The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (11 Viewers)

[martcov]

This is what a lot of people voted for though. They portrayed themselves as heroes, sacrificing themselves for the future generations. However, the reality is that they've screwed them over and quite possibly damaged the prospects for the youngersters of today, as well. If this goes through then I expect Britain to into a low tax haven with even less regard for its citizens, private healthcare but even more dog eat dog.

Nationalism is destructive and history has told us this many times.

In my case older Germans - who are now dead - have told me of their experiences under Nazi rule. My father told me of his experience watching Coventry burn as a young man... when I hear the rhetoric of Farage and co, I just feel that we are moving in the wrong direction.... the burning of a Polish shop, bricks through the window of a Polish family- that in Cov. - and a Pole and a Czech being beaten to death elsewhere. People on here saying people are easily offended, at least they are not lopping off people's heads etc.. Post Brexit hate crimes up 40%...... 'a modest increase' according to one poster... others claiming that a 52% - 48% advisory vote based on bullshit is a convincing mandate to fuck the country for the next hundred years or so...

 

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[Terry Gibson's perm]

This is what a lot of people voted for though. They portrayed themselves as heroes, sacrificing themselves for the future generations. However, the reality is that they've screwed them over and quite possibly damaged the prospects for the youngersters of today, as well. If this goes through then I expect Britain to turn into a low tax haven with even less regard for its citizens, with private healthcare and even more dog eat dog.

Nationalism is destructive and history has told us this many times.

Agree that it will become a low tax haven and having looked at Apple last night they will offer them a route out of Ireland with a great offer so Ireland will require more subsidy from the rest of Europe either the slice of pie is going to get smaller for all or Germany is going to have a tough job bailing out the rest.

 

[Terry Gibson's perm]

In my case older Germans - who are now dead - have told me of their experiences under Nazi rule. My father told me of his experience watching Coventry burn as a young man... when I hear the rhetoric of Farage and co, I just feel that we are moving in the wrong direction.... the burning of a Polish shop, bricks through the window of a Polish family- that in Cov. - and a Pole and a Czech being beaten to death elsewhere. People on here saying people are easily offended, at least they are not lopping off people's heads etc.. Post Brexit hate crimes up 40%...... 'a modest increase' according to one poster... others claiming that a 52% - 48% advisory vote based on bullshit is a convincing mandate to fuck the country for the next hundred years or so...

I haven't paid much attention to a single polish shop getting burned or bricks through windows has that been confirmed a hate crime or is it possible it is just a rival shop or a dispute (not a wind up a genuine question).

Crime figures have to be taken with a pinch of salt as people from all sides have agendas and even before the vote were easily manipulated.

I voted out would I again probably as Europe is showing its true colours with its tough talk and to be dictated to from a man who runs Luxombourg is almost laughable, if they had listened to what the normal people wanted they would still have us in their club.

 

[Sick Boy]

I haven't paid much attention to a single polish shop getting burned or bricks through windows has that been confirmed a hate crime or is it possible it is just a rival shop or a dispute (not a wind up a genuine question).

Crime figures have to be taken with a pinch of salt as people from all sides have agendas and even before the vote were easily manipulated.

That's easy to say when it's not your loved ones who have been victims of it. It's a disgrace and an embarrassment to the country as a whole.

As for tough talk coming out of Europe...what do you expect after the 'tough talk' that has been coming out of the UK. Not to mention the EU being blamed for most of the country's ills and comparing it to the Nazis, something that is deeply offensive.

You could argue that England is now showing its true colours with the racism that has been evident since. The EU will be glad to be rid of the UK, and as someone moving to the EU next year, I think it's in the EU's best interest too.

 

[skybluegod]

In my case older Germans - who are now dead - have told me of their experiences under Nazi rule. My father told me of his experience watching Coventry burn as a young man... when I hear the rhetoric of Farage and co, I just feel that we are moving in the wrong direction.... the burning of a Polish shop, bricks through the window of a Polish family- that in Cov. - and a Pole and a Czech being beaten to death elsewhere. People on here saying people are easily offended, at least they are not lopping off people's heads etc.. Post Brexit hate crimes up 40%...... 'a modest increase' according to one poster... others claiming that a 52% - 48% advisory vote based on bullshit is a convincing mandate to fuck the country for the next hundred years or so...

Agree with everything except the last part... Everybody over 18 had the chance to vote, those that decided not too, that is their own fault. The result is what it is, and the argument that 52:48 isn't decisive enough is ridiculous. If it had been 52:48 remain you wouldn't bat an eyelid. Yes the whole argument was built on lies, but people chose to believe them, and it wouldn't be democracy to have another vote.

 

[Sick Boy]

Agree with everything except the last part... Everybody over 18 had the chance to vote, those that decided not too, that is their own fault. The result is what it is, and the argument that 52:48 isn't decisive enough is ridiculous. If it had been 52:48 remain you wouldn't bat an eyelid. Yes the whole argument was built on lies, but people chose to believe them, and it wouldn't be democracy to have another vote.

Funny that leave's poster boy, Farage claimed that if remain won 52-48, the battle be far from over. This is yet another problem of not having a written constitution. In any other country there would be conditions attached to a referendum that was deciding such a monumental decision.

 

[martcov]

I haven't paid much attention to a single polish shop getting burned or bricks through windows has that been confirmed a hate crime or is it possible it is just a rival shop or a dispute (not a wind up a genuine question).

Crime figures have to be taken with a pinch of salt as people from all sides have agendas and even before the vote were easily manipulated.

I voted out would I again probably as Europe is showing its true colours with its tough talk and to be dictated to from a man who runs Luxombourg is almost laughable, if they had listened to what the normal people wanted they would still have us in their club.

Excuses excuses excuses.....brush it under the carpet. Germany wanted Britain to stay, as, apart from their car exports, they saw us as a strong ally in reforming the EU ( e.g. against benefit tourism ). Juncker doesn't run Luxembourg at the moment. Who are the normal people? Britain is talking tough, or haven't you been following the Tory party statements? Tusk has said they would take Britain back even after article 50 has been activated. Europe wants and needs Britain, but Britain is behaving like a tosser. True colours? Britain is leaving - but won't activate article 50 and is slagging off the EU. Keep saying how great we are and there is a queue of countries waiting to trade with us (e.g. New Zealand. wow! ) next we will building a stadium in the three years and have already located 3 possible sites.....whoops wrong thread and wrong bullshitters. Does sound like same shit, different bucket though.

 

[Kingokings204]

I think this thread highlights why the country voted to leave. People have had enough of the EU. The EU is a gravy train for failed politicians and they are showing our true colours now we have left. I don't want to be part of a failing club which costs a fortune.

And luckily leave won the vote fair and square and my advice to remainers on here such as martcov becaue you seem very passionate about it as am I so how about you just accept the result and we can all make brexit work. It's quite clear you haven't gotten over the result and I find that a shame. We will leave the EU. It's going to happen so let's try and come to together and make this work.

 

[Kingokings204]

Funny that leave's poster boy, Farage claimed that if remain won 52-48, the battle be far from over. This is yet another problem of not having a written constitution. In any other country there would be conditions attached to a referendum that was deciding such a monumental decision.

He might of said that but he also said it was a once in a generation vote. We won't get another one. As it should be. If remain had of won I wouldn't be on here carrying on moaning about the EU.

If politicians or The EU was so great 17.4m people (bigger mandate ever) people wouldn't of voted to leave.

 

[Sick Boy]

He might of said that but he also said it was a once in a generation vote. We won't get another one. As it should be. If remain had of won I wouldn't be on here carrying on moaning about the EU.

If politicians or The EU was so great 17.4m people (bigger mandate ever) people wouldn't of voted to leave.

What do you expect when a Eurosceptic press has blamed the EU for the country's woes for 40 years? Who's going to be next on their list when it turns out that a lot the country's failings are down to the UK government rather than the EU?

 

[martcov]

I think this thread highlights why the country voted to leave. People have had enough of the EU. The EU is a gravy train for failed politicians and they are showing our true colours now we have left. I don't want to be part of a failing club which costs a fortune.

And luckily leave won the vote fair and square and my advice to remainers on here such as martcov becaue you seem very passionate about it as am I so how about you just accept the result and we can all make brexit work. It's quite clear you haven't gotten over the result and I find that a shame. We will leave the EU. It's going to happen so let's try and come to together and make this work.

The biggest gravy trainer being Farage.

How do we make it work? By rejecting the 4 points needed to remain in the single market? By blaming everything on the EU?

What about putting the post Brexit plan into action? That would show that we know what we are doing.....oh......er.....er.....er what plan?

I haven't got over the result by a long chalk and am watching this disaster very closely. Fair and square is not how I would describe it and convincing it was not.

 

[Kingokings204]

What do you expect when a Eurosceptic press has blamed the EU for the country's woes for 40 years? Who's going to be next on their list when it turns out that a lot the country's failings are down to the UK government rather than the EU?

Well we shall see. Who knows?

 

[Sick Boy]

Personally I feel lucky that I have the opportunity to get out of the country before it really gets nasty. As I said earlier, who will be next on the list of the right wing press once it no longer has the EU to blame.

 

[martcov]

He might of said that but he also said it was a once in a generation vote. We won't get another one. As it should be. If remain had of won I wouldn't be on here carrying on moaning about the EU.

If politicians or The EU was so great 17.4m people (bigger mandate ever) people wouldn't of voted to leave.

Yes you would.....

The mandate was really the difference between remain and leave. You seem to discount the remain votes in your calculation. As Farage said before the vote - 52 - 48, means work to be done. In other words not convincing enough for such an important decision.

 

[Kingokings204]

The biggest gravy trainer being Farage.

How do we make it work? By rejecting the 4 points needed to remain in the single market? By blaming everything on the EU?

What about putting the post Brexit plan into action? That would show that we know what we are doing.....oh......er.....er.....er what plan?

I haven't got over the result by a long chalk and am watching this disaster very closely. Fair and square is not how I would describe it and convincing it was not.

I think that last paragraph is all I needed to know. I will leave it there as passions will over run else. hope you understand.

 

[Kingokings204]

Personally I feel lucky that I have the opportunity to get out of the country before it really gets nasty. As I said earlier, who will be next on the list of the right wing press once it no longer as the EU to blame.

Genuinely mean this.... good for you. Hope it works out for you.

 

[Sick Boy]

Genuinely mean this.... good for you. Hope it works out for you.

Thank you.

 

[Sick Boy]

The thing that winds me up is that Brexit was presented as a golden opportunity that would leave people better off and investment in public services.

Where is this investment? Why is Brexit now something that is going to squeeze those who don't make a lot of money? Why is it now something that will only work if people come together and me it work? Where is the extra money in people''s pockets? Is Turkey really about to join the EU?

 

[martcov]

The thing that winds me up is that Brexit was presented as a golden opportunity that would leave people better off and investment in public services.

Where is this investment? Why is Brexit now something that is going to squeeze those who don't make a lot of money? Why is it now something that will only work if people come together and me it work? Where is the extra money in people''s pockets? Is Turkey really about to join the EU?

Yes, all this we've got to pull together doesn't sound very confident to me. That is the sort of thing you say when things get tough = We have to work together to get out of this mess.... If we have made the right decision and are sailing into the sunset, then everything is rosy and we don't need to be told to work together constantly as we are all doing great anyway.. well, apart from the Poles who are getting bricked, beaten to death and their businesses burnt down.. but who cares, we are leaving the EU....

 

[Terry Gibson's perm]

That's easy to say when it's not your loved ones who have been victims of it. It's a disgrace and an embarrassment to the country as a whole.

As for tough talk coming out of Europe...what do you expect after the 'tough talk' that has been coming out of the UK. Not to mention the EU being blamed for most of the country's ills and comparing it to the Nazis, something that is deeply offensive.

You could argue that England is now showing its true colours with the racism that has been evident since. The EU will be glad to be rid of the UK, and as someone moving to the EU next year, I think it's in the EU's best interest too.

The question was has it been confirmed as a crime against a Polish person by an English person I genuinely don't know as if not it is a crime against a business rather than a crime because it was a Polish shop.

 

[Sick Boy]

The question was has it been confirmed as a crime against a Polish person by an English person I genuinely don't know as if not it is a crime against a business rather than a crime because it was a Polish shop.

Perhaps it was a rival Bulgarian shop owner? Maybe the various nationalities targeted in the street for speaking their native tongue are unlucky to have come across some kind of language extremist?

 

[Terry Gibson's perm]

Excuses excuses excuses.....brush it under the carpet. Germany wanted Britain to stay, as, apart from their car exports, they saw us as a strong ally in reforming the EU ( e.g. against benefit tourism ). Juncker doesn't run Luxembourg at the moment. Who are the normal people? Britain is talking tough, or haven't you been following the Tory party statements? Tusk has said they would take Britain back even after article 50 has been activated. Europe wants and needs Britain, but Britain is behaving like a tosser. True colours? Britain is leaving - but won't activate article 50 and is slagging off the EU. Keep saying how great we are and there is a queue of countries waiting to trade with us (e.g. New Zealand. wow! ) next we will building a stadium in the three years and have already located 3 possible sites.....whoops wrong thread and wrong bullshitters. Does sound like same shit, different bucket though.

Juncker is a big mouth he is about as important as the leader of Coventry city council how would you feel if Anne Lucas was telling Germany or France what to do you would fall over laughing (I know Lucas is no longer a leader but she is a nice extreme example).

I honestly don't believe that article 50 will ever be activated and although I voted out I don't really mind if it isn't but it would need massive change in attitude on both sides.

It would be interesting to see if the vote was done again tomorrow what the result would be especially if you had to vote.

 

[Terry Gibson's perm]

Perhaps it was a rival Bulgarian shop owner?

Perhaps it was another Polish shop I don't know.

 

[Sick Boy]

Juncker is a big mouth he is about as important as the leader of Coventry city council how would you feel if Anne Lucas was telling Germany or France what to do you would fall over laughing (I know Lucas is no longer a leader but she is a nice extreme example).

I honestly don't believe that article 50 will ever be activated and although I voted out I don't really mind if it isn't but it would need massive change in attitude on both sides.

It would be interesting to see if the vote was done again tomorrow what the result would be especially if you had to vote.

Also if they allowed British citizens abroad the right to vote as well? Even the US doesn't strip citizens of the right to vote

 

[Terry Gibson's perm]

Personally I feel lucky that I have the opportunity to get out of the country before it really gets nasty. As I said earlier, who will be next on the list of the right wing press once it no longer has the EU to blame.

I have no opportunity to leave as my daughter has very limited speech and a second language would be way beyond her the country's that we would like to go to are unlikely to accept a child with a disability (certainly Australia won't), so will make the best of it.

I also genuinely hope all goes well with your move as I would like everybody to be happy apart from maybe Joy Sepalla

 

[Terry Gibson's perm]

Also if they allowed British citizens abroad the right to vote as well? Even the US doesn't strip citizens of the right to vote

Maybe half a vote

No of course they should get a vote

 

[Sick Boy]

I have no opportunity to leave as my daughter has very limited speech and a second language would be way beyond her the country's that we would like to go to are unlikely to accept a child with a disability (certainly Australia won't), so will make the best of it.

I also genuinely hope all goes well with your move as I would like everybody to be happy apart from maybe Joy Sepalla

Thank you for the kind words. As I said, I feel incredibly lucky to be able to but it also saddens me as well. Both my parents are EU migrants, as is my girlfriend. All 3 of them do or did very challenging and challenging jobs in the public sector, yet all 3 have faced abuse since the referendum.

 

[Ashdown]

That's easy to say when it's not your loved ones who have been victims of it. It's a disgrace and an embarrassment to the country as a whole.

As for tough talk coming out of Europe...what do you expect after the 'tough talk' that has been coming out of the UK. Not to mention the EU being blamed for most of the country's ills and comparing it to the Nazis, something that is deeply offensive.

You could argue that England is now showing its true colours with the racism that has been evident since. The EU will be glad to be rid of the UK, and as someone moving to the EU next year, I think it's in the EU's best interest too.

Ah it's that 'The English are racists' line again....................from the Irishman with a grudge !

 

[martcov]

Ah it's that 'The English are racists' line again....................from the Irishman with a grudge !

I think most people don't think all English are racists, just that the Brexit rhetoric has emboldened some of the racist scumbags to come out into the open thinking their day has come.

 

[mrtrench]

I think most people don't think all English are racists, just that the Brexit rhetoric has emboldened some of the racist scumbags to come out into the open thinking their day has come.

I saw some people being racist the other day on Facebook. Was quite shocked as I hadn't seen it for decades; made me realise that I may live in a bubble. It wasn't anti-EU racism though - old fashioned 'your skin is a different colour' stuff.

 

[martcov]

I saw some people being racist the other day on Facebook. Was quite shocked as I hadn't seen it for decades; made me realise that I may live in a bubble. It wasn't anti-EU racism though - old fashioned 'your skin is a different colour' stuff.

Yes, it starts with the Poles, then the Spanish and spreads as the habit forms....

 

[Grendel]

Personally I feel lucky that I have the opportunity to get out of the country before it really gets nasty. As I said earlier, who will be next on the list of the right wing press once it no longer has the EU to blame.

Yes the country you are going to sounds like a place of freedom and love for all

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...klet-controversy-italys-fertility-day?0p19G=c

 

[Sumo the Micky Quinn]

Also if they allowed British citizens abroad the right to vote as well? Even the US doesn't strip citizens of the right to vote

British Citizens who lived abroad were allowed to vote, However only if the they were registered living in the UK the previous 15 years.

Almost every Brit I know over here in Fuerteventura was eligible to vote (very few here, have been here longer than 15 years), but most couldn't be bothered to vote. However they are shitting themselves at the moment (wishing they had voted) because the Spanish Government won't talk about the situation - except mentioning Gibraltar, so we may be kicked out, or have to go through the visa system.

 

[Grendel]

Yes, it starts with the Poles, then the Spanish and spreads as the habit forms....

Come on. Racist attitudes in Europe is highly prevalent.

My experience in Germany less so actually but France, Spain, Italy are fell less tolerant societies than ours and their hard right parties get far more support than they would here.

The EU movement to get some of the former Eastern block countries into the EU makes this all a bit silly. Some of these countries are incredibly anti Muslim and anti black to an extent rhat would never be tolerated here.

To suggest the uk is heading to some kind of Pre war Nazi Germany is pretty offensive.

The reality is migrants will be better received in the uk than pretty much any country in Europe I can think off.

Despite the rhetoric politically the uk is a fairly middle ground society - it's certainly not a society that would tolerate and actively elect the facist right as many in Europe do.

 

[Sumo the Micky Quinn]

Speaking to British tourists, mostly elderly, I am shocked at how many thick people are constantly commenting on "I voted out to get rid of the Muslims".

In the last month I spoke to couples from near the Millwall Football ground, Tamworth, Manchester, Glasgow & South Wales. Conversation usually kicks off with comment on the exchange rate as most people are being offered 1€ = £1.