Who is the president of the superstate? Did Rome allow universal suffrage in it’s vassal states? Did Rome give them veto rights? Did each state have an independent judiciary? Freedom of speech? Could they go to war with other countries without permission from Rome? I think the comparison is bollocks.
The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (259 Viewers)
- Thread starter jimmyhillsfanclub
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Who is the president of the superstate? Did Rome allow universal suffrage in it’s vassal states? Did Rome give them veto rights? Did each state have an independent judiciary? Freedom of speech? Could they go to war with other countries without permission from Rome? I think the comparison is bollocks.
An independent Scotland could have more rights in your so called super state than it has as a member of The super kingdom of The UK which doesn’t even have an article 50.
Your unelected mate Farage met with Trump, Bolton etc before the Sun interview where Trump had a go at May and in effect undermined the policy of the elected British government. Farage claims he explained Brexit to Trump. Trump parroted the crap, upset everybody through his ignorance, and has now, after spending 2 days with May, said that he hadn’t understood Brexit at first, but now sees May‘s policy and idea.
I wish they could have used some of the Henry VIII powers on Farage. A block at the Tower with an executioner would not be a bad idea for the conniving traitor.
Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
It is appointed isn't so they are analogous to 'Lords'.
We are ruled by modern day Lords of the ruling parties from each country in the club.
Yes, but it is not legislative, so your original point was wrong.
It is more like the civil service than the Lords.
Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
I'm blocking you now. You are tiresome.
Yes. Facts are. Stick to emotions and Breitbart. You’ll be much happier.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
I am quoting a view by an esteemed economist who is principal at Hertford College Oxford who says that it is similar in ideology and aims and Germany is now the head of the empire
With respect I think his views on the matter are more worthy of consideration than yours.
I suspect that it was qualified to exclude a lot of the banal workings of the EU, but more on the aims and ideology than comparing the day to day running or detail of the EU and that you are bending his learned opinions to suit your somewhat biased opinions. Germany isn’t the head of an empire as no one has been coerced into an Empire or superstate and there are vetos and votes are taken. The is also no single language. Several languages are accepted as the legal language. I would be interested to read his views and see how he came to the conclusion that the empress is Merkel.
I think you are not talking about the Roman Empire at all.
It can only be the Holy Roman Empire. Which is like you telling me about someone saying Bristol City is crap and the other person was talking about Bristol Rovers...
Two totally different things.. if I may respectfully point out..
Just checked you pillock. You have indeed confused the Roman Empire with the Holy Roman Empire of Charlemagne which ended with Napoleon taking over German principalities. So next time you try to educate me, educate yourself first.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Yes it is the Holy Roman Empire due to its influence and control from Germanic states. Identifying the difference really isn’t helping your cause unless you now acknowledge the most senior economist at Oxford University is correct - do you agree with him?
Grendel
Well-Known Member
I’ve responded. The difference is of course the influence of Germanic states which is huttons point. So you seem to now agree and are happy with the Germanic control as it’s ideology?
Hilarious.... rofl.... great entertainment... just say, „ok fair enough you got me this time“... We all make mistakes... but, I am sitting here with the missus betting on your reply.. neither of us won, but we had a good laugh.
No, it isn’t. He is pointing out the development of Germany. That was referring to the Holy Roman Empire, then Bismarck‘s with Kaiser Wilhelm as Kaiser. Weimar carried on the Reich and the Nazis created the follow up, the Third Reich based on their ideology of one people, one empire, one leader. The desire for a people and a nation state with a leader acting solely in the interest of his people who give him undying loyalty and respect. Strong military, blame all problems on the enemies of the people. Target one religion. Workers losing rights. Increased military spending. Constant rallies and organised fake news propaganda. Mocking and bullying of opponents. Breaking international agreements and leaving multinational organisations ( League of Nations ). Similar ideology and methodology to people you give a pass to actually.
Luckily it cannot happen in the UK....
Pro-Tommy Robinson protesters block bus driven by woman in headscarf
That could have been written about Trump tbf
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Mart he is obsessed with germany - totally obsessed. His diatribe on Merkel and the EU is a replicant if your own posting history.
He believes in big state and the removal of national identity and cites this in his sickening Germany A beacon of force - his comparison is with a 21st century Holy Roman Empire with a common currency and trading rules governed by Germany. He is the true voice of Europe and what the union wants. An economic fourth Reich governed by Merkel
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Well Martcov will argue around 800AD but to be honest the Roman Empire in its original format had the same ideology and intent as the EU does. The difference is that it’s central hub was not from Germany as the Holy Roman Empire was.
People should read articles from the likes of Hutton as they are frightening in their desire for the Eu states to be controlled through Germany and it’s ecomomic policies. His arrogance and disdain for the “lesser” countries such as Greece and how they should surrender to the Fatherland is very revealing as to how people like Mart get their bigotry and desire for superstate control from.
Er, no... you are the one trying, mistakenly, to compare the EU with the Roman Empire, and failing. You and your Brexit chums are the ones obsessed with Germany and convinced of your Faragist inspired belief that Germany is the enemy. The reality is what Hutton says, that Germany sees itself holding Europe together. In this case convinced that what happened in the last century should not be allowed to happen again. A far better motive than the slimy spiv Farage, and his US cronies, Bannon, Bolton and the imbecile Trump have in their politics.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Oddmy you are off again on far right nonsense.
My ideology is based off the beliefs ironically of Benn and Foot on this issue.
Were they foam at the mouth Farage fans as well?
You are wrong about the original Roman Empire and you are wrong to make up my views for me. All drama and Faragisms. Farage repeats the same BS endlessly and people like you quit it as fact.
No, antique labour figures with a little socialist England wish.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
There we have it - bigotry and bile - join the club or you are old, retarded, unpleasant and to be despised. Back to the 30’s eh Mart?
Can someone explain why inflatables of Trump were allowed , whilst the same rubber stuff was taken down of Sadiq Khan.....it's all bullshit for me but why the the distinction ?! .........oh yes it's the usual crying from the snowflakes and bed wetters who somehow actually can't abide by alternative opinion.
dancers lance
Well-Known Member
Yeah, but the Romans were proper good at bumming, in fact, it is historically documented how good they were at bumming (part of daily life they drew pictures and shit) so stop being a homophobe, you racist.
SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
This is where I get confused by your/Mart arguments. 2014 EU elections had just over 40% turnout...& you happily accept that those elected are done so democratically - & that they represent the will of the people.
Just over 70% turnput for the EU referendum...but the result is deemed both non-representative & not accepted by you
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SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
Which tells us everything...they do not speak the same language.
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SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
Pot-kettle-black or what?
And I know you meant to say 'quote'...which makes your post even funnier...because it is a FACT that he HAS quit the EU with the majority vote!
You are priceless at times.
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dutchman
Well-Known Member
I was never a believer in socialism but in some ways I now long for a return of those days and so I understand also do a large proportion of the British (and Dutch) population.
Yes, in view of the way things seem to be veering off towards billionaires and hedge funds calling the tune, I can understand that. Profiteers like Putin and his oligarchs, Orban and his family, Erdogan making his son in law finance minister, Trump and his family business called the USA, and people like Farage and Rees Mogg trying to pull Britain into putting trade deals and deregulation above multinational cooperation in Europe. Then there is our press, like the Mail, mocking Corbyn and Khan for criticising the Trump visit. Who is going to halt populism which is the great distraction from where the money and power is actually going? I don’t want hard core socialism, but protections of our rights, well paid jobs, a social safety net, and a fair tax system without tax havens. Most of all I want a counterbalance to the Trumps, Bannon’s and Farages of this world who are cashing in big time on the populist wave in money and influence.
And, last, but not least, the environment. Little mention of that from the people I named.
Pot-kettle-black or what?
And I know you meant to say 'quote'...which makes your post even funnier...because it is a FACT that he HAS quit the EU with the majority vote!
You are priceless at times.
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Quit was probably apt in the case of the head quitter. My spell correcter obviously associated Farage with quitting. Yes, PR and the EU gave the hapless failed politician his stage.
He may have quit the EU, but unfortunately he hasn’t quit politics.
I don’t happily accept a low turn out. That is a factor in letting in extremism. The EU parliament should have more power. If it did, more people would vote. The countries prefer to keep their power in the Council and keep their veto rights. If the parliament had more power you would call it a superstate.
The result of the referendum is flawed in several ways. Classifying it as an advisory referendum and promising to implement it was a contradiction. Making it binary meant that no one will be happy as there are many interpretations as to what Brexit is and people couldn’t have known what Brexit will actually turn out to be. No one had a plan for leaving and no one had asked the EU what deal we would be offered if we left. Then we had the lies and abuse of social media. The collection and use of people‘s private information to influence them had not been regulated. Politicians didn’t even plan for it as they were not experts in that field. The emphasis on emotion over fact based argument does make the whole thing dubious.
The result being so close doesn’t give a strong mandate. You can’t just steamroller over half the population. It is not comparable to an election as there is no provision for voting the other way next time if it goes pear shaped.
And you cannot call it the will of the people when half the people don’t want it.