skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
I think you're over estimating there by at least 2-2.5k.
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TF helped him with the numbers so you could be right
/what us fans need to know What if...... (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter rupert_bear
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TF helped him with the numbers so you could be right
mark82
Moderator
I doubt they would put us straight into the Conference Premier.
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Maybe conference north, as (if it happened today for instance) we would be considered relegated this year then dropped 2 divisions. Teams would be reprieved from relegation from divisions above to make space.
This is all assuming that CCFC cease to exist of course. If the team were to still be playing in some guise, even in a different city under a different name, then we would have to start from scratch.
mark82
Moderator
mark82
Moderator
I think you're over estimating there by at least 2-2.5k.
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If it's following liquidation I don't agree. May even be an underestimation.
If it is while the existing club still exists then I think it would more likely be around 1000, bearing in mind it would be a much lower league and many would stick with CCFC.
I don't see any reason pulling the plug means we are thrown out of the league, after all admin then liquidation is exactly what we just went through, why would it be different this time? If Sepala pulls the plug an administrator/liquidator would be appointed whose job would be to sell things like the global share to get the most amount of money for arvo.
stupot07
Well-Known Member
Dunno, I don't go to sussexfields
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sky blue zam
Member
"Would also be a lot of fun"? Are you Bryan Richardson?
As for would I support a phoenix club, will have to wait and see. I will however be going to see cov utd play a couple of games in Coventry this season as well as many wlaway city games as I can make
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
If previous experience is anything to go by: badly.
Edit: beaten by a better joke from Stu just one post down. :/
NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
Aldershot, Maidstone, Newport, Halifax, Chester...
If a club disappears entirely, it disappears and re-starts.
The only reason we haven't is as much because it's partly the football league's fault it got to this stage at all. That's one life though, the exception that proves the rule. Also the part with various non property assets
wasn't involved in any liquidation until an agreement was made with the league for Otium to take over. With no agreement, it's arguable that part wouldn't have been wound up. What you can't do is retrospectively take over the wound up club's place in the league...If the club is wound up it *will* die and need to be re-started.
Oh and as for ground, far far *far* better to start off in the Butts (phnar phnar) if non league. Less cost maintaining a huge stadium, more atmosphere, more suited to position equals greater chance of said club building momentum and not being stymied by using a ground just out of stubbornness that it's there.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
5000 at say £5 a ticket average price, is still £575k a season in revenue, that's double AFC Wimbledon's last turnover for a start. £5k a game for costs = £115k. Their wage bill for their last season in the Conference was less than £500k. So you're looking at making £40k in other revenue (sponsorship, merchandise, membership fees, etc.) plus whatever you need to cover other costs (training facilities, etc.) and further down the pyramid the wage bill will be nowhere near £500k, so for the first few seasons you can spend way above your competitors.
Whether you'd get 5k down there is debatable of course. But if you did, it's certainly doable.
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shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Yes, this completely. And it might help out Cov Rugby at the same time. Could probably build up to say 8-10k there before you'd have to move.
Would like to see a big opener at the Ricoh though.
Aldershot, Maidstone, Newport, Halifax, Chester...
If a club disappears entirely, it disappears and re-starts.
The only reason we haven't is as much because it's partly the football league's fault it got to this stage at all. That's one life though, the exception that proves the rule. Also the part with various non property assets
If the club is wound up it *will* die and need to be re-started.
Oh and as for ground, far far *far* better to start off in the Butts (phnar phnar) if non league. Less cost maintaining a huge stadium, more atmosphere, more suited to position equals greater chance of said club building momentum and not being stymied by using a ground just out of stubbornness that it's there.
The same would happen this time though surely, exactly like last time other than sisu wouldn't bid for themselves. if you appoint a liquidator he will sell the assets, the main asset is the golden share. Of course we disappear if the football league chose that but they had the exact same choice this time. The club wouldn't disappear before the liquidator had sold the assets unless he can't sell them.
NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
You can't sell a golden share, it isn't an asset (other than an intangible one maybe?). The league can choose to issue it, and they won't issue it to a company in liquidation. Make no mistake if the club is liquidated, it drops out the league. No amount of wishful thinking will stop this!
NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
The only reason to use the Ricoh permanently to begin with would be political...
What would be interesting (and meet with my approval
) is if in occupation at the Butts, whether said occupation would allow for organic growth of the ground over time to a sufficient level. You couldn't do it *now* but would occupation move the goalposts, as it were?Our club is being liquidated but before that the rights were sold to Otium, you are right that the football league get to decide weather to issue it or not but I see absolutely no difference to what happened last time. You appoint a liquidator (at this point the club IS NOT liquidated), the liquidator sells the assets to the new company, the football league will decide if they are happy with that and then the club (which isn't the club anymore like now) is liquidated. The football league might decide they have had enough of us of course but there would be far more validity in letting us continue this time than there was last time when basically all we were doing was avoiding our debts and breaking a lease, if there was a time to throw us out the league that was it, what we were doing was an utter disgrace and shouldn't be legal.
we won't go from club to club liquidated in one step. Appointing a liquidator won't instantly liquidate the club.
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NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
The club *will* drop out the league if it is liquidated.
There is no debate!
There is no debate!
You are arguing semantics, I fully agree that if the entity that is holding the golden share ceases to exist then the club drops out the league, but that isn't what happens, the process of liquidating the club should as it did this time mean that the club itself moves to a new company before Otium is liquidated. There is no reason to believe it wouldn't happen as it did this time where the football league cared about not fucking with fixtures over all else.
NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
I'm not arguing semantics at all.
Aldershot, Maidstone, Chester, Halifax, Newport...
I'm arguing what happens!
Aldershot, Maidstone, Chester, Halifax, Newport...
I'm arguing what happens!
Coventry City football club is being liquidated yet we continue to be part of the league, what is different? nothing! The administrator/liquidator will sell of the assets to a new company, the football league will issue the golden share to whoever the administrator/liquidator decides if they pass the incredibly stringent requirements of being something close to a human being.
NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
I've told you what's different above.
You're not comparing like with like, the Otium maneuvres are not comparable... the Aldershot, Maidstone etc. examples are.
You're not comparing like with like, the Otium maneuvres are not comparable... the Aldershot, Maidstone etc. examples are.
you have not told me what's different at all.
NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
I have, you just choose not to accept it! The property owning subsidiary was liquidated, the deal was agreed with the football league beforehand, and this was agreed in part because the football league contributed to the confusion.
Now... go and check out the lengthy list of clubs who see their records expunged when they *actually* get liquidated and tell me that they don't drop from the level they're at, to thehighest level where someone accepts them!
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no you havn't, you've said the football league won't issue a share to a company in liquidation which I don't dispute. they would issue it to the company that paid the administrator/liquidator for the assets of Otium.
Point us to an example that exactly parallels the scenario at CCFC before you say there is no debate.
The examples you quote are very different in that their debt was mostly to third parties and Maidstone, for instance, had nowhere to play and no prospect of ever having anywhere to play.
NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
The clubs were liquidated, the clubs needed to be reformed, the reformed club had to be accepted at the highest level it was able to be.
This is what happens! Where's the general with his Egypt joke when you need him?!?
skybluelee
Well-Known Member
This is 100% my view as well. I would happily support a reborn side in the Southern Premier League now providing we kept the Coventry City heritage (colours, nickname etc).
In fact it is a million times more appealing than what we have at the moment.
stupot07
Well-Known Member
Agreed, ours was the exception not the the rule. And the FL won't let that happen again.
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NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
Or to put it another way...
If SISU choose to liquidate the club, and not to play around the edges of insolvency law with the collusion of the football league... the club will no longer exist, it will die, it will need reforming, it will have to be accepted at whatever level it can be.
The reason holdings were allowed to be liquidated was because they were the property subsidiary, and it broke the lease. The fact everything was positioned for them being the property subsidiary, and why thus they were happy for them to go into liquidation, is not accidental.
The fact that agreement was made with the league for Otium to take on the assets of Ltd. before it was liquidated is not accidental.
If the club goes pop it will not exist, and will need to be reformed. It will no longer be a league club.
If SISU choose to liquidate the club, and not to play around the edges of insolvency law with the collusion of the football league... the club will no longer exist, it will die, it will need reforming, it will have to be accepted at whatever level it can be.
The reason holdings were allowed to be liquidated was because they were the property subsidiary, and it broke the lease. The fact everything was positioned for them being the property subsidiary, and why thus they were happy for them to go into liquidation, is not accidental.
The fact that agreement was made with the league for Otium to take on the assets of Ltd. before it was liquidated is not accidental.
If the club goes pop it will not exist, and will need to be reformed. It will no longer be a league club.
Hobo
Well-Known Member
Or fans and local business people, the investment need not be huge for a new club operating at a much lower level.
NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
Indeed.
Plenty of others who could step forward... and who might step forward given the chance.
stupot07
Well-Known Member
Or maybe not....
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...irectors-12m-Nick-Owen-hails-benefactors.html
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NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
That's still a 'high' level though
Ideal scenario is if you must re-start, you re-start a couple of levels lower, resist political pressure to use the Ricoh and instead use the Butts, have a relatively vast budget compared to competition, yet a budget that's small enough to start building a financial buffer to help see you through the rockier times to come later.
Broken Hearted Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Quietly. .
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Damn site noisier than Sixfields thats for sure.
