Gynnsthetonic
Well-Known Member
We'd be back at Sq1 though, the council with a stadium that Sisu won't pay for, Wasps didn't buy it really did they though, they just mortgaged it to pay off the councils loan if I'm correct.
Wasps downward spiral... (74 Viewers)
- Thread starter CCFC54321
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Skybluemichael
Well-Known Member
It’s not what this bloke thinksThe notion it reverts to the council is a myth - it’s not a given and the lease is worth far more than the debts - we need then to survive or the club vanishes -that’s the Sisu legacy
Two?!
But that isn't going to happen is it?
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Nibble nibble
My money's on PWKH
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
We all know the end game here by SISU. They are simply waiting for London wasps to go under in the next couple of years and then attempt to pick up the stadium as we all know that nobody else or any other franchise will touch it. CCFC are and will be the only game in town that will take on the stadium.
Gynnsthetonic
Well-Known Member
Wasps could trundle along for longer than that is my worry if they refinance the bonds, Owning Wasps is Derek Richardsons hobby and if he's prepared to lose millions every year what can anyone do about it
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
I think people keep forgetting we aren’t the only entity in their portfolio
Richardson isn't the mega billionaire that people think he is. Funding this pile of shite can’t carry on forever. I don’t see what’s in it for him or his family at all. When Richardson eventually says times up or sadly passes away then they are absolutely finished?
Grendel
Well-Known Member
that’s just rubbish
You love being controversial don’t you?
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Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
What’s in it for him is the property.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
even more rubbish
Grendel
Well-Known Member
What do the terms of the lease in the case of insolvency state?
Fuck off and stop falling with out with everyone princess it’s boring. Discuss and influence people on this chat room, even people like myself. Call me this and that but I’ve read some of the some of the stuff you argue with other posters and I just think why? Just debate and influence for once.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Mmmm I’ve already stated that’s the default position but have also subsequently shown the actual terms of the wording and structure created that it’s not actually what will happen
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Ok what’s the actual wording then in the case of insolvency?
Educate us then instead of rowing all the time then!
Grendel
Well-Known Member
here is the wording
Club aims to raise £35m from bond
Fantastic News - http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/wasps-rfc-looks-raise-35million-9121703 Copy and Paste Article. No mention of it paying Richardson back too? The Richardson bit is there hidden as 'refinancing shareholder loans' I believe Sounds better than Richardsons...
www.skybluestalk.co.uk
Grendel
Well-Known Member
In simple terms it would seem to prevent the default the ultimate holding company before liquidation - MGI - I assume can separate the organisations and protect the lease for the 250 years which given its value clearly Derek Richardson would
What’s your interpretation?
What’s your interpretation?
Skybluemichael
Well-Known Member
Grendel how many people use your account because you change your mind like the wind, for years you have been going over to drunken wasps telling them that if they default on the debt the lease goes back to the council, now all of a sudden it’s changed. You said the only reason Richardson got wasps was so he could get the stadium on the cheap as he is a “property developer at hart” and if wasps go bust that means Coventry will why? In that case Richardson would have a break even stadium without a loss making wasps.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
I haven’t changed by opinion see comment 18 months ago?
Could this be good news for us to return to the Ricoh?
Very good news, hopefully they fuck off asap and we’re back at the Ricoh within weeks
www.skybluestalk.co.uk
Obviously “defaulting on the debt” means no refunding in reality. The point is if they do refund then it’s obvious the whole group won’t be liquidated
The default position is return to the council but Richardson will separate the businesses if he has to.
It’s a disaster in reality if they did go under as we would never afford stadium operating costs
It won’t happen now though will it? The lease will remain valued as such even with our sub tenancy I would have thought - I’ve said on there site they will in all probability get refunding and probably more on a mortgage basis which has obvious benefits
Skybluemichael
Well-Known Member
I was replying to the message “The notion it reverts to the council is a myth” when you’ve been saying the opposite for yearsI haven’t changed by opinion see comment 18 months ago?
Could this be good news for us to return to the Ricoh?
Very good news, hopefully they fuck off asap and we’re back at the Ricoh within weeks
Obviously “defaulting on the debt” means no refunding in reality. The point is if they do refund then it’s obvious the whole group won’t be liquidated
The default position is return to the council but Richardson will separate the businesses if he has to.
It’s a disaster in reality if they did go under as we would never afford stadium operating costs
It won’t happen now though will it? The lease will remain valued as such even with our sub tenancy I would have thought - I’ve said on there site they will in all probability get refunding and probably more on a mortgage basis which has obvious benefits
duffer
Well-Known Member
Agree entirely that it's vague what happens to the lease if Wasps go bust, but the truth is that either the council or a third party would own the lease at that point.
Politically, the Council would find it hard not to come to a deal with CCFC (or just maintain the current one). Similarly, the third party would need us financially, you'd have to think.
If anything, Wasps failing puts the club back in the box seat regarding the Arena, I can't see anybody being in a rush to kick us back out.
So I still don't see how Wasps failing would in any way threaten the club.
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
Wasps going bust isn't the issue is it, isn't the stadium lease held by another company in the group so unless the whole group goes bust the ownership of the lease won't change and our current agreement will remain valid.
Is it not more likely that, if they were in that much trouble and desperately needed money or Richardson wanted to get some of his money back, they look to sell the company holding the lease or the lease itself. Not sure that anyone who took over a stadium would want to kick out a football club getting 20K turning up every week.
Is it not more likely that, if they were in that much trouble and desperately needed money or Richardson wanted to get some of his money back, they look to sell the company holding the lease or the lease itself. Not sure that anyone who took over a stadium would want to kick out a football club getting 20K turning up every week.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Er....the default lease does in the scenario of the business going bust.................
Grendel
Well-Known Member
The company holding a lease thats what valued at £50 - £60 million? Who would buy that?
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
To be fair it's what everyone was saying before the franchise arrived.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
There seems to be a notion on here that wasps are going to go under.
There seems to be no indication of that anyway. As long as the funding is in place next year it will be pretty much secured due to the length of lease. I assume a mortgage would allow some capital repaid as well.
The view is it will revert back to the Council and we will grab it as that is the default position if ACL went bust. The valuation of the lease remains comfortably in the realms of allowing the them I would think to borrow funds. If the fall down scenario did happen then I cannot see in reality how that would benefit us at all anyway given the relationship and a tiny lease. It would make us highly vulnerable.
The irony is our returned presence will in all likelihood strengthen the valuation and offer security to the Wasps group of companies. No one knows what we are paying but it would be interesting to know as my suspicion is it will be very little different to the original lease charge we broke (though
Wasps I do not see going anywhere. It may be failed in terms of its objective of taking supporters in the area and its grandiose claims of being the biggest club on the planet are not much better than our notion we are building a new stadium. I suspect it will look to reduce wages further on the Rugby side to balance costs as best it can
Wasps going under is of zero benefit to us.
HuckerbyDublinWhelan
Well-Known Member
I disagree. For personal gratfication, I’d love to see them go bust, so their presence no longer taints the city
Gynnsthetonic
Well-Known Member
They are still making massive losses to around 10m a year, if Richardson is prepared to keep bailing them out he's going to run out of money sooner or later
Grendel
Well-Known Member
He hasn't loaned money I don't think for the last 3 season? (well the last 3 we have info on) - the funding is now external and there is the Share thing I don't really understand - if this is to be believed Richardson wealth remains pretty healthy
Gallagher Premiership rich list: Every owner ranked by net worth - Page 3 of 3 - Ruck
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