Jon Sharp - BPA (39 Viewers)

[clint van damme]

So... in a time period in excess of a decade, during which the club has payed more than 260 competitive senior games at the Ricoh Arena, there's been an attendance of more than 25,000 on just 12 occasions. Those figures mean that for more than 95% of games a stadium with a capacity of less than 25,000 would have been fine.

anyone that builds a new stadium, and it ain't going to be sisu, would surely be serious about really taking the club forward, if they can see the potential then surely they'll want a ground that matches their ambition?

 

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[Frankley]

Yep, fine for a team on a spiral of decline.

You have to think in terms of what the attendances would be if we were successful. Or are we just assuming we never will be and will just float endlessly around midtable on League One?

We have been in perpetual decline. We do well on the pitch you will see attendances rise dramatically.

It's quite simple really. Everyone seems to only be focusing on the here and now and our neverending failure and not on a prosperous future.

...and some are just assuming football attendances will stay stable or even increase. Attendances at Highfield Road through the late 1970s through to the mid 1980s fell dramatically even though the club was in the top flight.

 

[clint van damme]

...and some are just assuming football attendances will stay stable or even increase. Attendances at Highfield Road through the late 1970s through to the mid 1980s fell dramatically even though the club was in the top flight.

they fell everywhere, football was in massive decline throughout that period.

 

[Frankley]

they fell everywhere, football was in massive decline throughout that period.

That's precisely my point. People shouldn't simply assume attendances in the Premier League or the Championship or League 1 will always be 'X' thousand.

 

[clint van damme]

That's precisely my point. People shouldn't simply assume attendances in the Premier League or the Championship or League 1 will always be 'X' thousand.

I'm not assuming that, I'm assuming that new owners will take the club forward and grow the club, it won't happen under sisu.

 

[Frankley]

anyone that builds a new stadium, and it ain't going to be sisu, would surely be serious about really taking the club forward, if they can see the potential then surely they'll want a ground that matches their ambition?

The club playing at BPA might lead to other events occurring that could free up another stadium in the city for possible future expansion.

Try thinking strategically...

 

[Frankley]

I'm not assuming that, I'm assuming that new owners will take the club forward and grow the club, it won't happen under sisu.

I didn't say you were assuming attendances would always hold up, but others seem to be stuck in that mindset.

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

So... in a time period in excess of a decade, during which the club has payed more than 260 competitive senior games at the Ricoh Arena, there's been an attendance of more than 25,000 on just 12 occasions. Those figures mean that for more than 95% of games a stadium with a capacity of less than 25,000 would have been fine.

Nope!!!.....
2006 21,200
2007 20,400
2008 19,150
2009 17,400
2010 17,300..... and so on to present day gates! Now! not being a mathematician, I would say to get gates of approx(For arguments sake) 19k average. a lot of figures have to be around 25k to arrive at that figure yes?

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

The club playing at BPA might lead to other events occurring that could free up another stadium in the city for possible future expansion.

Try thinking strategically...

I would suggest you start thinking logically..... What Stadium would that be?

 

[clint van damme]

The club playing at BPA might lead to other events occurring that could free up another stadium in the city for possible future expansion.

Try thinking strategically...

BPA isn't going to happen, try thinking realistically.

 

[Frankley]

Nope!!!.....
2006 21,200
2007 20,400
2008 19,150
2009 17,400
2010 17,300..... and so on to present day gates! Now! not being a mathematician, I would say to get gates of approx(For arguments sake) 19k average. a lot of figures have to be around 25k to arrive at that figure yes?

As you say you're not a mathematician. Your question is more of a statistics one than a maths one... and the answer is - not necessarily.

 

[Frankley]

I would suggest you start thinking logically..... What Stadium would that be?

As you said, you're not a mathematician, but even with your clear lack of... ability... you must be able to work out which stadium I meant.

 

[Frankley]

BPA isn't going to happen, try thinking realistically.

I am...

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

When we were at Highfield Road the home support was a 19000 maximum, away 4050. we rarely got that 19000 but more offen than not the away was full. The question for BPA how do you segregate numbers like that at the Butts

Don't know what era you're talking about but capacity was cut(All seater) to 22k. If you"Mold" customers to a mindset of around 18k home fans, you'll rarely get close to that figure. Good God, I remember 51.5k(It was at least 55k) at HR against Wolves, and regularly over a good 10-11 seasons being over 32-33k AVERAGE gates.
The potential figures are phenominal!

 

[stupot07]

Nope!!!.....
2006 21,200
2007 20,400
2008 19,150
2009 17,400
2010 17,300..... and so on to present day gates! Now! not being a mathematician, I would say to get gates of approx(For arguments sake) 19k average. a lot of figures have to be around 25k to arrive at that figure yes?

Not necessarily, jusy taking oir first season at the Ricoj 2005/06 (ave 21.2k) there were only 3 games with attendances more than 25k - wolves, Leeds and Leicester, and all 3 brought pretty much a sell out away crowd with them.


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[skybluetony176]

The club playing at BPA might lead to other events occurring that could free up another stadium in the city for possible future expansion.

Try thinking strategically...

So we spank millions on the BPA making a stadium inadequate for an ambitious CCFC and overkill for CFRC in the hope that this somehow distresses Wasps and ACL presumably to the point it implodes and we can then pick up the Ricoh on the cheap, abandon the BPA leaving CRFC to try and cope with a stadium to large for them? What could possibly go wrong.

 

[clint van damme]

I am...

I won't say no chance, but minuscule chance, and if it does it will be in a stadium to small to be fit for purpose which will consign us to league one for at least my life time, though you sound like you'd be happy with that.

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

So we spank millions on the BPA making a stadium inadequate for an ambitious CCFC and overkill for CFRC in the hope that this somehow distresses Wasps and ACL presumably to the point it implodes and we can then pick up the Ricoh on the cheap, abandon the BPA leaving CRFC to try and cope with a stadium to large for them? What could possibly go wrong.

Obviously that is what Frankley is basing his extremely tenuous link to mate :facepalm:

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

I won't say no chance, but minuscule chance, and if it does it will be in a stadium to small to be fit for purpose which will consign us to league one for at least my life time, though you sound like you'd be happy with that.

Oh to be young again with a very vivid imagination.

 

[wingy]

The club playing at BPA might lead to other events occurring that could free up another stadium in the city for possible future expansion.

Try thinking strategically...

Ah so we get into bed with CRFC for 5-10 yrs and then hop back over to the other venue which is 10K to big for us IYO
when it implodes.
Do CRFC or Mr Sharp know this before they start spending their time and Income adopting our cause

I am...

Showing signs of delusion.

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

...and some are just assuming football attendances will stay stable or even increase. Attendances at Highfield Road through the late 1970s through to the mid 1980s fell dramatically even though the club was in the top flight.

Which part of "Restricted to 22k from over 36k" don't you understand?

 

[Frankley]

So we spank millions on the BPA making a stadium inadequate for an ambitious CCFC and overkill for CFRC in the hope that this somehow distresses Wasps and ACL presumably to the point it implodes and we can then pick up the Ricoh on the cheap, abandon the BPA leaving CRFC to try and cope with a stadium to large for them? What could possibly go wrong.

Will it be too big for the rugby club - Tigers had an average gate of 21,000 last season. Whether the stadium would be too big for the rugby club depends on what the rugby clubs plans and ambitions are, doesn't it.

As for ground development at BPA - perhaps that would be funded by SISU rather than the football club.

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

Just for proof this taken from CCFC historian "Jim Brown"....
In 1981, the controversial decision was taken to convert Highfield Road into England’s first all-seater stadium and 8,000 extra seats were installed at a cost £400,000 reducing the capacity, at a stroke, from 36,500 to 20,600.
Read more at http://www.ccfc.co.uk/news/article/...ty-jim-brown-2432398.aspx#wZBLR42SjaRmK50Q.99

 

[Frankley]

Which part of "Restricted to 22k from over 36k" don't you understand?

What part of football attendances can go down don't you understand?

 

[Frankley]

Just for proof this taken from CCFC historian "Jim Brown"....
In 1981, the controversial decision was taken to convert Highfield Road into England’s first all-seater stadium and 8,000 extra seats were installed at a cost £400,000 reducing the capacity, at a stroke, from 36,500 to 20,600.
Read more at http://www.ccfc.co.uk/news/article/...ty-jim-brown-2432398.aspx#wZBLR42SjaRmK50Q.99

...and how long was it until standing was reinstated, fool

 

[Frankley]

Showing signs of delusion.

Yes, you are showing signs of being deluded.

 

[Astute]

S

Will it be too big for the rugby club - Tigers had an average gate of 21,000 last season. Whether the stadium would be too big for the rugby club depends on what the rugby clubs plans and ambitions are, doesn't it.

As for ground development at BPA - perhaps that would be funded by SISU rather than the football club.

So what capacity would you call sufficient?

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

Not necessarily, jusy taking oir first season at the Ricoj 2005/06 (ave 21.2k) there were only 3 games with attendances more than 25k - wolves, Leeds and Leicester, and all 3 brought pretty much a sell out away crowd with them.


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What you fail to say is how many were just under 25k ...
20 August 2005

Queens Park Rangers H 3-0 23,000
29 August 2005

Southampton H 1-1 23,000
10 September 2005

Reading H 1-1 22,074
24 September 2005

Hull City H 0-2 21,161
15 October 2005

Crystal Palace H 1-4 24,438
29 October 2005

Luton Town H 1-0 22,228

26 November 2005

Norwich City H 2-2 20,433


21 January 2006

Derby County H 6-1 20,267
4 February 2006

Brighton & Hove Albion H 2-0 20,541
15 February 2006

Sheffield Wednesday H 2-1 20,021
11 March 2006

Sheffield United H 2-0 23,506
1 April 2006

Preston North End H 0-1 21,023
30 April 2006

Cardiff City H 3-1 22,536

I deliberately haven't placed in here those over 25k... and just to let you know I've also left out 3-4 that were over 19k

 

[shy_tall_knight]

BPA aint going to happen, the site is too small, just face it nobody would risk £50m on an inappropriate location they can't generate other income opportunities such as other real estate opportunities. Also its SISU, do you really think they are going to invest / speculate !!!! wake up and smell the coffee

 

[Otis]

Ah so we get into bed with CRFC for 5-10 yrs and then hop back over to the other venue which is 10K to big for us IYO
when it implodes.
Do CRFC or Mr Sharp know this before they start spending their time and Income adopting our cause

Well said, Wingy.

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

...and how long was it until standing was reinstated, fool

It took nearly 5 years to reinstate nob! In which time the difference between 36k and approx17-18k were lost

 

[clint van damme]

Will it be too big for the rugby club - Tigers had an average gate of 21,000 last season. Whether the stadium would be too big for the rugby club depends on what the rugby clubs plans and ambitions are, doesn't it.

As for ground development at BPA - perhaps that would be funded by SISU rather than the football club.

Perhaps funded by sisu! Now I know you're a wum!

 

[skybluetony176]

Will it be too big for the rugby club - Tigers had an average gate of 21,000 last season. Whether the stadium would be too big for the rugby club depends on what the rugby clubs plans and ambitions are, doesn't it.

As for ground development at BPA - perhaps that would be funded by SISU rather than the football club.

So the argument you dismiss from posters regarding capacity for CCFC you're now using to try and justify dumping an wholly inadequately large stadium on CRFC guilt free. What's Man Uniteds average gate? Clearly the Ricoh is too small for us. That's the sort of comparison you've just used.

We'll be paying for it not SISU. Where CCFC is concerned we always pay for SISU's actions. In every meaning of the word.

 

[Grendel]

Yeah, 11 years of dismal failure.

Success will boost attendances dramatically.

You don't prepare a business model just around that though do you.

20,000 would be fine - if games are occasionally sold out even better.

 

[Grendel]

This whole discussion is a bit silly really but to say we needed a 25,000 stadium would mean if we were still at that old ground we used to have surrounded by houses and no parking would be a sign of our total lack of ambition.

Ok