SISU/ARVO appeal turned down (12 Viewers)

[Astute]

The 17 points is for the Ricoh isn't it? Not the academy.

I was using it as an example. And as you know it is true. They always ask for what can be considered too much. Then blame everyone else involved when they don't get it. And some then side with them.

And some even try to say that anyone that SISU have dealt with would have put in clauses to stop any agreements mid term.

 

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[stupot07]

Most likely yes. But not until our ten year contract is up. Which gives the club time to make alternative arrangements. We were never going to get time to do anything on a rolling one year commitment. I would have thought that was obvious so why did we return under that agreement if the academy is so important to the long term future of the club?

Any long term deal would likely have a breakout clause, as the swimming pool is part of the city wide strategy and the swimming association have the money now, I'm fairly certain the higgs centre would have been serving notice on the academy even if they had a 10 year deal.


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[Grendel]

I was using it as an example. And as you know it is true. They always ask for what can be considered too much. Then blame everyone else involved when they don't get it. And some then side with them.

And some even try to say that anyone that SISU have dealt with would have put in clauses to stop any agreements mid term.

What are the 17 points then?

 

[chiefdave]

I was using it as an example. And as you know it is true. They always ask for what can be considered too much. Then blame everyone else involved when they don't get it. And some then side with them.

And some even try to say that anyone that SISU have dealt with would have put in clauses to stop any agreements mid term.

So without knowing a single one of the 17 points you have decided they are unreasonable?

 

[stupot07]

Surely it would be more economical to build it stand alone than convert an existing lightweight building into a swimming pool?

It would be easier to get planning where the existing building is, plus it needs to connect to the building so that is the only logical place for it to go, you couldn't go into the carpark as thats already very small.

There must be good reasons why they are saying replace the pitch, as regardless of whether the academy is there nor not, thats the only true all weather indoor 4G football facility in the city.

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[Nick]

It would be easier to get planning where the existing building is, plus it needs to connect to the building so that is the only logical place for it to go, you couldn't go into the carpark as thats already very small.

There must be good reasons why they are saying replace the pitch, as regardless of whether the academy is there nor not, thats the only true all weather indoor 4G football facility in the city.

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And the pitch has just been relaid I think?

 

[Astute]

What are the 17 points then?

And you know for sure that each one of them should be given as SISU would never ask for too much.

 

[italiahorse]

And the pitch has just been relaid I think?

It has.

 

[Captain Dart]

The contract would have had a break clause. The council have acted disgracefully over this but as always the apologists unite.

All SISU contracts have break clauses, usually a year or 2. Nothing but harmful short termism.

 

[Nick]

All SISU contracts have break clauses, usually a year or 2. Nothing but harmful short termism.

Sounds better than agreeing to 40+ years at 1.2m.

What would it actually take for somebody to see this as the higgs fault?

(As in what would the scenario have to be)

 

[italiahorse]

Sounds better than agreeing to 40+ years at 1.2m.

... or a sliding scale just in case we drop down to D1 ?

 

[stupot07]

And the pitch has just been relaid I think?

Yeah £75k they spent on it.

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[Kingokings204]

Sounds better than agreeing to 40+ years at 1.2m.

What would it actually take for somebody to see this as the higgs fault?

(As in what would the scenario have to be)

Wasn't strictly true was it Nick. It was negotiated 400k by fisher for league 1 until sisu changed their strategy.

 

[Nick]

Wasn't strictly true was it Nick. It was negotiated 400k by fisher for league 1 until sisu changed their strategy.

Which one was that?

 

[Grendel]

... or a sliding scale just in case we drop down to D1 ?

Oh really? How much would that have been?

 

[Grendel]

Wasn't strictly true was it Nick. It was negotiated 400k by fisher for league 1 until sisu changed their strategy.

Oh yes and back to £1.2 million two years later. Sounds like a plan.

 

[Broken Hearted Sky Blue]

You always ask for proof but can never provide any when stating things like you have here. What a surprise.

Oh yes and back to £1.2 million two years later. Sounds like a plan.

the way we're going it won't matter soon will it?

 

[italiahorse]

Oh really? How much would that have been?

We do know that CCFC 2003? were offered a sliding scale but accepted the fixed scale that Sisu strangely took on.
No idea what is was, but I guess it would be lower for L1 and higher for PL.

 

[italiahorse]

Oh yes and back to £1.2 million two years later. Sounds like a plan.

Remember the £400K but you are my only source for the £1.2M

 

[Kingokings204]

Which one was that?

Before we went to Northampton it's well document fisher got us a rent of 400k upon relegation to league 1. Now Grendel says it went back up to 1.2m after 2 years but that's not strictly true either. He has a point as it was temporary but I think and I will try and find the quote along the lines of it would of gone to a league based proportion for the rent.

Anyway it's irrelevant really as we know what happened sisu changed their tactics and moved to Northampton to destress ACL. ("Judges words") wasps struck a deal with ccc and Higgs and here we are 3 years later arguing over a 15k butts stadium. Funny old world.

 

[Nick]

Before we went to Northampton it's well document fisher got us a rent of 400k upon relegation to league 1. Now Grendel says it went back up to 1.2m after 2 years but that's not strictly true either. He has a point as it was temporary but I think and I will try and find the quote along the lines of it would of gone to a league based proportion for the rent.

Anyway it's irrelevant really as we know what happened sisu changed their tactics and moved to Northampton to destress ACL. ("Judges words") wasps struck a deal with ccc and Higgs and here we are 3 years later arguing over a 15k butts stadium. Funny old world.

I thought it was reverting back but negotiable?

 

[Kingokings204]

I thought it was reverting back but negotiable?

Yes exactly right Nick. That's how I understood it also. So probably between 400k and 1.2m not an immediate revert back to 1.2m.

Irrelevant I know but the point about the rent was it wasn't the problem. In the championship 1.2m is not cheap but it's not expensive. Much bigger 32k than most even in the championship today and championship brings in 5-6m more money into the club than league 1. The rent wasn't the problem.

 

[Nick]

Yes exactly right Nick. That's how I understood it also. So probably between 400k and 1.2m not an immediate revert back to 1.2m.

Irrelevant I know but the point about the rent was it wasn't the problem. In the championship 1.2m is not cheap but it's not expensive. Much bigger 32k than most even in the championship today and championship brings in 5-6m more money into the club than league 1. The rent wasn't the problem.

It was expensive for match day only with no revenue wasn't it?

 

[Kingokings204]

Well yes that debateable I agree. The whole deal stank and the club always seemed to be pissing in the wind really from the move in date of 2005-6. It was always going to end badly bar a miracle to the premier league happening which never did happen.

What actually happened was disaster struck and we went down and 4 years later we are still in league 1 having never really mounted a challenge for top 6. I don't really include last year tbh as we were out of the top 6 with 10 games to go.

I would say sisu knew the deal when they took over and their plan to get us promoted and cash in was good in theory but high risk. Had we been promoted to the pl we wouldn't be here now.

The club was always designed to fail though as PL was never realistic. The Ricoh deal stank and when we sold our share to Higgs for 6m. That was curtains really. No one rents the same house for the rest of their lives. You either buy or you move. Football is no different in the main.

 

[sky blue john]

What are the 17 points then?

Doesn't 17 points condititons sound rather a lot ?
If i was a cynical person I would say it was purposely a way of not getting a deal done!

 

[Grendel]

Doesn't 17 points condititons sound rather a lot ?
If i was a cynical person I would say it was purposely a way of not getting a deal done!

It's wasps who don't want a deal done on terms acceptable to the club.

Still let's keep our head firmly in the sisu out sandpit. It's far more relevant.

 

[sky blue john]

It's wasps who don't want a deal done on terms acceptable to the club.

Still let's keep our head firmly in the sisu out sandpit. It's far more relevant.

I take it you know what the 17 points conditions are then ?
Surely if Sisu HQ really wanted a deal they would publish the 17 points conditions so that the fans can sympathise and support them ?
My personal oppinion based on history and court cases is that Sisu are Masters at not getting a deal done !

 

[Grendel]

I

I take it you know what the 17 points conditions are then ?
Surely if Sisu HQ really wanted a deal they would publish the 17 points conditions so that the fans can sympathise and support them ?
My personal oppinion based on history and court cases is that Sisu are Masters at not getting a deal done !

Well they got a deal to move the club to Northampton and got the league to agree it.

Wasps could easily have said to the club publish it and don't bother knocking again,

Odd your not interested in what wasps counter proposals are - why not insist they publish what they want the club to shun up to?

 

[sky blue john]

I


Well they got a deal to move the club to Northampton and got the league to agree it.
Wasps could easily have said to the club publish it and don't bother knocking again,

Odd your not interested in what wasps counter proposals are - why not insist they publish what they want the club to shun up to?

In terms of Northampton you seem so proud in mentioning it, that you must have been in the minority of cov fans that supported it !
In terms of offers, deals and negotiations of course i want to see what both sides have to say. That is the only way a sane person can make a non-biased judgement.

 

[Astute]

I


Well they got a deal to move the club to Northampton and got the league to agree it.

Wasps could easily have said to the club publish it and don't bother knocking again,

Odd your not interested in what wasps counter proposals are - why not insist they publish what they want the club to shun up to?

Why don't you insist that SISU publish the 17 points that they said they want? Then there is a slight chance that we could agree with you and say that they are not taking the piss for once.

 

[Astute]

I


Well they got a deal to move the club to Northampton and got the league to agree it.

By giving bullshit saying that we were getting kicked out of the arena and that they were in the process of building a stadium. That was why they were given 3 years in Northampton and maybe another 2 years depending on how the build was going.

 

[skybluetony176]

By giving bullshit saying that we were getting kicked out of the arena and that they were in the process of building a stadium. That was why they were given 3 years in Northampton and maybe another 2 years depending on how the build was going.

Not well.

 

[sky blue john]

By giving bullshit saying that we were getting kicked out of the arena and that they were in the process of building a stadium. That was why they were given 3 years in Northampton and maybe another 2 years depending on how the build was going.

We all know the only reason for leaving the Ricoh and it was nothing to do with benefitting CCFC. It was all about bumping up the level of compensation Sisu have been trying to get through the JR.
I have no doubt the club were threatened with expulsion from the stadium, standard business practice in any way of life when you stop paying your rent.

 

[Kingokings204]

We all know the only reason for leaving the Ricoh and it was nothing to do with benefitting CCFC. It was all about bumping up the level of compensation Sisu have been trying to get through the JR.
I have no doubt the club were threatened with expulsion from the stadium, standard business practice in any way of life when you stop paying your rent.

Not back to that are we? The dreaded fisher comment of "standard business procedure"

Sorry bad memories.

As for the stadium when we moved to sixfields this would of been the end of the 3 year initial deal with Northampton I wonder what would of happened t that extension of 2 years dependent on the build of the new stadium? Awkward conversation to say the least.

 

[letsallsingtogether]

Why are we arguing over the same shit again?
Need to concentrate On the future we can't change the past.
Or biggest treat is losing the academy.
So we have to target the ones that manage the Higgs centre and the club owners to get together and broker a deal.
If one side aren't intrested in talking we should then go all out against them.
I am not sure but I believe it is all down to the Higgs centre management if so we need to put our words into a protest against them not each other.
I am not a sisu lover as you well know but if this threat is down to the council then we need to get answers from them now.
They closed a perfectly good swimming pool at Livingston baths, that could have solved this problem.