The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (22 Viewers)

[SIR ERNIE]

The bottom line is that all the stuff about the EU needing us more and Britain having the upper hand and able to call the shots has been proven to be utter bollocks.

...you hope

 

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[Grendel]

...you hope

Which is the most disturbing thing of all. People who want Britain to crumble and succumb to the modern equivalent of the Third Reich.

If sick boy and Martcov were around in the war they'd have seen the invasion of the Channel Islands as a step forward.

 

[clint van damme]

What a load of poppycock, if your opponents won't commit to talk and state what they require, they will stunt all possibility of a deal which of course is their intention all along.

we were told that in principle deals would be agreed with countries around the world, it hasn't happened. "they could be done on the back of an envelope", according to Boris.
The attitude of the EU is irrelevant to signing in principle deals with other countries.
Their actions will affect the exit deal or lack of it we sign with the EU, If they somehow scupper our exit, then they will have affected whether in principle deals become reality or not, that's a different matter.

 

[Grendel]

we were told that in principle deals would be agreed with countries around the world, it hasn't happened. "they could be done on the back of an envelope", according to Boris.
The attitude of the EU is irrelevant to signing in principle deals with other countries.
Their actions will affect the exit deal or lack of it we sign with the EU, If they somehow scupper our exit, then they will have affected whether in principle deals become reality or not, that's a different matter.

We will be able to sign trade deals with other markets far easier without the EU - how many beneficial deals have we signed in the EU and how many do you think we are on the WTO terms in the eu? Do you think it's a great idea the Czech Republic can dictate which deals we can do?

 

[Ashdown]

Our entire public order and safety budget is £34 BN per year, we give a 1/4 of that figure per year to the EU. With crime, especially violent crime rising at alarming rates and many police forces starting to consider crimes against property as issues for insurance companies to sort out, can someone actually state what we get in return for this preposterous sum that we pay to Brussels ??

 

[Sick Boy]

...you hope

Yet more bollocks.

 

[Sick Boy]

Which is the most disturbing thing of all. People who want Britain to crumble and succumb to the modern equivalent of the Third Reich.

If sick boy and Martcov were around in the war they'd have seen the invasion of the Channel Islands as a step forward.

Hahahaha and I suppose you'd be out their leading the rest from the trenches. Pathetic.

 

[Grendel]

Yet more bollocks.

So if the uk could get a free trade deal and a zero divorce bill you'd be celebrating?

 

[Sick Boy]

So if the uk could get a free trade deal and a zero divorce bill you'd be celebrating?

As long as it was amicable and all owed money was paid, then what's the problem?

The fantasy isn't going to happen though, is it?

 

[Grendel]

As long as it was amicable and all owed money was paid, then what's the problem?

The fantasy isn't going to happen though, is it?

What owed money paid? Unless it's signed and sealed you'd not want us to pay a penny would you?

 

[Sick Boy]

What owed money paid? Unless it's signed and sealed you'd not want us to pay a penny would you?

If no deal is reached then obviously money isn't going to get paid but it will end up being disastrous for those of us unable to gloat about having a 6 figure salary.

 

[Astute]

Our entire public order and safety budget is £34 BN per year, we give a 1/4 of that figure per year to the EU. With crime, especially violent crime rising at alarming rates and many police forces starting to consider crimes against property as issues for insurance companies to sort out, can someone actually state what we get in return for this preposterous sum that we pay to Brussels ??

Yet more bollocks.

I've helped SB do a proper reply for once

 

[clint van damme]

We will be able to sign trade deals with other markets far easier without the EU - how many beneficial deals have we signed in the EU and how many do you think we are on the WTO terms in the eu? Do you think it's a great idea the Czech Republic can dictate which deals we can do?

well that's what Liam Fox said, he claimed we would sign 40 free trade deals at 1 minute after midnight on March 29th 2019.
I'm sceptical to be honest and the lukewarm response from the US and India doesn't inspire me with confidence. To be fair to Fox I'd rather someone went into negotiations with his unshakeable optimism rather than Boris's silly bluster.

 

[Grendel]

well that's what Liam Fox said, he claimed we would sign 40 free trade deals at 1 minute after midnight on March 29th 2019.
I'm sceptical to be honest and the lukewarm response from the US and India doesn't inspire me with confidence. To be fair to Fox I'd rather someone went into negotiations with his unshakeable optimism rather than Boris's silly bluster.

How many free trade deals do we have outside the EU block? Switzerland negotiated a deal with China didn’t they?

 

[Grendel]

If no deal is reached then obviously money isn't going to get paid but it will end up being disastrous for those of us unable to gloat about having a 6 figure salary.

Can you explain why this would be so bad? After all we would have around £12 billion additional trade funds from Europe applying WTO tariff arrangements. Do you think as an example Netherlands would be equally disastrous as they’d have a bigger deficit considering their exports to us as a percentage of their total GDP?

 

[clint van damme]

How many free trade deals do we have outside the EU block? Switzerland negotiated a deal with China didn’t they?

you might want to look at the conditions of that deal. Don't the Swiss have to wait years to have tariff free access to Chinese markets?

edit - the CBI website says the Swiss have to wait 15 years to have access to the Chinese markets but I don't think that's correct. However, as China is the bigger trading partner it seems they're calling the shots. It would be naive to think the same won't happen to us when dealing with the likes of them and the US,

 

[clint van damme]

Can you explain why this would be so bad? After all we would have around £12 billion additional trade funds from Europe applying WTO tariff arrangements. Do you think as an example Netherlands would be equally disastrous as they’d have a bigger deficit considering their exports to us as a percentage of their total GDP?

See this is one thing that confuses me and I've looked into it but still don't understand it.
If you go under WTO tariff arrangements don't you also have to agree new trading standards, (there's things called technical barriers to trade and conformity agreements), and if that can't be done then it makes importing/exporting your goods difficult.
I think it may be possible to copy and paste terms from the trading agreements we were adhering to as part of the EU but when people say will will trade under WTO conditions is it really as simple as that?

 

[martcov]

Hahahaha and I suppose you'd be out their leading the rest from the trenches. Pathetic.

Actually the reverse of Grendel’s theory is true. We would fight racism, nativism, populists like Farage and Hitler - before they got in a position to invade anyone let alone Jersey. That is what these breast beating plucky Brits are missing. They are the ones wanting to smash Europe- directly in line with populists like Putin and Trump. They are the new „make my country great again“ people- the same politics which led to the Third Reich. They are just blind to the fxxking obvious. Starry eyed KoK and snidy Grendel are typical examples.

 

[Sick Boy]

you might want to look at the conditions of that deal. Don't the Swiss have to wait years to have tariff free access to Chinese markets?

edit - the CBI website says the Swiss have to wait 15 years to have access to the Chinese markets but I don't think that's correct. However, as China is the bigger trading partner it seems they're calling the shots. It would be naive to think the same won't happen to us when dealing with the likes of them and the US,

We should just get the gun boats out and see how they like it up 'em!

 

[Ashdown]

Love Europe, Love the Europeans.......but don't need the EU as a go between, siphoning off billions.

 

[martcov]

Love Europe, Love the Europeans.......but don't need the EU as a go between, siphoning off billions.

Err... I think you missed something..the billions are going to Panama and Cayman Islands..

 

[Grendel]

you might want to look at the conditions of that deal. Don't the Swiss have to wait years to have tariff free access to Chinese markets?

edit - the CBI website says the Swiss have to wait 15 years to have access to the Chinese markets but I don't think that's correct. However, as China is the bigger trading partner it seems they're calling the shots. It would be naive to think the same won't happen to us when dealing with the likes of them and the US,

That’s not what this says - can you get s link to where you are seeing this?

What the EU could learn from Switzerland’s free trade agreement with China

 

[Grendel]

Actually the reverse of Grendel’s theory is true. We would fight racism, nativism, populists like Farage and Hitler - before they got in a position to invade anyone let alone Jersey. That is what these breast beating plucky Brits are missing. They are the ones wanting to smash Europe- directly in line with populists like Putin and Trump. They are the new „make my country great again“ people- the same politics which led to the Third Reich. They are just blind to the fxxking obvious. Starry eyed KoK and snidy Grendel are typical examples.

The reality is to are far more German than British in terms of self interest and that’s all you care about. Which is fine but just be honest about it.

 

[Ashdown]

Err... I think you missed something..the billions are going to Panama and Cayman Islands..

Yes as well and that should be stopped too !

 

[clint van damme]

That’s not what this says - can you get s link to where you are seeing this?

What the EU could learn from Switzerland’s free trade agreement with China

the article I read is a PDF from the CBI which it appears is now corrupted! I found this and it looks to be more accurate:

Alternatives - CBI

The original document said the Swiss wouldn't have access to free trade in Chian for 15 years but this one states that tariffs will reduce incrementally over 15 years which is what I read somewhere else.

Here's the relevant bit:

"And as the much bigger partner, China has been able to set the terms of trade. It is allowed more time to remove tariffs on Swiss goods – up to 15 years in some cases – than the Swiss, who have to let in Chinese goods tariff-free almost immediately"

What is also important, and I think this also applies to the CETA deal which the EU has just signed with Canada and which the Government is hoping to replicate is that they don't cover the service industries which are obviously a major part of our economy.

 

[martcov]

The reality is to are far more German than British in terms of self interest and that’s all you care about. Which is fine but just be honest about it.

Brexit is pure ( misguided) self interest. The EU evolved from a project started after the war to bring Europe together. WW11 and WW1 were caused by breast beating nationalists pushing the self interests of their countries at the expense of European interests. Nationalism is growing, and being led by the countries that fought against it. It is sickening to see your pleasure when you can find some billionaires or despots to quote who would love to smash the EU. Then you have the audacity to equate mine and sb‘s views with the invasion of Jersey.

It is really ironic that self interested nationalist Brexiteers love to say that Merkel is a jack booted nazi leading her fourth Reich EU, and then revel in the AfD shit like pigs when the extreme right AfD Win votes because Merkel is not a Nazi or right wing enough.

 

[Grendel]

the article I read is a PDF from the CBI which it appears is now corrupted! I found this and it looks to be more accurate:

Alternatives - CBI

The original document said the Swiss wouldn't have access to free trade in Chian for 15 years but this one states that tariffs will reduce incrementally over 15 years which is what I read somewhere else.

Here's the relevant bit:

"And as the much bigger partner, China has been able to set the terms of trade. It is allowed more time to remove tariffs on Swiss goods – up to 15 years in some cases – than the Swiss, who have to let in Chinese goods tariff-free almost immediately"

What is also important, and I think this also applies to the CETA deal which the EU has just signed with Canada and which the Government is hoping to replicate is that they don't cover the service industries which are obviously a major part of our economy.

Better have a word with the Swiss government then. Here’s what the site claims regarding all 27 deals it’s done so far without the EU

Bundesamt für Informatik und Telekommunikation BIT

 

[martcov]

‚Brexit: Michael Bloomberg says leaving EU 'stupidest thing any country has ever done' - apart from electing Trump
Former New York mayor says he may not have built his £1bn HQ in London had he known the referendum result‘

fair point

 

[martcov]

Better have a word with the Swiss government then. Here’s what the site claims regarding all 27 deals it’s done so far without the EU

Bundesamt für Informatik und Telekommunikation BIT

Or check the trade arrangements with countries on the EU list:

Countries and regions - Trade - European Commission

 

[Captain Dart]

‚Brexit: Michael Bloomberg says leaving EU 'stupidest thing any country has ever done' - apart from electing Trump
Former New York mayor says he may not have built his £1bn HQ in London had he known the referendum result‘

fair point

Has he never heard of Hitler or Mussolini?
I detect a strong smell self interest in his statement.

 

[martcov]

Has he never heard of Hitler or Mussolini?
I detect a strong smell self interest in his statement.

Yes, his ex wife is British, his children have British passports and he loves London. He is disappointed.

 

[clint van damme]

Better have a word with the Swiss government then. Here’s what the site claims regarding all 27 deals it’s done so far without the EU

Bundesamt für Informatik und Telekommunikation BIT

no one is arguing whether they've done deals or not, it's the terms of the deals.
Do you think a free trade deal where it won't actually be free trade for 15 years is the sort of deal we should be looking for? I'm not saying it isn't, I honestly wouldn't know but it doesn't appear to be something we should be striving for and as I say, doesn't cover service industries.

 

[SIR ERNIE]

Yes, his ex wife is British, his children have British passports and he loves London. He is disappointed.

I'm sure he'll get over it.

 

[Kingokings204]

Yes, his ex wife is British, his children have British passports and he loves London. He is disappointed.

Fair enough it's his opinion but does in live in a run down labour area that heavily voted leave in the referendum? Does he have to put up with cant getting gp appointments, his kids getting a primary school place, mass immigration from Eastern Europe decreasing jobs and wages in the area, lack of housing?

Do me a favor. You really don't get the referendum result do you. We voted to leave in spite of people like him. But as long as Bloomberg is ok hey and his billions are ok?

 

[SIR ERNIE]

Fair enough it's his opinion but does in live in a run down labour area that heavily voted leave in the referendum? Does he have to put up with cant getting gp appointments, his kids getting a primary school place, mass immigration from Eastern Europe decreasing jobs and wages in the area, lack of housing?

Do me a favor. You really don't get the referendum result do you. We voted to leave in spite of people like him. But as long as Bloomberg is ok hey and his billions are ok?

Just another one of the arrogant 'I-know-what's-best-for-you' elite.
Like the EU, they hate democracy.