Trump is my favourite comedian of the year already (33 Viewers)

[Brighton Sky Blue]

It would though

How?

 

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[Mcbean]

Aren't you a bit old for that sort of thing?

Yes - but surely we have a ready supply of soldiers coming off the boats ?

 

[Grendel]

Suppose the US does nothing and allows Putin to wipe Ukraine off the map. What good does that do anyone?

You are not really addressing the argument being made. They don’t want peace they want a slow war that takes years and years and hundreds of thousands of deaths.

Well they did - it seems the policy is changing

 

[SBT]

You are not really addressing the argument being made. They don’t want peace they want a slow war that takes years and years and hundreds of thousands of deaths.

Well they did - it seems the policy is changing

How does an end to the war with Russia seizing control of Ukrainian land help the United States?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

You are not really addressing the argument being made. They don’t want peace they want a slow war that takes years and years and hundreds of thousands of deaths.

Well they did - it seems the policy is changing

I haven’t argued against the point that a drawn out war is in the interest of the US military industrial complex. Trump is always keen to be seen to have made a deal regardless of whether it’s any good or not.

A deal has to involve a robust safeguard against future invasion if saving human life really is the goal.

 

[Grendel]

How does an end to the war with Russia seizing control of Ukrainian land help the United States?

It saves £40 billion and will not cause them any harm

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

It saves £40 billion and will not cause them any harm

US military expenditure is over $1 trillion

 

[Grendel]

US military expenditure is over $1 trillion

So what? How will Ukraine surrendering territory negatively impact the US?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

So what? How will Ukraine surrendering territory negatively impact the US?

How will a surrender agreement prevent another invasion and more loss of life?

 

[Grendel]

How will a surrender agreement prevent another invasion and more loss of life?

Why are you refusing to actually answer the question I’ve posed?

Also it’s not as if there’s been no precedent for this is there?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Why are you refusing to actually answer the question I’ve posed?

Also it’s not as if there’s been no precedent for this is there?

I believe I asked the question first and have never had an answer to it from the pro Putin crowd

 

[SBT]

It saves £40 billion and will not cause them any harm

So your previous rationale for why the US was prolonging the war was incorrect then? You were adamant that an everlasting war was a dream scenario for the Americans.

 

[Grendel]

So your previous rationale for why the US was prolonging the war was incorrect then? You were adamant that an everlasting war was a dream scenario for the Americans.

Under the prior regime it was

 

[Grendel]

I believe I asked the question first and have never had an answer to it from the pro Putin crowd

“the pro Putin crowd”

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

“the pro Putin crowd”

Again not answering.

 

[Grendel]

Again not answering.

What question are you talking about?

 

[Grendel]

The other issue here is that if the US do withdraw why is that the end?

The Uk and Europe can choose to double its support. This will mean no doubt more taxation, more reductions in benefit support but if people think sacrifice is worth it I assume they will be prepared to lower living standards to protect Ukraine?

 

[SBT]

Under the prior regime it was

So all of the benefits flowing to American energy and military/industrial interests from the war have either ceased to exist or ceased to matter?

 

[Grendel]

So all of the benefits flowing to American energy and military/industrial interests from the war have either ceased to exist or ceased to matter?

Or they never existed in the first place? Or could be replaced by an alternate strategy?

 

[SBT]

Or they never existed in the first place? Or could be replaced by an alternate strategy?

Well again, you seemed pretty sure they existed not so long ago.

If the US only ever acts in its own interests as you say, then it stands to reason that two opposite strategies - indefinitely prolonging, and immediately ending the war - are unlikely to deliver equally effective results for Uncle Sam.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Correct on the first sentence. Without American help Putin would have taken the whole country.

What good would that have done?

@Grendel

 

[Sick Boy]

I haven’t argued against the point that a drawn out war is in the interest of the US military industrial complex. Trump is always keen to be seen to have made a deal regardless of whether it’s any good or not.

A deal has to involve a robust safeguard against future invasion if saving human life really is the goal.

They've already got eyes on exploiting Ukraine for its minerals and will no doubt be heavily involved in the rebuild and of course profiteering from it.

 

[PVA]

Under the prior regime it was

So given the US only ever acts in its best interests then presumably Biden was a genius and Trump is a fucking idiot for giving up such advantages?

Or were you just wrong?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

They've already got eyes on exploiting Ukraine for its minerals and will no doubt be heavily involved in the rebuild and of course profiteering from it.

What if Putin wants to come back for more?

 

[Grendel]

So given the US only ever acts in its best interests then presumably Biden was a genius and Trump is a fucking idiot for giving up such advantages?

Or were you just wrong?

Well I hardly think Biden was a genius - and I’m sure they will be a rebuild programme coming which the US can of course assist with. Oh and I think the strategy itself was stupid and agreed to by a stupid senile old man.

Trump has always been against spend on wars that don’t impact the US

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Well I hardly think Biden was a genius - and I’m sure they will be a rebuild programme coming which the US can of course assist with. Oh and I think the strategy itself was stupid and agreed to by a stupid senile old man.

Trump has always been against spend on wars that don’t impact the US

So why did he keep the US in Afghanistan while Biden took them out?

 

[PVA]

Well I hardly think Biden was a genius - and I’m sure they will be a rebuild programme coming which the US can of course assist with. Oh and I think the strategy itself was stupid and agreed to by a stupid senile old man.

Trump has always been against spend on wars that don’t impact the US

So it was in the best interests of the US to keep war going but also it has no impact on the US.

 

[Grendel]

So it was in the best interests of the US to keep war going but also it has no impact on the US.

Another amazingly constructed response along with a silly GIF from someone who has repeatedly claimed Ukraine can win a war in never had a chance in.

Also I repeat this is not anything entirely new and I think Roosevelt was somewhat more enlightened than Mr Biden, Trump or someone who is obsessed with big tanks.

You do also get the interests can be changed to granting construction rights to make billions for the US - yes?

 

[PVA]

Another amazingly constructed response along with a silly GIF from someone who has repeatedly claimed Ukraine can win a war in never had a chance in.

Also I repeat this is not anything entirely new and I think Roosevelt was somewhat more enlightened than Mr Biden, Trump or someone who is obsessed with big tanks.

You do also get the interests can be changed to granting construction rights to make billions for the US - yes?

Haha literally making it up as you go along. Either Trump doesn't have the US' best interests in mind, or you were wrong. Pick one.

 

[fernandopartridge]

So given the US only ever acts in its best interests then presumably Biden was a genius and Trump is a fucking idiot for giving up such advantages?

Or were you just wrong?

The advantages they've had are now baked in and established:

 

[Grendel]

What I really would be interested in is those who not agree with this war ending actually want to happen? More death, torture and destruction? If its accepted the only reason the US want this to carry on under Biden was to continue this I am staggered people who see themselves as libertarians want the death to persist

 

[Grendel]

Haha literally making it up as you go along. Either Trump doesn't have the US' best interests in mind, or you were wrong. Pick one.

He clearly does and will be far more interested in capital projects with the other super powers.

At least you admit you want the misery and destruction to continue.

 

[SkyBlueDom26]

The advantages they've had are now baked in and established:

View attachment 41543

Trump will be 100x better for the USA than Biden ever was, sleepy joe was useless

 

[PVA]

He clearly does and will be far more interested in capital projects with the other super powers.

At least you admit you want the misery and destruction to continue.

Capital projects is not some cunning masterplan of the orange idiot, they've been talked about (and agreed) for ages.

 

[SBT]

What I really would be interested in is those who not agree with this war ending actually want to happen? More death, torture and destruction? If its accepted the only reason the US want this to carry on under Biden was to continue this I am staggered people who see themselves as libertarians want the death to persist

I would like to see a negotiated settlement which isn’t so lopsided or restrictive so as to be unsustainable, or likely to cause further misery and suffering for those caught on the wrong side of the conflict. Opposing that kind of settlement simply isn’t the same as actively wanting more death - that’s what negotiation is for.