skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
What about the stuff we send to the EU for JIT? Are those jobs going to be lost? If as you say it will create jobs from goods coming in the opposite effect is it loses jobs from goods going out.
Look on the bright side.
Jobs will come back to the UK if the EU continues as they are. The company I work for imports a product from Spain that it used to get from the UK. It is only a small contract for us. Only worth about 20k a week. But to the company we buy from it is massive. Add a 5% tariff and it is the same price we can get it from in the UK. And it will then be from a reliable source without the lead time. Yes times are built in to the difference of ordering to delivery.
Then you have UK businesses that have plants in the EU. Then they bring the finished product back to the UK. Make this difficult and add tariffs and these jobs will come back once the cheap labour becomes more expensive through associated costs.
I am sure that once the EU knows their plan to make us stay in has failed that common sense will prevail. It is you that doubts their common sense.
There is a fine line between punishing us for leaving and having massive job losses throughout the EU to pay for punishing us.
Jeremy Hunt has made the comparison now as well and said that a bad Brexit deal will stir the British people's 'Dunkirk spirit'.
It's all just jingoistic nonsense.
I don't think you understand the concept of Jingoism, it is not the same as the Dunkirk spirit.Jeremy Hunt has made the comparison now as well and said that a bad Brexit deal will stir the British people's 'Dunkirk spirit'.
It's all just jingoistic nonsense.
Boris used 1066 in his Peston interview. They’re all at it.
I don't think you understand the concept of Jingoism, it is not the same as the Dunkirk spirit.
Jingoism was extreme patriotism, in the form of aggressive or warlike foreign policy, the Dunkirk spirit is about facing adversity and winning through in the end.
If anyone is following a Jingoistic policy it is the EU (well Jingo lite anyway). The seasoned practitioners are Donald's USA and Vladimir's Russia
No. Another Brexit benefit. The country uniting together in adversity. Plucky Brits fighting back, by retreating.
I don't think you understand the concept of Jingoism, it is not the same as the Dunkirk spirit.
Jingoism was extreme patriotism, in the form of aggressive or warlike foreign policy, the Dunkirk spirit is about facing adversity and winning through in the end.
If anyone is following a Jingoistic policy it is the EU (well Jingo lite anyway). The seasoned practitioners are Donald's USA and Vladimir's Russia
So that’s your definition of the Dunkirk Spirit is it?
‘‘Plucky Brits fighting back, by retreating’’.
Shame on you, I invite you to withdraw that comment.
No. That was the truth. It was counted as a major victory as it preserved up to 300000 soldiers lives. Strategic withdrawal. Not a bunch of Brexiters equating trade negotiations with the risk of 300000 lives. Disgusting comparison. We are not at war. Our expeditionary Force is not cut off and we have decided, without good cause, to leave an institution set up by former enemies partly to avoid us ever landing in the position of Dunkirk again. You don’t get it do you? Any Tory or Faragist comparing Brexit to Dunkirk, or even 1066, needs their head looking at.
Perhaps we should adopt the views of Gunter Oettinger who once said that it’s unfortunate Germany do not have wars any more.
you can't hide the fact you are burying your head in the sand by making flippant remarks about likes. I certainly don't rule out the possibility that it may not be as bad as I think it will be, (though I can't see any evidence to prove me wrong at the moment).
As bad as I think this whole thing has the potential to be even I wouldn't have predicted 3 years worth of disruption but that is what this fella is predicting. Though I'm sure you subscribe to the Michael Gove 'we've had enough of experts' train of thought.
Shipping chief predicts three years of no-deal Brexit chaos
And we're talking here about customs, look at how unprepared we are in general:
The UK still isn’t ready for a no deal Brexit
No it is scheduled in to leave for it's destinstion earlier ffs. So it doesn't take any longer to make or assemble stuff except in a few cases. I will concede that in a few cases.It adds time to production if it’s stuck at port.
Presumably some EU entrepreneurs will also seize the moment and start manufacturing some of the stuff we export to the EU for JIT manufacturing. The door swings both ways.
I think he means surviving with view to fight another day!So that’s your definition of the Dunkirk Spirit is it?
‘‘Plucky Brits fighting back, by retreating’’.
Shame on you, I invite you to withdraw that comment.
No. That was the truth. It was counted as a major victory as it preserved up to 300000 soldiers lives. Strategic withdrawal. Not a bunch of Brexiters equating trade negotiations with the risk of 300000 lives. Disgusting comparison. We are not at war. Our expeditionary Force is not cut off and we have decided, without good cause, to leave an institution set up by former enemies partly to avoid us ever landing in the position of Dunkirk again. You don’t get it do you? Any Tory or Faragist comparing Brexit to Dunkirk, or even 1066, needs their head looking at.
Squirm.
Nice try but independent of Brexit, Hammond or Farage, your definition of the Dunkirk Spirit is ‘Plucky Brits fighting back, by retreating’. Simple as that, you said it.
Another one in the hundreds of jaundiced posts in which you ridicule this country on a daily basis.
Many including me regard the UK as the greatest place on earth to live in. Have you got anything good to say about it you bitter little loser?
Squirm.
Nice try but independent of Brexit, Hammond or Farage, your definition of the Dunkirk Spirit is ‘Plucky Brits fighting back, by retreating’. Simple as that, you said it.
Another one in the hundreds of jaundiced posts in which you ridicule this country on a daily basis.
Many including me regard the UK as the greatest place on earth to live in. Have you got anything good to say about it you bitter little loser?
You have no evidence to prove you right either! There is nothing but speculation & opinion.
Flippant yes, ignorant or burying head? No
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Dunkirk and the UK being the greatest place on earth have absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with Brexit
I could be wrong, I've no concrete proof, but I've linked an article from the policy director of UK shipping.
I've linked a government article, so I've tried to present an argument, you've shown me nothing to contradict it.
2.6 million lorries a year taking ten minutes longer each to process, (if it is 10 minutes). It's quite easy to surmise that it will cause issues. Honda think it will cost them £850,000 a year. That's just one company. BMW are bringing their annual shut down forward so they can see how supply chains are affected, if you're ignoring that then yes, you are burying your head in the sand.
Mr Twister Of Words is at it again.So, are you suggesting that Brexit will increase the costs of production by 5%? Decreased competition of suppliers, increased freight costs because of lost time on journeys through customs checks, tariffs, more bureaucracy, labour shortages and maybe lack of UK alternative suppliers at least in the short term .... are these benefits of Brexit that we can look forward to?
Why do you think Thatcher pushed the single market and CU? Do you think that it had no effect on the overall efficiency of UK manufacturing? We just wanted it for fun? Business is just being petty about constantly mentioning the effects of a no deal in the short term? That because some firms will take a hit in the EU, it is all worthwhile?
Bazza says it will be no Problem because it worked in a company where he worked in the 80s. Just increase the journey time and factor that in. Easy peasy. Pity he is not in charge of a major manufacturer. There would be no worries.
Work it out....or take your guess and say how bad it will be for the UK. It is all you ever do.What about the stuff we send to the EU for JIT? Are those jobs going to be lost? If as you say it will create jobs from goods coming in the opposite effect is it loses jobs from goods going out.
Full employment?We have full employment in the UK. If in your scenario we will create even more jobs, who is going to fill the vacancies? You claim we have no houses and our roads are full and falling apart, who is going to build houses and repair our infrastructure? Without free movement of people, which you say „is just wrong“, we will have a crisis of not enough labour. Plus we will need to invest in more staff, civil servants, to replicate EU bureaucracy and to control our borders. Whatever happens we are creating costs and extra bureaucracy. Not in the spirit of the wider JIT philosophy.
Mr Twister Of Words is at it again.
I said TARIFFS.
Full employment?
Yeah OK.
We don't have full employment. What we do have is a lot of low paid work.
Work it out....or take your guess and say how bad it will be for the UK. It is all you ever do.
Work it out....or take your guess and say how bad it will be for the UK. It is all you ever do.
Does a mixed load mean products and immigrants?I’ve just received this morning at work an arrival notification for a shipment we have arriving from outside the EU. The ship arrives on 05/10/2018 and the container on it is scheduled to be unpacked on the 09/10/2018 assuming it doesn’t get pulled by customs. It takes 12-18hours give or take to unload a container ship so basically it’s 3 days until it can be emptied. It’s a mix load container (not everything in the container is for us so it was loaded with other goods at port that also wasn’t a full load container) so there’s a bit of extra paperwork as each consignment in the container has to be cleared before the container is released for unloading and our goods are haz/chem so again extra paperwork. So going by the schedule that’s 3 days at dockside. Could happen quicker but equally if it gets pulled it will take longer and it only takes one consignment in the container to be pulled and the whole container is pulled and quarantined by customs.
Now compare that with lorries crossing the channel. I bet the majority of trailers are mixed load, certainly hazardous goods go by road then ferry and you can mix hazardous goods of one category with hazardous goods of another category (as long as its within IMDG guidelines) and hazardous goods can be mixed with non hazardous goods. So already 10 minutes in looking ambitious to me based on my own experience. Quickest clearance would be a non hazardous full load (ie the trailer has one consignment only on it, not a number of consignments) and even then I can’t see it. Maybe if it’s express bills rather than full bills but even then it’s hopeful in my opinion.
Like you say though 2.6M lorries at 10 minuets each. That’s a hell of a lot of man hours to find.
I could be wrong, I've no concrete proof, but I've linked an article from the policy director of UK shipping.
I've linked a government article, so I've tried to present an argument, you've shown me nothing to contradict it.
2.6 million lorries a year taking ten minutes longer each to process, (if it is 10 minutes). It's quite easy to surmise that it will cause issues. Honda think it will cost them £850,000 a year. That's just one company. BMW are bringing their annual shut down forward so they can see how supply chains are affected, if you're ignoring that then yes, you are burying your head in the sand.
Maybe the British elite are convinced that the unstoppable path the EU appears to be taking is toward some sort of modern-German Empire...& it doesn't wish to be a part of it!?An interesting read here
"Why does the British elite, and not the French and German ones, believe they do not need the EU? The first reason is their rose-tinted view of Britain’s history. There is always a disjuncture between the way a country sees itself and how others perceive it, but this disjuncture is especially large in Britain’s case. Britain did not face the need to regain legitimacy in the same way as Germany did after the war, but there are more similarities than most Britons are prepared to admit. Too many see Britain as a beacon of democracy and liberty. Too few are aware that the country’s colonial history means that much of the rest of the world is more ambivalent – and that Britain is less trusted and admired – than they imagine."
"The second reason for the hostility, or at least ambivalence, of the British elite to the EU is that they always resented Britain playing second fiddle to the Franco-German axis. Not joining the EU until 1973 meant that the EU always looked like a Franco-German project that privileged French and German interests to the detriment of those of the other member-states, especially Britain. In short, the British have never been able to wholeheartedly support a European project that they were not the leaders of. And it is this, as much as an aversion to sharing sovereignty, that explains the depth of antipathy to the EU."
"Britain’s sense of economic invulnerability is even more puzzling. Why does a country that is significantly poorer than Germany, with far fewer internationally competitive industries and greater dependence on foreign capital and managerial expertise, believe it can afford to quit the single market? After all, the Germans would see such a move as gratuitous economic self-harm. Britain’s economic performance is no better than France’s and on some important measures – not least productivity – far worse. Yet nobody from France’s political mainstream seriously entertains the idea that French business or the French economy would benefit from leaving the EU."
If transport takes longer, who pays the hauliers for the extra journey time?
Have you had some binbrexit stickers made Mart ?!'who once said'..... maybe, and in what context? Whatever. Nothing to do with what we are talking about. No one here is calling the UK the enemy and relating the Brexit negotiations to WW1 or WW2 battles. Let's stick to the facts. We have yet to agree on how best to leave the EU. After 2 years! Talks of 1066 and WW2 are just distractions to appeal to the Brexit base, and to disguise the fact that Brexit is now a corpse. We don't even know who is going to lead us out of the EU. BinBrexit.
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