USSR invades Ukraine. (26 Viewers)

[Otis]

So you did oppose Blair’s illegal war?

I did. I was a fan of his pretty much until that point. I really disliked him from that point on.

 

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[skybluetony176]

I did. I was a fan of his pretty much until that point. I really disliked him from that point on.

I really don’t know one person who didn’t oppose it. I really don’t know one person who didn’t despise Tony Blair after. I also don’t know one person who after the event, lack of weapons of mass destruction and the dressed up dossier that turned out to be nothing more than a student’s hypothetical thesis hasn’t come to the conclusion that Blair should have been put in front of The Hague.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

I really don’t know one person who didn’t oppose it. I really don’t know one person who didn’t despise Tony Blair after. I also don’t know one person who after the event, lack of weapons of mass destruction and the dressed up dossier that turned out to be nothing more than a student’s hypothetical thesis hasn’t come to the conclusion that Blair should have been put in front of The Hague.

It didn’t undo all the good he did before it for me thoigh

 

[skybluetony176]

It didn’t undo all the good he did before it for me thoigh

It did for me. I recognise his achievements Middle East aside but the gulf war, especially the second did more damage than just an unjustified war. It’s been a recruitment tool for Islamic extremism that has probably done more damage than the Iraq invasion on its own and it’s a shockwave still being felt 20 years later and will probably be felt for another 20. Minimum Wage, longest period of sustained growth in UK history, the continuation of the peace process leading to the GFA, “ban” on fox hunting etc etc doesn’t wipe the slate clean for the war in my opinion. Russia is also using it as justification for invading Ukraine.

 

[Flying Fokker]

I really don’t know one person who didn’t oppose it. I really don’t know one person who didn’t despise Tony Blair after. I also don’t know one person who after the event, lack of weapons of mass destruction and the dressed up dossier that turned out to be nothing more than a student’s hypothetical thesis hasn’t come to the conclusion that Blair should have been put in front of The Hague.

I was passive on the invasion. If it was now, I would be more skeptical about this. My only thought was that it was about oil anyway.

 

[Flying Fokker]

 

[tisza]

Have they got enough shovels?

 

[Otis]

Have they got enough shovels?

Well, they have, but they are using them instead of rifles and bullets at the moment.

 

[David O'Day]

there being slaughtered, whole companies running across open fields to be slaughtered by Ukrainian machine guns

 

[skyblueinBaku]

there being slaughtered, whole companies running across open fields to be slaughtered by Ukrainian machine guns

That's the Russian way of warfare. Just throw more and more troops into the battle and reinforce success wherever it occurs.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

It did for me. I recognise his achievements Middle East aside but the gulf war, especially the second did more damage than just an unjustified war. It’s been a recruitment tool for Islamic extremism that has probably done more damage than the Iraq invasion on its own and it’s a shockwave still being felt 20 years later and will probably be felt for another 20. Minimum Wage, longest period of sustained growth in UK history, the continuation of the peace process leading to the GFA, “ban” on fox hunting etc etc doesn’t wipe the slate clean for the war in my opinion. Russia is also using it as justification for invading Ukraine.

Understandable and well put but still think a lot of good was done in first term

 

[PVA]

there being slaughtered, whole companies running across open fields to be slaughtered by Ukrainian machine guns

Lost 500 men in Bakhmut alone yesterday.

Just crazy numbers and it's not sustainable.

 

[David O'Day]

Lost 500 men in Bakhmut alone yesterday.

Just crazy numbers and it's not sustainable.

whole companies being wiped out for no ukrainian losses

 

[skyblueinBaku]

whole companies being wiped out for no ukrainian losses

I think that Ukrainian losses have been high, too.

 

[David O'Day]

I think that Ukrainian losses have been high, too.

no, not at anywhere near the same level

 

[skybluetony176]

Lost 500 men in Bakhmut alone yesterday.

Just crazy numbers and it's not sustainable.

The Russian soldiers shouldn’t have poked the bear.

This is what makes this war even more stupid. Russia literally has nothing to point to as a win. Even in the Vietnam war the US could point to to body counts and say they were winning because NVA/Vietcong were being killed in far bigger numbers than the US? Russia is not making advances other than what it achieved in the opening days/weeks of the invasion, it’s losing far more equipment, it’s not wiping out the Ukrainian army. It’s just mental.

 

[Grendel]

no, not at anywhere near the same level

up to 200 every day isn’t it?

 

[Otis]

up to 200 every day isn’t it?

I just know that when Russia send bombs into the towns and cities in Ukraine, the official death toll always seems low.

I'm sure the actual casualties are much higher unfortunately.

 

[PVA]

Ukraine have taken heavy losses at Bakhmut too, but if Russia do manage to eventually take it then they have no capability to exploit it and push further, and have taken catastrophic losses.

It would be the a textbook definition of a Pyrrhic Victory.

 

[Grendel]

I just know that when Russia send bombs into the towns and cities in Ukraine, the official death toll always seems low.

I'm sure the actual casualties are much higher unfortunately.

This at least is an independent sort of analysis - the best you’ll get rather than the declared numbers by both sides - which clearly are not reliable

Ukrainian forces still trying to hold Bakhmut despite heavy casualties | Ukraine | The Guardian

Soldiers and analysts suggest defending city has become more of a political than practical issue, as Russian push continues

amp.theguardian.com

 

[Sick Boy]

This at least is an independent sort of analysis - the best you’ll get rather than the declared numbers by both sides - which clearly are not reliable

Ukrainian forces still trying to hold Bakhmut despite heavy casualties | Ukraine | The Guardian

Soldiers and analysts suggest defending city has become more of a political than practical issue, as Russian push continues

amp.theguardian.com

Always knew you were a closet Guardian reader.

 

[tisza]

This at least is an independent sort of analysis - the best you’ll get rather than the declared numbers by both sides - which clearly are not reliable

Ukrainian forces still trying to hold Bakhmut despite heavy casualties | Ukraine | The Guardian

Soldiers and analysts suggest defending city has become more of a political than practical issue, as Russian push continues

amp.theguardian.com

Like the article suggests it's a political hold. Earlier in the war Ukraine were holding on long enough in conflict points to inflict damage then withdrawing before losses mounted. All the "experts" say Bakmut has little value so seems little point in Ukraine taking casualties other than political stupidity.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

This at least is an independent sort of analysis - the best you’ll get rather than the declared numbers by both sides - which clearly are not reliable

Ukrainian forces still trying to hold Bakhmut despite heavy casualties | Ukraine | The Guardian

Soldiers and analysts suggest defending city has become more of a political than practical issue, as Russian push continues

amp.theguardian.com

Anyone else feel the need to bookmark this for the next time Grendel claims the Guardian is leftist propaganda?

 

[Grendel]

Anyone else feel the need to bookmark this for the next time Grendel claims the Guardian is leftist propaganda?

I link the guardian numerous times

 

[Flying Fokker]

 

[PVA]

Russia is resorting to sending female prisoners to the front line now ffs.

Definitely not getting desperate, no siree. Special operation is going perfectly to plan.

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

Lots of disinformation regarding the US drone in the last 24 hours. I wish someone would make their mind up as to what actually happened to it.

 

[PVA]

Lots of disinformation regarding the US drone in the last 24 hours. I wish someone would make their mind up as to what actually happened to it.

According to the US it was awful piloting from the Russian, who was out of control and crashed into it.. 'amateur hour' one US official described it as.

And they say they will release video footage of it...

 

[fernandopartridge]

Russia is resorting to sending female prisoners to the front line now ffs.

Definitely not getting desperate, no siree. Special operation is going perfectly to plan.

Where did you read that?

 

[PVA]

Where did you read that?

I think it was on the Guardian twitter feed, can't remember. I'll have a look in a bit.

 

[PVA]

Lots of disinformation regarding the US drone in the last 24 hours. I wish someone would make their mind up as to what actually happened to it.

Here you go

 

[David O'Day]

Here you go

So the piloting is the Russian Airforce is pretty shit as well

 

[tisza]

So the piloting is the Russian Airforce is pretty shit as well

Was reported due to cost they only get 60 hours per year actual flying time.

 

[David O'Day]

Was reported due to cost they only get 60 hours per year actual flying time.

Why pay for fuel and to maintain the planes when you can"divert" that money into super yachts

 

[PVA]

Fighter planes starting to head Ukraine's way