Sick Boy
Super Moderator
Well one of the leading Brexiteers seemed to think we could do individual trade deals with each country.
May trying to talk tough in the MOS today and insisting the Eu will have to take the white paper.
Unlikely it will get through Parliament with both sides ready to revel. As Mogg says the Eu need us as much as we need them and it’s time this was recognised.
I haven’t misunderstood it all Tony - I’ve had the misfortune of once attending a book signing at which Hutton gave a speech on the subject.
I’ve read numerous articles by Hutton
The reason I bought him up is the fact that he is clearly the source of Martcov and his dribbling lunacy. Some of his quotes are word for word the same.
The only difference he sees between the two Empire structures is the German influence which on the one hand Martcov ignores but on the other hand assured us there is no German influences
May trying to talk tough in the MOS today and insisting the Eu will have to take the white paper.
Unlikely it will get through Parliament with both sides ready to revel. As Mogg says the Eu need us as much as we need them and it’s time this was recognised.
David Davis, writing in the Sunday Times, said it was an "astonishingly dishonest claim" to say there is no worked-out alternative to May's plan. He said her plan would allow EU regulations to harm British manufacturers.
"Be in no doubt: under the government's proposal our fingers would still be caught in this mangle and the EU would use it ruthlessly to punish us for leaving and handicap our future competitiveness," Davis said.
Now these are guys who whilst they have a definite preferred full break/hard Brexit...call it what you will...they have been sitting with & sending negotiators into talks with their EU opposite numbers - & are saying what some of us have been saying for a while now. The EU manderins want to bully & punish those who step out of line!
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Yes clever clogs we all know who OLLY Robins is. And that David DAVIS is merely the man telling others what direction to steer the ship. And that he is a bit of a knob...but his comments have been echoed by his deputy who has been closer to things...& the theme of the post is about the bully-boy EU not the specific individuals involved.Olli Robins has been doing the negotiating. David Davis has done virtually nothing this year. He was taken off the case by May and she let the civil servants get on with it.
David David : lazy as a toad, thick as mince.
Not my words.
Yes clever clogs we all know who OLLY Robins is. And that David DAVIS is merely the man telling others what direction to steer the ship. And that he is a bit of a knob...but his comments have been echoed by his deputy who has been closer to things...& the theme of the post is about the bully-boy EU not the specific individuals involved.
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Yes clever clogs we all know who OLLY Robins is. And that David DAVIS is merely the man telling others what direction to steer the ship. And that he is a bit of a knob...but his comments have been echoed by his deputy who has been closer to things...& the theme of the post is about the bully-boy EU not the specific individuals involved.
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He said from from his German bunker. Take the blinkers off Mart. Successive Govt's have negotiated succesful deals for the UK. Success though has merely been damage limitation.They are getting nowhere. So they say bully boy tactics from the EU.
They cannot deliver Brexit without causing damage. Not possible.
So, they do what they have been doing for years, blame the EU.
If you want to blame anybody, blame the people who put in this position.
We are now up against it on two fronts. The EU know we are in a weak position, and Trump knows it too. And any other potential trading partners know it.
Blame the right people. The ones who said they need us more than we need them. The German car industry will come with their begging bowl. We are sailing into a golden sunset.
Traitors.
They are getting nowhere. So they say bully boy tactics from the EU.
They cannot deliver Brexit without causing damage. Not possible.
So, they do what they have been doing for years, blame the EU.
If you want to blame anybody, blame the people who put in this position.
We are now up against it on two fronts. The EU know we are in a weak position, and Trump knows it too. And any other potential trading partners know it.
Blame the right people. The ones who said they need us more than we need them. The German car industry will come with their begging bowl. We are sailing into a golden sunset.
Traitors.
What claptrapThe same Davis who was in complete ignorance about the EU? The UK has attempted to do plenty of bully of its own but has been shown up as being all mouth.
What claptrap
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Nice try as a distraction, but you are all over the place at the moment. The Holy Roman Empire was not the same as the Roman Empire. And I have no idea where you get the idea that I said there are no German influences. I have said that Merkel is not the Empress of the EU as you seemed to be implying with your Roman Empire comparison. Totally confused..... maybe you have a bit of dementia coming on...
You have constantly stated the Eu Parliament is Democratic and actually a superior form of democracy than our own sovereign parliament - repeatedly so.
This author is a dribbling cowardly europhile in the same way as you. Also like you he is obsessed with the overrated overblown Merkel.
He frequently toddles out the same lies and anti british sentiment like you
The one difference is he is honest about germany and German influence - he welcomes it as you do but admits it. The Roman Empire comparison is classified as Holy Roman Empire purely as then it has Germanic not Roman influence.
He is honest as he admits Merkel rules Europe - when Merkel clicks her fingers junker will drunkenly salute and goose step round the room and do her bidding.
That’s the difference — he agrees with you in everything but doesn’t like you lie and pretend where the power and influence exists.
He like you doesn’t like Britain
He is at least honest about that
Jesus Christ man, let it go. You’re making yourself look that stupid now even I’m beginning to feel sorry for you. You got the wrong end of the stick and made yourself look stupid. Deal with it like a grown up.
Tony the only people who think I look stupid are you - a poster who has passionately argued the case for ukip - and a lunatic who everyone on here mocks with regularity.
I’m fine with that thanks
The only one who passionately argues the case for UKIP is you, although you’ve only just realised that apparently. And as for a lunatic who everyone mocks, again you.
Oddly Tony I’ve never argued ukips stance and have challenged you repeatedly on your insistence the party is not extremist . I’m not going to have to go back to some posting history again am I?
Don't forget the French cheesemakers and the Italian wine producers, they'll ensure we get whatever we want.
I honestly think the large exporters in Europe (to the Uk) are as worried about the end outcome of brexit as UK business are.
I honestly think the large exporters in Europe (to the Uk) are as worried about the end outcome of brexit as UK business are. A ‘no deal’ will be hugely painful for all and could still happen if both sides aren’t careful. They aren’t the ones negotiating though. The EU has stood firm, we’ve been divided as a country from the start and that has severely weakened our position. What’s happened in the lords and parliament, not to mention groups of MPs (multiple party) running off to have discussions with key EU officials behind the governments back has hardly helped strengthen our position either !
I can assure you though, some of those large exporters (to the Uk) will be shitting themselves if there is a no deal and nobody on the continent will be thanking Barnier and his team if that happens.
I honestly think the large exporters in Europe (to the Uk) are as worried about the end outcome of brexit as UK business are. A ‘no deal’ will be hugely painful for all and could still happen if both sides aren’t careful. They aren’t the ones negotiating though. The EU has stood firm, we’ve been divided as a country from the start and that has severely weakened our position. What’s happened in the lords and parliament, not to mention groups of MPs (multiple party) running off to have discussions with key EU officials behind the governments back has hardly helped strengthen our position either !
I can assure you though, some of those large exporters (to the Uk) will be shitting themselves if there is a no deal and nobody on the continent will be thanking Barnier and his team if that happens.
They've stated though that "protecting the single-market" is more important to them than protecting their exports to the UK.
You have constantly stated the Eu Parliament is Democratic and actually a superior form of democracy than our own sovereign parliament - repeatedly so.
This author is a dribbling cowardly europhile in the same way as you. Also like you he is obsessed with the overrated overblown Merkel.
He frequently toddles out the same lies and anti british sentiment like you
The one difference is he is honest about germany and German influence - he welcomes it as you do but admits it. The Roman Empire comparison is classified as Holy Roman Empire purely as then it has Germanic not Roman influence.
He is honest as he admits Merkel rules Europe - when Merkel clicks her fingers junker will drunkenly salute and goose step round the room and do her bidding.
That’s the difference — he agrees with you in everything but doesn’t like you lie and pretend where the power and influence exists.
He like you doesn’t like Britain
He is at least honest about that
That’s the thing for me this morning with Justine Greening’s input to the debate.
To think we can leave the Eu is insane. It’s like a divorcee with children and a house and shared finances thinking it’s ebough to just sign a decree sini and not continue talking about the impact of the break up.
The vote was stupid and s complete abdication of responsibility. It’s a representative democracy we live in
Do you just stay together for the kids sake then ? Or continue to share a house even though you don't get on ?
Or bite the bullet and hope that you will find happiness apart (knowing that the grass isn't always greener) ?
Giving the public the vote was correct in my opinion, labour and conservatives had promised it in previous election manifestos and never delivered it. The problems have been caused by how the referendum was conducted, the lack of information available (in particular relating to the challenges in a brexit scenario), the appalling misinformation from both sides although' Project Fear' and the threats of brexit appeared to have had the opposite effect (and have been proven to be total guesswork at best, bullshit at worst), the arrogance of the EU not to give Cameron anything pre referendum (a minor concession on freedom of movement probably would've won the vote), triggering Article 50 without having an agreed way forward and the total mismanagement of the process by the government subsequently, the attempt to politicise the situation by Labour (who also have no idea what they are doing on the subject and are also divided) and the behaviour of the "Remainers" not accepting the vote and attempting to reverse decision directly or indirectly weakening our hand.
Basically its been a f*ck up from start to finish but the actual vote, having been promised it over previous elections, was the right thing to do. The mess has predominantly been made by politicians on all sides since !
No but understand how hard it will beDo you just stay together for the kids sake then ? Or continue to share a house even though you don't get on ?
Or bite the bullet and hope that you will find happiness apart (knowing that the grass isn't always greener) ?
Giving the public the vote was correct in my opinion, labour and conservatives had promised it in previous election manifestos and never delivered it. The problems have been caused by how the referendum was conducted, the lack of information available (in particular relating to the challenges in a brexit scenario), the appalling misinformation from both sides although' Project Fear' and the threats of brexit appeared to have had the opposite effect (and have been proven to be total guesswork at best, bullshit at worst), the arrogance of the EU not to give Cameron anything pre referendum (a minor concession on freedom of movement probably would've won the vote), triggering Article 50 without having an agreed way forward and the total mismanagement of the process by the government subsequently, the attempt to politicise the situation by Labour (who also have no idea what they are doing on the subject and are also divided) and the behaviour of the "Remainers" not accepting the vote and attempting to reverse decision directly or indirectly weakening our hand.
Basically its been a f*ck up from start to finish but the actual vote, having been promised it over previous elections, was the right thing to do. The mess has predominantly been made by politicians on all sides since !
Agreed. Its a mess and we continue to make it even harder for ourselves !No but understand how hard it will be
No but understand how hard it will be
Do you just stay together for the kids sake then ? Or continue to share a house even though you don't get on ?
Or bite the bullet and hope that you will find happiness apart (knowing that the grass isn't always greener) ?
Giving the public the vote was correct in my opinion, labour and conservatives had promised it in previous election manifestos and never delivered it. The problems have been caused by how the referendum was conducted, the lack of information available (in particular relating to the challenges in a brexit scenario), the appalling misinformation from both sides although' Project Fear' and the threats of brexit appeared to have had the opposite effect (and have been proven to be total guesswork at best, bullshit at worst), the arrogance of the EU not to give Cameron anything pre referendum (a minor concession on freedom of movement probably would've won the vote), triggering Article 50 without having an agreed way forward and the total mismanagement of the process by the government subsequently, the attempt to politicise the situation by Labour (who also have no idea what they are doing on the subject and are also divided) and the behaviour of the "Remainers" not accepting the vote and attempting to reverse decision directly or indirectly weakening our hand.
Basically its been a f*ck up from start to finish but the actual vote, having been promised it over previous elections, was the right thing to do. The mess has predominantly been made by politicians on all sides since !
The problems all originate from no one bothering to write a proper question because everyone assumed Remain would win (on both sides).
"Leave the EU" isn't a policy. It's be like having a vote as to whether we want to pay less tax then when it wins immediately shutting down all public services and running massive debt because "that's what people voted for!"
A leave win was for all intents and purposes meaningless. You voted for nothing in particular and since then it's just been jockeying by both sides to claim everyone knew what they were voting for.
As they teach you in therapy "away from goals" are never useful. You need to specify where you're heading not just where you don't want to be.
It’s exactly the same question as at the last referendum
Do you just stay together for the kids sake then ? Or continue to share a house even though you don't get on ?
Or bite the bullet and hope that you will find happiness apart (knowing that the grass isn't always greener) ?
Giving the public the vote was correct in my opinion, labour and conservatives had promised it in previous election manifestos and never delivered it. The problems have been caused by how the referendum was conducted, the lack of information available (in particular relating to the challenges in a brexit scenario), the appalling misinformation from both sides although' Project Fear' and the threats of brexit appeared to have had the opposite effect (and have been proven to be total guesswork at best, bullshit at worst), the arrogance of the EU not to give Cameron anything pre referendum (a minor concession on freedom of movement probably would've won the vote), triggering Article 50 without having an agreed way forward and the total mismanagement of the process by the government subsequently, the attempt to politicise the situation by Labour (who also have no idea what they are doing on the subject and are also divided) and the behaviour of the "Remainers" not accepting the vote and attempting to reverse decision directly or indirectly weakening our hand.
Basically its been a f*ck up from start to finish but the actual vote, having been promised it over previous elections, was the right thing to do. The mess has predominantly been made by politicians on all sides since !
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