed to be the first to leave the crumbling bloc. What happened to the Brexiteers' predictions of Austria, Holland and France joining them? If anything, Brexit will make the EU even more unified.
I won a lot of money on people voting to leave. I won a lot of money on the Tories not getting the majority.
So what experts are you going on about? Those who said that if we voted leave that the unemployment rate would go through the roof and interest rates would rocket?
I honestly believe the vote was not an economical one whatsoever. It was a cultural one combined with an up yours to the establishment.
Maybe there is a thought that we will be worse short term but better long term economic wise, but if you are trying to make sense of the vote or argue staying in is better, I think you are looking in the wrong place if you're going down the economics route. Not saying you're wrong at all by the way.
I certainly didn't think about economic argument in the way posters above do, the net wealth of the country is one thing but I was more concerned about suppression of wages for the 20% of the workforce with the lowest qualifications, combined with which I want the benefits culture to be driven back. I say if you are capable of work then you should work & contribute to society or pay your own way and not get state handouts for year after year.
I was more concerned about suppression of wages for the 20% of the workforce with the lowest qualifications
If what you're saying is correct re the reasons for the vote, and I suspect it is, then the claims made by the foreign secretary can only be viewed as personally politically motivated. In what possible world does he think now is a good time to start undermining the PM. I'm no Conservative, as you know, so the infighting looks good for Labour but how the man can put himself before his party and his country is beyond me.
yet there are plenty of people who voted Breixt who say the exact opposite. I actually think you're assessment is more accurate.
Couldn't agree more on that. I personally think the infighting makes us look like idiots when it comes to the negotiations. I'm not sure however, if that is because we have some avid remainers there who obviously want things to go in a different direction, I expect that is probably a factor.
You're both going to hate this, but I'd rather have a consortium led by Farrage leading the talks. It might not be smooth (would it be anyway?). but at least he would know what he was talking about and would hold the EU to account, whilst also trying to get the best outcome for us.
Brexit is very hard, especially when a proportion of the country are siding with the EU over everything no matter what it is. I do honestly believe most people would have voted to leave due to cultural and establishment reasons rather than economical, with most knowing that we aren't going to be immediately richer (at the very best). As I've said before, I bet a lot of those also did so due to the refugee quotas and the Merkel policy, which we have seen has come back to bite us in the last few days.
The problem is, and I have said this before too, is that there was so much backlash and harassment before and after the vote, that people are scared to speak out on why they voted, or what they want, because they get branded as racist and bigoted etc, which simply isn't the case. It's a big problem, and why I always bang on about it. We can't have an honest debate otherwise.
His claims during the referendum debate suggest otherwise.but at least he would know what he was talking about
people are scared to speak out on why they voted, or what they want, because they get branded as racist and bigoted etc, which simply isn't the case.
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