Wasps going into admin & the impact on CCFC (4 Viewers)

[wingy]

Ahhhhhh. Interesting. Not mesh, It's MASH holdings.
Interesting to see where this goes... is there a difference or is Fraser part of MASH holdings?

Don't think so.
Think they had a Notice to Strike last year for late accounts.

 

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[shmmeee]

Im calling it now. What's the bet if Ashley gets his hands on it. A load of grants for regeneration in that arena become available by CCC

It would be grants from WMCA or central govt, supported by CCC, not CCC money. That’s what you get if you have a piece of local infrastructure and tick the right boxes.

 

[GIMOC]

Ahhhhhh. Interesting. Not mesh, It's MASH holdings.
Interesting to see where this goes... is there a difference or is Fraser part of MASH holdings?

Mash Holdings is the main company of Ashley I believe. Frasers etc… all subsidiaries of Mash holdings

 

[SkyblueDad]

By fast pace you mean arena then club by xmas. The Hoffmeister said it would all be done and dusted by Crimbo so maybe he is the man in the middle here

I think this has been bubbling away for sometime, maybe since our now preferred bidder missed out on Derby, just a hunch.

 

[wingy]

I think this has been bubbling away for sometime, maybe since our now preferred bidder missed out on Derby, just a hunch.

If that's the case I'd be more inclined to thinking that yes that Sisu are involved, more so without that being in the timeline.

Edit:- prior to the time's article inviting offers.

 

[Nick]

It would be grants from WMCA or central govt, supported by CCC, not CCC money. That’s what you get if you have a piece of local infrastructure and tick the right boxes.

Scratch the right backs you mean.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

sorry Pete. Didn’t see this.

from my understanding and what I was told. even before Wasps went into admin, Ashley was keeping a close eye on events. It wasn’t an overnight decision.

Hoffman has been in dialogue with sisu (well Joy directly) I’m not saying Hoffman is the middle man in all this but I know he has been in dialogue with Joy since September.

My understanding, sisu would be open to offers at the right price. I feel CCFC ensured the Blackpool game went ahead knowing Ashley would then be the person to invest short term following weeks. Once we know tomorrow that Ashley is the preferred bidder I can see events escalating at a fast pace.

Hope so. I’ve not been told anything about Gary and Joy but no reason I would be although I’ve asked direct questions

 

[GIMOC]

By fast pace you mean arena then club by xmas. The Hoffmeister said it would all be done and dusted by Crimbo so maybe he is the man in the middle here

potentially. good friend of mine was with Hoffman in Milan. His words were “I speak to Joy regularly. A lot of changes could occur in the next 2-3 months” So far it seems to insinuate there was truth in that comment. Afterwards the lads did say Hoffman was prem chairman at the time of the Saudi takeover of Newcastle and Hoffman received plenty of flak over it

so they have worked previously.

 

[shmmeee]

Scratch the right backs you mean.

No, but if you scratch the right backs they’ll tell you the best boxes to tick. Grant funding applications seem to be a secret language of their own.

 

[wingy]

Does make that Hottinger nonsense seem extremely stupid/irrelevant though?

 

[shepardo01]

Mash Holdings is the main company of Ashley I believe. Frasers etc… all subsidiaries of Mash holdings

I've heard MASH holdings mentioned...

 

[shmmeee]

Does make that Hottinger nonsense seem extremely stupid/irrelevant though?

Think that’s a total goose chase TBH. Gilbert needs to be focusing on what happened before Nov 1st and how Ashley became priority bidder. The “council bailout” is the story him and Ridley have been pushing for a while, but I don’t think that’s the story here if there is one.

 

[The Philosopher]

sorry Pete. Didn’t see this.

from my understanding and what I was told. even before Wasps went into admin, Ashley was keeping a close eye on events. It wasn’t an overnight decision.

Hoffman has been in dialogue with sisu (well Joy directly) I’m not saying Hoffman is the middle man in all this but I know he has been in dialogue with Joy since September.

My understanding, sisu would be open to offers at the right price. I feel CCFC ensured the Blackpool game went ahead knowing Ashley would then be the person to invest short term following weeks. Once we know tomorrow that Ashley is the preferred bidder I can see events escalating at a fast pace.

All feels a bit dirty.

Anyone think we could have MA owning the Arena with Richardson, Richardson controlling Wasps2 at the Arena, SISU getting bought out and MA owning CCFC and it all being planned months ago?

Bondholders stiffed
Small unsecured creditors stiffed
HMRC stiffed and us taxpayers footing the bill?

Would this shock anyone?

 

[GIMOC]

I've heard MASH holdings mentioned...

It would appear he will use Mash holdings to finance the deal if it goes ahead mate.

 

[shmmeee]

All feels a bit dirty.

Anyone think we could have MA owning the Arena with Richardson, Richardson controlling Wasps2 at the Arena, SISU getting bought out and MA owning CCFC and it all being planned months ago?

Bondholders stiffed
Small unsecured creditors stiffed
HMRC stiffed and us taxpayers footing the bill?

Would this shock anyone?

All the little guys and the taxpayer getting stiffed while the people that made the mess walk away Scott free does seem to be the standard for sports team implosions.

 

[SkyblueDad]

If that's the case I'd be more inclined to thinking that yes that Sisu are involved, more so without that being in the timeline.

Edit:- prior to the time's article inviting offers.

It seems to fit timing wise with the Simon Jordan announcement about ccfc up for grabs, coincidence ?

 

[Grendel]

All feels a bit dirty.

Anyone think we could have MA owning the Arena with Richardson, Richardson controlling Wasps2 at the Arena, SISU getting bought out and MA owning CCFC and it all being planned months ago?

Bondholders stiffed
Small unsecured creditors stiffed
HMRC stiffed and us taxpayers footing the bill?

Would this shock anyone?

It would shock you - you said Ashley had to pay the bond holders back

 

[jordan210]

Does make that Hottinger nonsense seem extremely stupid/irrelevant though?

I dont think it's irrelevant. Not sure it's worth. But is interesting that Richardson has very strong ties to Hottinger. in late August he becomes a director of ACL. Then it looks like CCC have been talking with both him and Hottinger.

 

[GIMOC]

All feels a bit dirty.

Anyone think we could have MA owning the Arena with Richardson, Richardson controlling Wasps2 at the Arena, SISU getting bought out and MA owning CCFC and it all being planned months ago?

Bondholders stiffed
Small unsecured creditors stiffed
HMRC stiffed and us taxpayers footing the bill?

Would this shock anyone?

that’s business in a nutshell though.it’s the nature of the beasts involved. Most if not all businessman have a ruthless side about them. sisu have been the big fish in a small pond for too many years. Now Ashley is involved they just can’t compete on or off the pitch

 

[Nick]

Think that’s a total goose chase TBH. Gilbert needs to be focusing on what happened before Nov 1st and how Ashley became priority bidder. The “council bailout” is the story him and Ridley have been pushing for a while, but I don’t think that’s the story here if there is one.

 

[shmmeee]

Weve been over this. Do you not think a potential stitch up on the arena sale is a bigger story than a proposal that went nowhere?

 

[GIMOC]

A timeline would be very handy.

remember back at the start of August when the papers were running stories about SISU putting the club up for sale. No smoke without fire. The next turn of events have been brewing for months. The waiting game for most parties is almost over

 

[GIMOC]

August the 2nd I believe this article came out.

 

[The Philosopher]

August the 2nd I believe this article came out.

Yep. Posted that on here yesterday myself

 

[Colin Steins Smile]

All feels a bit dirty.

Anyone think we could have MA owning the Arena with Richardson, Richardson controlling Wasps2 at the Arena, SISU getting bought out and MA owning CCFC and it all being planned months ago?

Bondholders stiffed
Small unsecured creditors stiffed
HMRC stiffed and us taxpayers footing the bill?

Would this shock anyone?

Unfortunately, that's the reality for SME's and sole traders in our market economy. The bigger businesses tend to stuff everyone else.

 

[jordan210]

The bond holders have raised nearly 21k for legal. Not a huge amount. But more than I expected

 

[The Philosopher]

that’s business in a nutshell though.it’s the nature of the beasts involved. Most if not all businessman have a ruthless side about them. sisu have been the big fish in a small pond for too many years. Now Ashley is involved they just can’t compete on or off the pitch

The timing, the silence from SISU, MR & Fadz both talking up the squad value and need to unite stadium and team, awkwardness of the Council and “turning down” of bailouts by Richardson, hints from Wasps kitman, all fits the narrative you ascribe.

Still feels dirty - a pre planned stitch-up of the little guys (employees losing jobs etc, taxpayers).

Dirty.

 

[shepardo01]

Not sure if this is possible.. but see below ...

 

[Gynnsthetonic]

All feels a bit dirty.

Anyone think we could have MA owning the Arena with Richardson, Richardson controlling Wasps2 at the Arena, SISU getting bought out and MA owning CCFC and it all being planned months ago?

Bondholders stiffed
Small unsecured creditors stiffed
HMRC stiffed and us taxpayers footing the bill?

Would this shock anyone?

No

 

[The Philosopher]

Trying to get secured creditors to accept less than their held value has such an echo.

SISU wanted to get (Co-op?) bank to accept less than owed. This is at a time when banks are being bailed out. Who ends up on the hook?

Now the same is happening to this US bank. Bondholders will end up on the hook, and HMRC get taken.

It would not shock me if this whole charade was planned including all parties a while back.

 

[The Philosopher]

Not sure if this is possible.. but see below ...

It’s all a bit wrong.

Rant over.

 

[Skyblueweeman]

remember back at the start of August when the papers were running stories about SISU putting the club up for sale. No smoke without fire. The next turn of events have been brewing for months. The waiting game for most parties is almost over

Who owns CCFC by Xmas?

 

[Mcbean]

Two things pretty certain in life - death and the cold grip of HMRC - they don’t often get stiffed

 

[shmmeee]

Not sure if this is possible.. but see below ...

Surely the council would make the most money by taking back the lease and reselling it? And if ACL was going to be liquidated then wouldn’t the lease return anyway, or would it be sold by the liquidators? And I thought ACL wasn’t in admin?

Hope everything comes out because all this Twitter randoms “I heard from a mate” is doing my head in. Why can’t Gilbert ask these questions?

 

[shmmeee]

What we need to know is fairly simple: what have the council said to various people about retaking the lease? Could other parties other than NEC/Ashley bid and if not why not? (Dawkins/Sisu could answer this)

The rumours are all about a stitch up before Nov 1st, that’s where the media need to be focusing. You’d expect Sisu to have said something and Dawkins to have focused on that not the exclusivity clause if so, but it needs clarifying.

@SimonGilbert