The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (42 Viewers)

[skybluetony176]

Do you? Most on the political threads claimed we were heading for a Tory landslide. The Tories are in disarray and Labour government led by Corbyn is inevitable over the coming years.

Even Mandy is saying so now and he’s been one of Corbyns biggest critics from within the Labour camp.

 

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[Sick Boy]

I said at the time we wasn't headin for a Tory majority. And I won money on it. It was never going to be a landslide.

Say what you want about Corbyn. But he has no charisma. You get more excitement out of having a fart in a bath. Labour are nowhere near winning under him. They need a leadership change to have a chance. And why would there be another general election so soon? All parties are split over Brexit.

I'm not a massive fan of his but I've never seen a politician in this country provoke the kind of reaction that he has.

 

[martcov]

What's Jeremy corbyn doing in Brussels? This is turning into a farce now.

A lot more constructive things than your tosser hero Farage ever did in all the time he was bullshitting in Brussels.

 

[Astute]

That’s your answer? You don’t seem to get it. People are allowed to change their mind should they want to. At least in democratic countries.

We had a democratic vote. Some of those who didn't get the result they wanted now want another vote. That is undemocratic.

 

[Astute]

I'm not a massive fan of his but I've never seen a politician in this country provoke the kind of reaction that he has.

What reaction was that? He is similar to Brown.

 

[martcov]

We had a democratic vote. Some of those who didn't get the result they wanted now want another vote. That is undemocratic.

That’s not what I said. Should people change their mind, they have the right to. I don’t need to change my mind.

 

[Astute]

I don’t agree about him having no charisma. He gets rousing cheers everywhere nowadays. If anyone hasn’t got charisma, it’s May.

Who said May has?

You either don't watch him or don't know what charisma means.

 

[Astute]

That’s not what I said. Should people change their mind, they have the right to. I don’t need to change my mind.

And if we change our minds each year we should keep jumping in and out of the EU?

 

[Grendel]

That’s your answer? You don’t seem to get it. People are allowed to change their mind should they want to. At least in democratic countries.

Actually the only countries that re-run referendums are those that get the wrong answer - like zimbawbwe - it's the antithesis of democracy.

 

[Sick Boy]

What reaction was that? He is similar to Brown.

If you say so.

 

[Grendel]

I'm not a massive fan of his but I've never seen a politician in this country provoke the kind of reaction that he has.

He had less popular vote than an extremely unpopular Theresa May. Blair had a far bigger reaction when he actually got elected and Farage almost single handed managed to galvanise Brexit.

 

[Sick Boy]

He had less popular vote than an extremely unpopular Theresa May. Blair had a far bigger reaction when he actually got elected and Farage almost single handed managed to galvanise Brexit.

Ahhh yes your poster boy who consistently failed to get himself elected to our parliament.

 

[skybluetony176]

We had a democratic vote. Some of those who didn't get the result they wanted now want another vote. That is undemocratic.

Again it sounds like you’re saying that we shouldn’t have had a referendum to leave as we’d already had one to join and we’re not allowed to change our mind. It’s undemocratic. Apparently.

 

[oakey]

Another referendum is a bad idea, but if we end up with a "bad deal" being rejected by parliament or a no deal then a general election must be called. Then each party has to come up with a clear way forward: no deal walk away or accept a bad deal or remain. Of course the main parties are not brave enough so would probably fudge the issues but if that happened we would see real churn and a realignment in the centre perhaps. The reason it is unlikely to happen is that it could lead to the break up of both major parties. Both might never recover. The next few years will certainly be interesting but I see lots of pain ahead.

 

[Astute]

Again it sounds like you’re saying that we shouldn’t have had a referendum to leave as we’d already had one to join and we’re not allowed to change our mind. It’s undemocratic. Apparently.

You have wanted another vote since the day this result was announced. So has SB and Mart.

So when did we have the vote to join?

And you wonder why I say you twist the truth to try and make a point and you then get agreed with by the usual suspects.

 

[Kingokings204]

A lot more constructive things than your tosser hero Farage ever did in all the time he was bullshitting in Brussels.

What like being treated like a hero by all the socialist PMs and the EU want him to become PM because he would accept any deal. Oh yeah constructive help that is.

 

[Sick Boy]

You have wanted another vote since the day this result was announced. So has SB and Mart.

So when did we have the vote to join?

And you wonder why I say you twist the truth to try and make a point and you then get agreed with by the usual suspects.

I've only said we should have a vote if public opinion has clearly turned against it.

Then you accuse others of twisting the truth- ha ha ha.

 

[Sick Boy]

What like being treated like a hero by all the socialist PMs and the EU want him to become PM because he would accept any deal. Oh yeah constructive help that is.

There is zero evidence that he would accept 'any deal'.

 

[Kingokings204]

There is zero evidence that he would accept 'any deal'.

I think he would. The whole Labour Party have said pretty much any deal is better than no deal. I don't agree.

Lisa Nandy on question time this week said the same. The day after brexit she claims planes will be grounded and trade will stop overnight. Obviously she is off her rocker but some people will believe her making any deal acceptable.

 

[Sick Boy]

I think he would. The whole Labour Party have said pretty much any deal is better than no deal. I don't agree.

Lisa Nandy on question time this week said the same. The day after brexit she claims planes will be grounded and trade will stop overnight. Obviously she is off her rocker but some people will believe her making any deal acceptable.

Again, there is no actual evidence of that and it's not like the Tories have any extra bargaining power.

If no aviation deal is made then what else is going to happen?

 

[skybluetony176]

You have wanted another vote since the day this result was announced. So has SB and Mart.

So when did we have the vote to join?

And you wonder why I say you twist the truth to try and make a point and you then get agreed with by the usual suspects.

So what’s the official time limit on when people are allowed to change their minds? Just so I know.

 

[Kingokings204]

Again, there is no actual evidence of that and it's not like the Tories have any extra bargaining power.

If no aviation deal is made then what else is going to happen?

You genuinely think if there is no deal then planes will be grounded? Seriously?

 

[Sick Boy]

You genuinely think if there is no deal then planes will be grounded? Seriously?

If there was no aviation deal, then yes of course. Unless you think airlines are going to fly illegally? It won't happen though because they'll come to an agreement on it because so much is at stake.

 

[Kingokings204]

If there was no aviation deal, then yes of course. Unless you think airlines are going to fly illegally? It won't happen though because they'll come to an agreement on it because so much is at stake.

Well that's what I'm saying. I think the same on the main deal in the bigger picture also. Lots of posturing right now but common sense will prevail.

 

[Sick Boy]

Well that's what I'm saying. I think the same on the main deal in the bigger picture also. Lots of posturing right now but common sense will prevail.

I agree but it's a far cry from that was being claimed. A loud minority consistently overplayed out negotiating hand.

 

[mrtrench]

Following Merkel's statements last week, Tusk has now also come out with some more positive statements.

Brexit deadlock talk 'exaggerated' - Tusk

Hopefully this will start a period of a more constructive and positive attitude from the EU. There is no doubt in my mind that the UK must be prepared to leave without any deal - otherwise we'd be taken to the cleaners. Hopefully this is now sinking in and we can find a mutually beneficial space.

 

[martcov]

Following Merkel's statements last week, Tusk has now also come out with some more positive statements.

Brexit deadlock talk 'exaggerated' - Tusk

Hopefully this will start a period of a more constructive and positive attitude from the EU. There is no doubt in my mind that the UK must be prepared to leave without any deal - otherwise we'd be taken to the cleaners. Hopefully this is now sinking in and we can find a mutually beneficial space.

Nothing new though. We are still not where we should be. We still have to put something more on the table. We are being encouraged to do so.

 

[mrtrench]

Nothing new though. We are still not where we should be. We still have to put something more on the table. We are being encouraged to do so.

We've already conceded. It's their turn. Give and take is the way forwards; not the UK giving and the EU not giving an inch.

 

[martcov]

We've already conceded. It's their turn. Give and take is the way forwards; not the UK giving and the EU not giving an inch.

You just said the EU were showing signs of wanting a good deal for both sides. Put something more on the table and ask them to put their money where their mouth is.

 

[Astute]

I've only said we should have a vote if public opinion has clearly turned against it.

Then you accuse others of twisting the truth- ha ha ha.

Look at what was said. If you disagree then you can't even read the truth.

 

[Astute]

There is zero evidence that he would accept 'any deal'.

There is zero evidence on a lot of what tou come out with. But you make it out to be a fact.

 

[Astute]

So what’s the official time limit on when people are allowed to change their minds? Just so I know.

So I ask you again. When did we vote to join the EU?

Why can't you answer a question that asks you to verify what you have said? You said we voted to join. We never did. So you make a comment and get backed up when you all know that it is a false statement.

Nice one.

 

[Astute]

We've already conceded. It's their turn. Give and take is the way forwards; not the UK giving and the EU not giving an inch.

It has always been the same.

The UK gives. The EU takes.

 

[Astute]

Nothing new though. We are still not where we should be. We still have to put something more on the table. We are being encouraged to do so.

Correct. We should be much further along by now.

I would say why but you and others would soon jump in and defend the EU.

 

[Sick Boy]

Look at what was said. If you disagree then you can't even read the truth.

Why is it fine for you to accuse people of 'twisting the truth', yet you just did that yourself?