The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (22 Viewers)

[Astute]

You seem to spend an unhealthy amount of time on this thread attacking remain voters, it’s getting bizarre.

If I were you I’d carry on putting your energy and time into challenging the actual racists on this forum.

I have a go at the lies.

I am as desperate as you for it all to end up well and carry on as usual. But I will not lower myself to lies and backing up those who also want us to remain.

So why no reply to my post but changing the subject as usual. Oh yes he speaks out now against the UK and how thick leave voters are like yourself.

 

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[Astute]

I am not going through it yet again. You are constantly being corrected. Either you lie or you comprehend badly. Or both. You are not a neutral pillar of integrity. Even if you truly think you are.

Show me where I have been corrected then and the person correcting me was being truthful. There has yet to be evidence shown. Yet I have proven you to be wrong several times now.

 

[martcov]

Show me where I have been corrected then and the person correcting me was being truthful. There has yet to be evidence shown. Yet I have proven you to be wrong several times now.

No you haven’t proven me wrong. You just made that up.

Latest: you said that Juncker and Selmayr rule 500000 people. They don’t. You made that up.

It is easy to „prove people wrong“ by inventing what they say. You keep telling me what I admit to and how I say things which are wrong. Only problem is that you have invented it by putting words into my mouth that I didn’t say. The last couple of days on this thread show you doing it.

No idea what you get out of it.

 

[Sick Boy]

I have a go at the lies.

I am as desperate as you for it all to end up well and carry on as usual. But I will not lower myself to lies and backing up those who also want us to remain.

So why no reply to my post but changing the subject as usual. Oh yes he speaks out now against the UK and how thick leave voters are like yourself.

And you accuse others of telling lies.

I’ve never once called leave voters ‘thick’. I don’t think I’ve ever spoken out against the UK either.

As I said, you’d be better off challenging those actually trying to spread hatred on this forum.

 

[Astute]

And you accuse others of telling lies.

I’ve never once called leave voters ‘thick’. I don’t think I’ve ever spoken out against the UK either.

As I said, you’d be better off challenging those actually trying to spread hatred on this forum.

Which I did. And you jump in to defend Tony when nobody else has. Yet you say you don't defend anyone.

 

[Astute]

No you haven’t proven me wrong. You just made that up.

Latest: you said that Juncker and Selmayr rule 500000 people. They don’t. You made that up.

It is easy to „prove people wrong“ by inventing what they say. You keep telling me what I admit to and how I say things which are wrong. Only problem is that you have invented it by putting words into my mouth that I didn’t say. The last couple of days on this thread show you doing it.

No idea what you get out of it.

Lies again Mart. How about if I prove you wring about proving you wrong you finally admit to it and stop your lies?

 

[Sick Boy]

Which I did. And you jump in to defend Tony when nobody else has. Yet you say you don't defend anyone.

I’m pointing your own lies after you’ve claimed to hate liars.

 

[Astute]

I’m pointing your own lies after you’ve claimed to hate liars.

Show me them then. And with evidence instead of your normal allegations. Like when you said I lied when saying more people had left Romania than Ireland at any time since the potato famine. Even when all the evidence was in front of you all we got was you trying to fabricate evidence.

 

[Sick Boy]

Show me them then. And with evidence instead of your normal allegations. Like when you said I lied when saying more people had left Romania than Ireland at any time since the potato famine. Even when all the evidence was in front of you all we got was you trying to fabricate evidence.

I just pointed them out to you zzzzzzzz

 

[Astute]

I just pointed them out to you zzzzzzzz

You pointed nothing truthful out. As usual.

 

[Astute]

In fact you are right. For my sanity I am leaving this thread. You can congratulate each other. You can make up what you like. You can pat each other on the back as much as you like. And you won't have me bite anymore.

Have fun.

 

[martcov]

Lies again Mart. How about if I prove you wring about proving you wrong you finally admit to it and stop your lies?

It is you who keeps making things up. What lies are you on about?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

The younger voters voted remain. They know nothing else other than being in the EU. A cheaper mobile bill is important. And queuing up at a border is a disaster. And they are very intelligent because they were able to go to university where older voters had no choice but to go to work before they even left school.

Look at how many waste years and thousands taking studies that will never help. Not going to uni doesn't make someone thick. My eldest daughter didn't go to uni. She did the same as me. She worked and took qualifications that are work related whilst working. She is the youngest in her section but is in charge of it all. There was lots of disgruntled people until they saw change for the best. She is the only one that didn't go to uni. But if we check out intelligence the way you think shows it the best she would be considered to be thick.

There were some that voted whatever because of whatever. Yes we know. That doesn't mean anyone who voted either way is thick. People are not thick because they didn't vote the same way as us.

So most voted leave because they are lazy? That is a lazy statement.

So nobody voted remain because they were told that millions of jobs would be lost, millions of gravestones being mentioned and house prices would plummet if we voted leave. And this was echoed by those who should have known better.

You love to put your side to everything and ignore everything else. That is why you have a problem understanding what and why we are where we are now. Just like you tried to say it was my fault that house prices are too high and final salary pensions are about finished. You blamed my generation and the Tories for everything. But then went quiet when you found out who was really to blame for the pensions.

It is easy to blame what you don't like for anything. But it takes intelligence to think for yourself.

Let's weigh up the evidence. We know that most voted Leave because of immigration-there is no disputing that. We also know for a whole list of reasons why leaving the EU doesn't fix concerns about immigration and that it was already in our power to send EU migrants back if they didn't find work. To be aware of that and still cite it as a reason for leaving makes no sense. To not question the Daily Mail headlines or posh men in suits (Farage, Gove, Johnson, JRM) is where the problem starts. I never said that people who don't go to uni are thick. But can you explain why education was the strongest predictor of how people voted?

I didn't vote Remain for any of the reasons you describe. Most did so because of the economy, and those concerns are bearing fruit now and will be worse if we go out with no deal. I lived in Scotland during their own referendum (and got to vote). Their arguments for leaving were very similar to the Brexiteers and played on the lowest common denominator being won over by patriotic bullshit. I didn't need a politician to tell me the facts or how to vote. I looked at the balance of evidence, did some research and came to a conclusion. Despite hating Britain I curiously voted to keep it intact.

Your last paragraph again shows how poor your comprehension is. I never spoke about pensions, you brought it up as a straw man and are sticking to it. I did however speak about:

• Disastrous foreign policies under the Labour and Tory governments
• A 'who gives a fuck' attitude to the environment
• Crashing the economy with right wing economics because Jerry's probably a Trot
• My generation becoming the first to be worse off than the generation before
  
• Getting charged to pursue a degree in a shortage subject and then getting charged to train to teach a shortage subject

And let's take your pensions argument at face value and accept that Gordon Brown single-handedly wrecked the pensions system. Which generation is he from?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

The “hard data” regarding intelligence is in itself a lazy assumption. A 22 year old with a third at Northampton in David Beckham studies would be defined as a better educated than a CEO of a major business who hasn’t studied Becks.

So why was education the strongest predictor of how you voted?

 

[Grendel]

So why was education the strongest predictor of how you voted?

Because the young are the highest percentage of “educated” population and are as thick as pigshit due to the dumbing down of degrees to make the dumb believe they have a brain. The same dumbo intellectuals voted for Corbyn and Remain as they assumed they were one of the same.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Because the young are the highest percentage of “educated” population and are as thick as pigshit due to the dumbing down of degrees to make the dumb believe they have a brain. The same dumbo intellectuals voted for Corbyn and Remain as they assumed they were one of the same.

How dumbed down was my degree, in your opinion? Would you like a crack at it yourself?

 

[martcov]

Because the young are the highest percentage of “educated” population and are as thick as pigshit due to the dumbing down of degrees to make the dumb believe they have a brain. The same dumbo intellectuals voted for Corbyn and Remain as they assumed they were one of the same.

Back to insults. As usual. Do you seriously think that voting leave would have had made intellectuals less dumbo? Would you say that, up until this point of time, voting leave has been shown to be the cleverer decision? Quite frankly Corbyn comes across as a better person than Rees Mogg, BoJo, Redwood, Davis and the scum Farage. I wouldn’t like to be on the same side of history as them. Your dumbo intellectuals seem to have made better choices than yourself.

 

[Captain Dart]

Another factor that is swept under the carpet when considering education levels is how much the % of degree holders has increased. Very few people went to uni when I did (before that kink in the late 70's). Now its probably at least 1 in 3, the graph is from 2009.

This educational levels fallacy is used by Remoaners to slur older remain voters.

 

[martcov]

Another factor that is swept under the carpet when considering education levels is how much the % of degree holders has increased. Very few people went to uni when I did (before that kink in the late 70's). Now its probably at least 1 in 3, the graph is from 2009.

This educational levels fallacy is used by Remoaners to slur older remain voters.

How? It could be said that it is education not intelligence that meant that the older voters were less qualified than younger voters because of the education system at the time. Education was therefore the factor not intelligence ( in this example). On the other hand, not everyone who didn’t have university education in the 70s would have had it nowadays. So it is a factor, but not conclusive enough to say that all leave voters were clever enough for forms of further education or skilled qualifications. A university education is not necessarily a measure of intelligence though.

 

[SkyblueBazza]

Another factor that is swept under the carpet when considering education levels is how much the % of degree holders has increased. Very few people went to uni when I did (before that kink in the late 70's). Now its probably at least 1 in 3, the graph is from 2009.

This educational levels fallacy is used by Remoaners to slur older remain voters.

And of course it therefore could be argued that it was indeed the 'uneducated' that took us into what became the EU in the first place!

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

 

[Grappa]

Pretty consistent trend.

 

[skybluetony176]

BMW Mini warning

Toyota and BMW warn on no-deal Brexit

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

Back to insults. As usual. Do you seriously think that voting leave would have had made intellectuals less dumbo? Would you say that, up until this point of time, voting leave has been shown to be the cleverer decision? Quite frankly Corbyn comes across as a better person than Rees Mogg, BoJo, Redwood, Davis and the scum Farage. I wouldn’t like to be on the same side of history as them. Your dumbo intellectuals seem to have made better choices than yourself.

Hahaha. Do you say these things for fun ?

 

[shmmeee]

Let's weigh up the evidence. We know that most voted Leave because of immigration-there is no disputing that. We also know for a whole list of reasons why leaving the EU doesn't fix concerns about immigration and that it was already in our power to send EU migrants back if they didn't find work. To be aware of that and still cite it as a reason for leaving makes no sense. To not question the Daily Mail headlines or posh men in suits (Farage, Gove, Johnson, JRM) is where the problem starts. I never said that people who don't go to uni are thick. But can you explain why education was the strongest predictor of how people voted?

I didn't vote Remain for any of the reasons you describe. Most did so because of the economy, and those concerns are bearing fruit now and will be worse if we go out with no deal. I lived in Scotland during their own referendum (and got to vote). Their arguments for leaving were very similar to the Brexiteers and played on the lowest common denominator being won over by patriotic bullshit. I didn't need a politician to tell me the facts or how to vote. I looked at the balance of evidence, did some research and came to a conclusion. Despite hating Britain I curiously voted to keep it intact.

Your last paragraph again shows how poor your comprehension is. I never spoke about pensions, you brought it up as a straw man and are sticking to it. I did however speak about:

• Disastrous foreign policies under the Labour and Tory governments
• A 'who gives a fuck' attitude to the environment
• Crashing the economy with right wing economics because Jerry's probably a Trot
• My generation becoming the first to be worse off than the generation before
  
• Getting charged to pursue a degree in a shortage subject and then getting charged to train to teach a shortage subject

And let's take your pensions argument at face value and accept that Gordon Brown single-handedly wrecked the pensions system. Which generation is he from?

 

[shmmeee]

BMW Mini warning

Toyota and BMW warn on no-deal Brexit

Sounds like a pretty big warning to me (sorry)

 

[shmmeee]

I’m just gonna say it: I’ve still yet to see an intelligent Brexiteer.

Whatever the reasons, I’ve honestly never seen one. Not in the media, not in person.

Sorry if that upsets people but it’s true. Like I’ve never seen an intelligent homeopath.

I know we are not supposed to say it because it upsets them, but I’m not convinced patronising them is any better.

For balance, I’ve not met an unemployed Remainer either.

It’s not a value judgement. Some people are better at processing information, some people understand the issues at the bottom of society. Some people are really good at the guitar (I have no idea how that impacts Brexit)

 

[martcov]

Hahaha. Do you say these things for fun ?

You are too dim to notice that the people I insult are the thick ones, the ones who insult me or the ones who insult others. You fulfill all categories dumbfxxk.

 

[skybluetony176]

Aaron Banks is C4 headline news. Something to do with gold bullion deals and the Kremlin. Still he’s previous denied having any relationship with Russia so it’s clearly fake news.

 

[skybluetony176]

One of the people he’s been linked to was a “diplomat” who was kicked out as a spy following the Skripal poisoning.

 

[skybluetony176]

If you haven’t seen it it’s worth watching on C4+1 or catch up if it’s available. Part 2 is being aired tomorrow night.

 

[martcov]

If you haven’t seen it it’s worth watching on C4+1 or catch up if it’s available. Part 2 is being aired tomorrow night.

Yeah. He claims he wasn’t interested, but the correspondence shows he was. He claims the report is 24 carat bollocks. The criminal investigations are still ongoing. He also bragged about the interest in the US about Brexit and his contacts there whilst trying to get in with the Russians. Still would be nice to know where his 8 million contribution came from. It came via his IOM company which is problematic as it is hard to check the original source of the money.

 

[martcov]

Emmanuel Macron: Dear Europe, Brexit is a lesson for all of us: it’s time for renewal

Extra for Astute. Reform the EU.

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

You are too dim to notice that the people I insult are the thick ones, the ones who insult me or the ones who insult others. You fulfill all categories dumbfxxk.

You are one of the thickest people on this forum, gobbing off the usual deranged nonsense on an hourly basis in order to try and convince an unimpressed public that you know everything about everything . Get out in the fresh air once in a while you sad pensioner.
When is pension day by the way ?

 

[dutchman]

I’m just gonna say it: I’ve still yet to see an intelligent Brexiteer.

You don't consider James Dyson to be intelligent?

 

[Captain Dart]

Latest conspiracy theory.
When I'm King: Duplicitous leaders

There is no doubt about the veracity of this account since documents have been seen.
On Monday July 9th 2018, several leading French, German and Dutch senior managers were called by EU officials to an urgent meeting.
The meeting was said to be private and those present were informed that Prime Minister May and Chancellor Merkel had reached an Agreement over Brexit. Knowledge of this was attained from the actual transcript of the meeting between May and Merkel.
1) The Agreement was couched in a way to 'appease' the Brexit voters.
2) The Agreement would enable May to get rid of those people in her party who were against progress and unity in the EU.
3) Both Merkel and May agreed that the likely course of events would be that UK would re-join the EU in full at some time after the next general election.
4) May agreed to keep as many EU laws and institutions as she could despite the current groundswell of 'anti-EU hysteria' in Britain (May's own words, apparently.)
5) Merkel and May agreed that the only realistic future for the UK was within the EU.
The original Agreement draft was completed in May 2018 in Berlin and then sent to the UK Government Cabinet Office marked 'Secret'.
NB This Agreement draft was authored in the German Chancellor's private office.
The Cabinet returned the Agreement draft with suggestions, and there was some to-ing and fro-ing during June 5th 2018.
Private calls between the Prime Minister and Chancellor were made.
The Agreement's final draft came out late in June 2018. The German Chancellor told Prime Minister May that this was a deal she would support, though there would need to be some more small concessions by the UK to keep the EU happy.
The Chancellor and Prime Minister met in Germany. Merkel had this meeting recorded as a 'private meeting' though the Prime Minister was probably unaware of that.
The Chancellor had the transcript of that meeting circulated secretly to EU and key German embassies.
Conclusions
Documents make it quite clear that Prime Minister May was negotiating with Germany, not the EU.
The transcript also makes it clear that the Prime Minister intended to keep all this secret from minsters, especially the Brexit group.
She wants to keep as many EU institutions in UK as intact as possible in order to facilitate an easy return to the EU after 2020.
Chancellor Merkel briefed May on tactics to force Cabinet approval.
The Prime Minister and senior civil servants were working with Germany to stop Brexit or water it down to prevent free trade and the ending of freedom of movement, but to keep cash flowing to the EU.
David Davis was kept in the dark while key EU premiers in France, Holland and Ireland were briefed in full.
Key EU heads were actually briefed in full the day before the Cabinet meeting at Chequers.