Gina Miller went to court to ensure that British sovereignty was up held following the leave vote. At no point did she attempt to overturn the vote, in fact she ensured that the vote was upheld to the latter. Ironically it’s those that voted leave that didn’t want their vote honoured to the latter. Anyone who voted leave and doesn’t understand that then they quite frankly don’t understand what they voted for.The vote looks tight for me. Maybe they should have another one? Not sure everyone knew what they were voting for.
Presumably all those that had no issue with Gina Miller will understand if this goes to court too it is fair.
I don't care who wins, but all those frothing over democracy now were the same people demanding 'a people's vote'. Kind of funny.
Gina Miller went to court to ensure that British sovereignty was up held following the leave vote. At no point did she attempt to overturn the vote, in fact she ensured that the vote was upheld to the latter. Ironically it’s those that voted leave that didn’t want their vote honoured to the latter. Anyone who voted leave and doesn’t understand that then they quite frankly don’t understand what they voted for.
It’s a spectrum isn’t it. If trump had been reasoned and responsible like Biden in his speeches the spectrum would have been limited to law and a few protests. His actions and words mean the spectrum is magnified and you can genuinely see a roadmap that ends up with open civil war in the country. I can in any case and it’s so so sadAnyone else think things could end up getting really messy? Loads of protests already from both sides
Anyone else think things could end up getting really messy? Loads of protests already from both sides
The difference is one candidate is making conciliatory statements and one is fanning the flames.
That's exactly why he has to go in my opinion. He's not fit to be leader of the free world. Don't get me wrong, I think Biden will be poor but at least he won't stoke a civil war
Naaa. Trump supporters are crystal clear in their messageAnyone else think things could end up getting really messy? Loads of protests already from both sides
The difference is one candidate is making conciliatory statements and one is fanning the flames.
That's exactly why he has to go in my opinion. He's not fit to be leader of the free world. Don't get me wrong, I think Biden will be poor but at least he won't stoke a civil war
Look at those good Christian white woman demonstrating to ensure their fellow Americans votes dont countNaaa. Trump supporters are crystal clear in their message
The demographics of those protesting are interesting.Look at those good Christian white woman demonstrating to ensure their fellow Americans votes dont count
Hence my bit in brackets.
Pretty easy to manipulate in this day and age. It's a shambolic system. As I said earlier, even if there is genuinely is not any election fraud, it looks very fishy. For anyone involved.
Anyone else think things could end up getting really messy? Loads of protests already from both sides
I do see your point and like with the Georgia vote counters all being sent home with 10% to count it just looks dodgy as fuck even though that isn't necessarily the case.
Maybe postal voting should have an earlier cut-off (if you've not done it by the day of the election it's kind of on you and why ask for a postal vote in the first place?) or have special collection/delivery to ensure each vote is collected and counted and the voter can track it to make sure their vote has been processed (although I think they already have something akin to this in place). Of course part of the problem was the Trump-supporting Postmaster General appeared to be deliberately making it so that ballots were taking a long time to be sorted.
If you haven't posted it a few days from the election then maybe they should say they will have to take it to a local polling station on the day to be put in a drop-box to ensure it gets there on time and will be counted, but it would have to be ensured they are done carefully because this would likely have some ballots posted that related to a different state (hence why they asked for a postal vote in the first place) so they need to be easily distinguishable. This of course will only open up more accusations of fraud and in theory make it easier.
You could argue that get rid of the electoral college and do it by popular vote and the need to be in a particular state is null and void - only those abroad on polling day really need to worry (along with the infirm, housebound, hospitalised etc). But at the same time this is also potentially even more open to fraud as people can vote somewhere, drive a few hours to a different state and try and vote there so you need a system that can tell who has and hasn't voted that is available in real time nationwide with a few hundred million people on it. With their tech expertise over there it should be possible (but if not we could always send Dido Harding to sort it for them I guess)
There's not an easy answer as each method presents its own problems and snidy fucks in politics will exploit each and every one of them.
*sorry, this turned into a bit of a thinking out loud post.
I don’t disagree. In a UK context, I’m a Labour voter and not switching anytime soon.
Without getting into the nuts and bolts of this, people just didn’t flip to Trump for no reason. Like many Labour strongholds, areas like Penn, Wisconsin and particularly Michigan have seen these areas lose their manufacturing jobs abroad. If the Democrats were at least perceived to be fighting for their interests, they’d still be beating the Republicans comfortably in these states.
If the Democrats learn from their battles with Trump (which they probably won’t), the changing demographics makes it entirely possible that they could dominate for 3 or 4 elections.
What are the odds on Trump going again in 2024?
I do see your point and like with the Georgia vote counters all being sent home with 10% to count it just looks dodgy as fuck even though that isn't necessarily the case.
Maybe postal voting should have an earlier cut-off (if you've not done it by the day of the election it's kind of on you and why ask for a postal vote in the first place?) or have special collection/delivery to ensure each vote is collected and counted and the voter can track it to make sure their vote has been processed (although I think they already have something akin to this in place). Of course part of the problem was the Trump-supporting Postmaster General appeared to be deliberately making it so that ballots were taking a long time to be sorted.
If you haven't posted it a few days from the election then maybe they should say they will have to take it to a local polling station on the day to be put in a drop-box to ensure it gets there on time and will be counted, but it would have to be ensured they are done carefully because this would likely have some ballots posted that related to a different state (hence why they asked for a postal vote in the first place) so they need to be easily distinguishable. This of course will only open up more accusations of fraud and in theory make it easier.
You could argue that get rid of the electoral college and do it by popular vote and the need to be in a particular state is null and void - only those abroad on polling day really need to worry (along with the infirm, housebound, hospitalised etc). But at the same time this is also potentially even more open to fraud as people can vote somewhere, drive a few hours to a different state and try and vote there so you need a system that can tell who has and hasn't voted that is available in real time nationwide with a few hundred million people on it. With their tech expertise over there it should be possible (but if not we could always send Dido Harding to sort it for them I guess)
There's not an easy answer as each method presents its own problems and snidy fucks in politics will exploit each and every one of them.
*sorry, this turned into a bit of a thinking out loud post.
It's not the first time either, he claimed that the Democrats bussed in millions of 'illegals' to vote in California. Which would make probably even less sense than this shit he's peddling now
Abolishing the electoral college is nonsense. Firstly, it requires constitutional change - around 66% in favour in Congress and/or the Senate. Secondly, and most importantly, it puts the power firmly into the hands of the largest states, California, Texas, NY and Florida.
In a UK context, we would let the city of London decide the outcome of national elections.
They will say the virus was put here to judge us for our sins
Have to say, thank God we don't drag ours out this long! I know we're nowhere near as big and all that, but this is mentally drawn out. Will it ever end, or will they still be suing in four years?
And indirectly through the candidates and media being obsessed with the marketLondon has a lot more say over who wins an election than say Burnley due to the number of MPs it elects.
lvanka I reckon. Big play about first woman President.
Some good points and I agree with most of what you said there.
I think considering the postal votes were started so early, having a cut off so they could announce it all at one time would make a lot more sense. I have seen a lot of reports of people finding bulk ballot papers in bins and stuff but it is difficult to know what to believe. As you say, even if something dodgy hasn't happened, it sure as shit looks a bit suspicious.
Ultimately everybody wants people in power who align with their own beliefs... Which is effectively what you're saying here... And that's fine tbhI really hope the removal of the orange, anti-truth, uber fuckhead will signal a world movement towards fucking common sense and decency. We don't half need it.
London has a lot more say over who wins an election than say Burnley due to the number of MPs it elects.
It may to us but states have different rules and it’s perfectly legitimate to count every vote received by Election Day. If other states are going to take a few days counting then the decision is fine. If sometime arbitrarily decides that only votes that can be counted on the day then probably someone should tell the states and maybe change the legislation before accusing people of fraudI do see your point and like with the Georgia vote counters all being sent home with 10% to count it just looks dodgy as fuck even though that isn't necessarily the case.
Maybe postal voting should have an earlier cut-off (if you've not done it by the day of the election it's kind of on you and why ask for a postal vote in the first place?) or have special collection/delivery to ensure each vote is collected and counted and the voter can track it to make sure their vote has been processed (although I think they already have something akin to this in place). Of course part of the problem was the Trump-supporting Postmaster General appeared to be deliberately making it so that ballots were taking a long time to be sorted.
If you haven't posted it a few days from the election then maybe they should say they will have to take it to a local polling station on the day to be put in a drop-box to ensure it gets there on time and will be counted, but it would have to be ensured they are done carefully because this would likely have some ballots posted that related to a different state (hence why they asked for a postal vote in the first place) so they need to be easily distinguishable. This of course will only open up more accusations of fraud and in theory make it easier.
You could argue that get rid of the electoral college and do it by popular vote and the need to be in a particular state is null and void - only those abroad on polling day really need to worry (along with the infirm, housebound, hospitalised etc). But at the same time this is also potentially even more open to fraud as people can vote somewhere, drive a few hours to a different state and try and vote there so you need a system that can tell who has and hasn't voted that is available in real time nationwide with a few hundred million people on it. With their tech expertise over there it should be possible (but if not we could always send Dido Harding to sort it for them I guess)
There's not an easy answer as each method presents its own problems and snidy fucks in politics will exploit each and every one of them.
*sorry, this turned into a bit of a thinking out loud post.
You know there’s a pandemic on don’t you. I think most people thought a postal vote made sense this year. It really is no surprise there are so manyI do see your point and like with the Georgia vote counters all being sent home with 10% to count it just looks dodgy as fuck even though that isn't necessarily the case.
Maybe postal voting should have an earlier cut-off (if you've not done it by the day of the election it's kind of on you and why ask for a postal vote in the first place?) or have special collection/delivery to ensure each vote is collected and counted and the voter can track it to make sure their vote has been processed (although I think they already have something akin to this in place). Of course part of the problem was the Trump-supporting Postmaster General appeared to be deliberately making it so that ballots were taking a long time to be sorted.
If you haven't posted it a few days from the election then maybe they should say they will have to take it to a local polling station on the day to be put in a drop-box to ensure it gets there on time and will be counted, but it would have to be ensured they are done carefully because this would likely have some ballots posted that related to a different state (hence why they asked for a postal vote in the first place) so they need to be easily distinguishable. This of course will only open up more accusations of fraud and in theory make it easier.
You could argue that get rid of the electoral college and do it by popular vote and the need to be in a particular state is null and void - only those abroad on polling day really need to worry (along with the infirm, housebound, hospitalised etc). But at the same time this is also potentially even more open to fraud as people can vote somewhere, drive a few hours to a different state and try and vote there so you need a system that can tell who has and hasn't voted that is available in real time nationwide with a few hundred million people on it. With their tech expertise over there it should be possible (but if not we could always send Dido Harding to sort it for them I guess)
There's not an easy answer as each method presents its own problems and snidy fucks in politics will exploit each and every one of them.
*sorry, this turned into a bit of a thinking out loud post.
That’s a really sensible ideaReally don't think they should release counts as they go on, either. That just stokes the flames. Just say what the final total was!
I hear what you are saying. With Trump though I think it is pretty indisputable that he's not a decent person. Which is the point with him before you even begin to look at policies.Ultimately everybody wants people in power who align with their own beliefs... Which is effectively what you're saying here... And that's fine tbh
Some good points and I agree with most of what you said there.
I think considering the postal votes were started so early, having a cut off so they could announce it all at one time would make a lot more sense. I have seen a lot of reports of people finding bulk ballot papers in bins and stuff but it is difficult to know what to believe. As you say, even if something dodgy hasn't happened, it sure as shit looks a bit suspicious.
You still haven’t explained why it’s suspicious for votes which are postmarked before Election Day to be counted after Election Day. Nor have you got any evidence of anyone doing it, let alone any evidence of why it would be a good idea for fixing an election in the first place.
The ONLY reason most of the postal ballots haven’t been counted yet is because (mostly Republican) lawmakers in some states insist on waiting to count them. That’s it. Even Florida has its shit together, which is why it was called days ago.
I personally don’t mind if you want to spend another day peddling weirdo Trump talking points from Breitbart or wherever, but there are much more entertaining ones you can try - drugs, human trafficking, alien conspiracy theories, all kinds of stuff. Anything but this postal vote bollocks.
It may to us but states have different rules and it’s perfectly legitimate to count every vote received by Election Day. If other states are going to take a few days counting then the decision is fine. If sometime arbitrarily decides that only votes that can be counted on the day then probably someone should tell the states and maybe change the legislation before accusing people of fraud
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