Time for Plain Speaking (3 Viewers)

Grendel · Mar 11, 2014

spider_ricoh said:
How about the day I stood with 4k other Cov fans at the Valley watching us apparently sinking to relegation with a pitiful performance just to be saved by the width of a post?

Or travelling half way across the country and spending an afternoon in the pouring rain and watching us surrender to Bristol City in a game that virtually condemned us to relegation?

Or spending of day of my life watching huff and puff to a 1-1 draw at Yeovil

Or traipsing half way across the country the other way to watch a disgraceful performance under Dowie at Norwich 0-2

Or getting to Brentford on a weeknight to see us collapse in the last minute?

Or going to Leyton Orient away twice this season?

Or watching us get thrashed on a week night at Millwall and then abused by their fans on the train home?

Or spending a day of my life watching us get destroyed 4-0 by fecking Walsall?

I actually do all of these things because I love ACL and have no regard for CCFC at all ... you idiot

The fact you are so outraged at the breaking of an outrageous lease that have the club no hope for the future tells me all I need to know about you I'm afraid.

Astute · Mar 11, 2014

Grendel said:
The fact you are so outraged at the breaking of an outrageous lease that have the club no hope for the future tells me all I need to know about you I'm afraid.

It is more likely seen as outrageous that some try to blame ACL for the admin process that made SISU able to break the contract. I suppose ACL were to blame for Appleton being chosen as well.

spider_ricoh · Mar 11, 2014

Grendel said:
The fact you are so outraged at the breaking of an outrageous lease that have the club no hope for the future tells me all I need to know about you I'm afraid.

A court of law found the lease to be perfectly valid and ordered CCFC to cough up - so by law, no outrageous. The only thing outrageous here is SISU claiming ACL "leech off" revenues generated at ACL's (not CCFC's!!!) stadium. If you want the revenues, make a sensible offer for the ground of £14m+.

You may be a CCFC fan but you're clearly no fan of common decency.

torchomatic · Mar 11, 2014

spider_ricoh said:
A court of law found the lease to be perfectly valid and ordered CCFC to cough up - so by law, no outrageous. The only thing outrageous here is SISU claiming ACL "leech off" revenues generated at ACL's (not CCFC's!!!) stadium. If you want the revenues, make a sensible offer for the ground of £14m+.

You may be a CCFC fan but you're clearly no fan of common decency.

I dont argue that the rent deal was valid and lawful. It was just crippling the club financially which, wrongly, made SISU start the rent strike.

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Grendel · Mar 11, 2014

spider_ricoh said:
A court of law found the lease to be perfectly valid and ordered CCFC to cough up - so by law, no outrageous. The only thing outrageous here is SISU claiming ACL "leech off" revenues generated at ACL's (not CCFC's!!!) stadium. If you want the revenues, make a sensible offer for the ground of £14m+.

You may be a CCFC fan but you're clearly no fan of common decency.

I only care about the club if The consequence of the clubs return was ACL disappear I think you'll find the vast majority of supporters wouldn't care less.

It would be a just and fitting outcome.

Mary_Mungo_Midge · Mar 11, 2014

torchomatic said:
I dont argue that the rent deal was valid and lawful. It was just crippling the club financially which, wrongly, made SISU start the rent strike.

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Let's not peddle the hyperbole here. Was it way too high. Yes. Without question. However, a touch of context please.

At the time of administration, the entirity of the rentals paid during SISU's tenure was only circa. 10% of the stated debt level; comparing gate receipts to rent at the time they arrived at the club (even the high rent) was only about 10-15% of the gate receipts, and given we all handed over shares for free against the promise of a 'debt-free club', the original rent was only in-line with 'interest charges' we've since been levied with.....

The rent was 'crippling' the club no more, or no less than the contracts SISU gifted to Bell, McSheffrey and Wood

ccfcway · Mar 11, 2014

torchomatic said:
I dont argue that the rent deal was valid and lawful. It was just crippling the club financially

a 1.2 million rent was crippling a club in a huge amount of debt ?

torchomatic · Mar 11, 2014

Grendel said:
I only care about the club if The consequence of the clubs return was ACL disappear I think you'll find the vast majority of supporters wouldn't care less.

It would be a just and fitting outcome.

As long as t h d club come home then I really dont care what happens to acl, ccc or SISU.

Similarly don't care what the outcome of the JR is as long as we return to the Ricoh.

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torchomatic · Mar 11, 2014

ccfcway said:
a 1.2 million rent was crippling a club in a huge amount of debt ?

Yep. Before Sisu arrived the previous board also wanted to renegotiate the rent.

If the rents too high then the rents too high regardless of the circumstances.

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Grendel · Mar 11, 2014

ccfcway said:
a 1.2 million rent was crippling a club in a huge amount of debt ?

If the level of your contribution is inane sound bites like this why bother posting on here?

Mary_Mungo_Midge · Mar 11, 2014

torchomatic said:
As long as t h d club come home then I really dont care what happens to acl, ccc or SISU.

Similarly don't care what the outcome of the JR is as long as we return to the Ricoh.

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Well, that's a shame, as I'd rather if and when the Ricoh (or ACL) is sold, it's done so to a party that's genuinely interested in using it's income and profile to the benefit of the football club; not to the benefit of it's offshore investors.

It's like virginity, when it's gone, it's gone for good. Let's at least have someone interested in CCFC popping that particular cherry, eh?

torchomatic · Mar 11, 2014

Oh, I agree, which is why I didn’t jump on the “sell, sell to PH4” bandwagon as we didn’t know anything about him. From the frying pan into the fire and all that.

Ideally for me, the club would own its own ground 100% without the outside interference of a landlord, be they a council entity or not. I care not a jot for CCC, ACL or SISU.

And yes, any deal should solely benefit the club, not offshore investors, faceless owners or the local council and its joint venture shenanigans. Probably never happen, but it would be nice.

Mary_Mungo_Midge said:
Well, that's a shame, as I'd rather if and when the Ricoh (or ACL) is sold, it's done so to a party that's genuinely interested in using it's income and profile to the benefit of the football club; not to the benefit of it's offshore investors.

It's like virginity, when it's gone, it's gone for good. Let's at least have someone interested in CCFC popping that particular cherry, eh?

stupot07 · Mar 11, 2014

Mary_Mungo_Midge said:
Let's not peddle the hyperbole here. Was it way too high. Yes. Without question. However, a touch of context please.

At the time of administration, the entirity of the rentals paid during SISU's tenure was only circa. 10% of the stated debt level; comparing gate receipts to rent at the time they arrived at the club (even the high rent) was only about 10-15% of the gate receipts, and given we all handed over shares for free against the promise of a 'debt-free club', the original rent was only in-line with 'interest charges' we've since been levied with.....

The rent was 'crippling' the club no more, or no less than the contracts SISU gifted to Bell, McSheffrey and Wood

Sorry but that's incorrect, our highest gate receipts at the Ricoh was was circa £5.7m and that was the first seasons with 21.1k fans and a couple of cup games so even then it was over 20% of gate receipts. When we were back to our Highfield road 'norm' circa £3.9m (16k) then rent was 30% of our ticket revenue.

I completely agree that wages were equally or more so to blame for crippling the club.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

Mary_Mungo_Midge · Mar 11, 2014

stupot07 said:
Sorry but that's incorrect, our highest gate receipts at the Ricoh was was circa £5.7m and that was the first seasons with 21.1k fans and a couple of cup games so even then it was over 20% of gate receipts. When we were back to our Highfield road 'norm' circa £3.9m (16k) then rent was 30% of our ticket revenue.

I completely agree that wages were equally or more so to blame for crippling the club.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

My figures take into account corporate income too in the broadest sense of 'gate receipts' insomuch as it's match-day income. But to an extent, it's splitting infinitives, as to whether it was 13, 16 or 19%.

It was an unhelpful rent level, I agree; but not in isolation as the primary factor in us being where we are.

The magnitude and wisdom of the contracts given to Wood, McSheffrey and Bell - looking back now in hindsight - is astonishing. But it was a SISU decision, with a SISU man at the helm who signed on the dotted line

spider_ricoh · Mar 11, 2014

Grendel said:
I only care about the club if The consequence of the clubs return was ACL disappear I think you'll find the vast majority of supporters wouldn't care less.

It would be a just and fitting outcome.

That's like saying you're only interested in your own welfare and don;t care about anyone else. My welfare would be a lot better if I mugged the old bloke living next door to me, taking all his money and food for myself. I don't do that though because IT'S WRONG

Your problem mate is that you can't see the bigger picture - the club have screwed over other people and made a mess of things in the process. We all want a good solution but it's not reasonable to expect CCC, ACL etc to compromise when SISU have screwed them so badly.

Jack Griffin · Mar 11, 2014

Godiva said:
Say you own three companies. One company owns the other two. How richer or how poorer would you be if you let one company pay a rent or an interest to the other company?

What if you sold the company paying rent with a long lease and retained the one charging rent.. ..

No future with SISU · Mar 11, 2014

Godiva said:
Not for me to predict - ask the people with the spread sheets. I can hope it happens soon if the club get to buy ACL, but I was told yesterday that 'the majority' of fans do not want that. So no pressure on the CCC to bring the club home. Then there's the chance - 'the majority' would say risk - that sisu wins the JR and gain some leverage that forces the CCC to negotiate a sale. Finally there's the long term solution where the club have to build its own stadium.

SISU forecast 3,000 to 7,000 fans at northampton. They have to get £30m on forcasts of 12,000 gates, would any sane person give them £30m after looking at their history at coventry.

blueflint · Mar 11, 2014

Nick said:
Or because they just don't agree with your opinion?

if i said black was white and vice versa they would argue the other way because thats what they do

Nick · Mar 11, 2014

blueflint said:
if i said black was white and vice versa they would argue the other way because thats what they do

Jeez, ever thought it was just because they don't agree with your views?

shmmeee · Mar 11, 2014

Grendel said:
If the level of your contribution is inane sound bites like this why bother posting on here?

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