USSR invades Ukraine. (23 Viewers)

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xcraigx

Well-Known Member
Abramovich can't catch a break at the moment. It actually seems like he's trying to help Ukraine, to what ends I don't know but I can't imagine some of his recent press releases about helping rebuild Ukraine, siting his business there etc will have gone down well with Putin.
 
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PVA

Well-Known Member
Good news.

As I've been saying for a while, they've fucked it and they know it.


BLOOMBERG:
Russia said it was taking steps to “de-escalate” the conflict in Ukraine, pledging to cut back military operations near Kyiv and Chernihiv and holding out the prospect of a meeting between Vladimir Putin and his Ukrainian counterpart Volodymyr Zelenskiy to seal a possible peace deal.

The Russian moves were announced in televised comments by two of Moscow’s negotiators after peace talks held Tuesday in Istanbul. Shortly before their comments, Ukrainian negotiators said no deal had yet been reached but outlined proposals they said they made at the talks.
Vladimir Medinsky, Russia’s chief negotiator, said the talks were “constructive” and the Ukrainian offer would be transmitted to Putin promptly for a response. Russia is willing to consider a presidential meeting at the same time as foreign ministers meet to initial a preliminary deal, he said. Kyiv has long sought direct talks, while Moscow had resisted committing to Putin’s participation.

Deputy Defense Minister Alexander Fomin said the “sharp reduction” in military operations in the Kyiv and Chernihiv areas would take place immediately, with the understanding that Ukrainian forces would reciprocate.

Russian officials last week said they were shifting their military operations to focus on the Donbas region in the east.
Ukraine’s General Staff said earlier Tuesday that some Russian units were withdrawing from the Kyiv and Chernihiv regions after their offensive there stalled. Ukraine on Monday recaptured the Kyiv region town of Irpin and was regaining control of occupied territory, Zelenskiy said in his daily video address.
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PVA

Well-Known Member
tisza said:
I suppose it depends where those forces are headed now. Disputed territories, Mariopul, south coast area?
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I think wherever those forces are headed it's promising news and a sign of Russia climbing down.

Even before this announcement Ukraine have been taking some ground back around Kyiv.

They know they can't take it so they're telling the domestic audience they're concentrating elsewhere when really it's to avoid a humiliating defeat.
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
PVA said:
I think wherever those forces are headed it's promising news and a sign of Russia climbing down.

Even before this announcement Ukraine have been taking some ground back around Kyiv.

They know they can't take it so they're telling the domestic audience they're concentrating elsewhere when really it's to avoid a humiliating defeat.
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Disagree. Saw some analysis based on Syria that said this is a tactic: move forces to take the east, then everyone from the east moves west again.

Hope it’s not true but wouldn’t be surprised.
 
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PVA

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
Disagree. Saw some analysis based on Syria that said this is a tactic: move forces to take the east, then everyone from the east moves west again.

Hope it’s not true but wouldn’t be surprised.
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Do you have a link to that? Would be interested to read it.

I personally don't think that's possible though. Not against Ukraine. I mean, they can try it.
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
PVA said:
Do you have a link to that? Would be interested to read it.

I personally don't think that's possible though. Not against Ukraine. I mean, they can try it.
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Sorry it was a random Twitter post so I’ve no hope of finding it again. I might have an overly pessimistic bubble but a lot of what I read isn’t overly optimistic about Ukraine’s chances short of a peace negotiation that means losing the eastern half of the country.

It’s so hard to know who has a clue what they’re on about though.
 
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PVA

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
Sorry it was a random Twitter post so I’ve no hope of finding it again. I might have an overly pessimistic bubble but a lot of what I read isn’t overly optimistic about Ukraine’s chances short of a peace negotiation that means losing the eastern half of the country.

It’s so hard to know who has a clue what they’re on about though.
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Yeah that's very true. So much misinformation out there, from both sides.

I would recommend giving Dr Mike Martin a follow. He's been pretty much spot on about most things so far, including predicting the withdrawal of Russian troops from Kyiv a few days ago
 
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xcraigx

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
Disagree. Saw some analysis based on Syria that said this is a tactic: move forces to take the east, then everyone from the east moves west again.

Hope it’s not true but wouldn’t be surprised.
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On the face of it this looks like a retreat which is good news for western Ukraine but bad news for Eastern Ukraine as the fighting is now going to follow the Russian troops back into the Donbas. Places such as Donetsk have so far escaped the worst of the fighting / damage.

It could be a precursor to a larger scale missile attack on Western Ukraine - after all, even Russia isn't going to want hundreds or thousands of it's own troops in the firing line and this is a handy way of pulling troops out of the way without giving a hint of what's to come.

It could just simply be that Russia are going to regroup, build up their troop numbers, their munitions, fuel, food, water, better plan supply lines and then push back west when they have strengthened sufficiently. That would be quite a risk however as Ukraine are bound to use any time to do exactly the same themselves and with arms flowing from so many countries they will pose an even bigger obstacle.

Who really knows how this is going to pan out? A month ago I would have said only Putin but the resistance has been so strong that unless he plans to go Nuclear then he's got no idea either.
 
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CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
xcraigx said:
On the face of it this looks like a retreat which is good news for western Ukraine but bad news for Eastern Ukraine as the fighting is now going to follow the Russian troops back into the Donbas. Places such as Donetsk have so far escaped the worst of the fighting / damage.

It could be a precursor to a larger scale missile attack on Western Ukraine - after all, even Russia isn't going to want hundreds or thousands of it's own troops in the firing line and this is a handy way of pulling troops out of the way without giving a hint of what's to come.

It could just simply be that Russia are going to regroup, build up their troop numbers, their munitions, fuel, food, water, better plan supply lines and then push back west when they have strengthened sufficiently. That would be quite a risk however as Ukraine are bound to use any time to do exactly the same themselves and with arms flowing from so many countries they will pose an even bigger obstacle.

Who really knows how this is going to pan out? A month ago I would have said only Putin but the resistance has been so strong that unless he plans to go Nuclear then he's got no idea either.
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Yeah, none of us really know what’s going to happen next and certainly nobody trusts a word the Russians say

From what I’ve read and as mentioned by others, I think we can all be pretty certain that they are retreating/refocusing troops because they are struggling with losses and are now spread too thinly…and not as a gesture to help peace talks. What they do next however remains to be seen. Any ceasefire will only be agreed by Ukraine if their security is guaranteed by us and others ie almost to a nato level of support. So if Russia plans are to use a ceasefire to rearm etc it’ll only escalate the conflict further down the line.
 
Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Like everyone else I've no idea what will happen but if I was a betting man I'd put my money on this being a strategic withdrawal to regroup and resupply with another offensive occurring in the coming months.
 
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PVA

Well-Known Member
Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
Like everyone else I've no idea what will happen but if I was a betting man I'd put my money on this being a strategic withdrawal to regroup and resupply with another offensive occurring in the coming months.
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That may be so, but that of course also gives Ukraine time to reorganise, rearm, receive thousands and thousands more weapons from the West, beef up defences etc.
 
Otis

Otis

Well-Known Member
PVA said:
That may be so, but that of course also gives Ukraine time to reorganise, rearm, receive thousands and thousands more weapons from the West, beef up defences etc.
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Exactly.

If Russia temporarily withdraw, this gives everyone a chance to move arms into Ukraine and solidify their defence
 
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xcraigx

Well-Known Member
Meanwhile in Belgorod, Russia. 25 miles from the Ukraine border. Accident, false flag or Ukraine? Accidents do happen when it comes to Russian ammo dumps.


 
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xcraigx

Well-Known Member
Supposedly a Ukranian shell. So false flag or Ukrainian shell it is. What an odd time for something like this to happen, right during peace talks...

 
stupot07

stupot07

Well-Known Member
xcraigx said:
Supposedly a Ukranian shell. So false flag or Ukrainian shell it is. What an odd time for something like this to happen, right during peace talks...

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It will either be an accident or the Russians will have done it to blame Ukraine in negotiations. They have already been caught firing on Belarus in the first week trying to blame Ukraine as a way to get Belarus to join the war.

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Sky Blue Pete

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
stupot07 said:
It will either be an accident or the Russians will have done it to blame Ukraine in negotiations. They have already been caught firing on Belarus in the first week trying to blame Ukraine as a way to get Belarus to join the war.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
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You almost want the Russian people to experience similar fear to what their leaders and military have done in Ukraine but then you remind yourself it wasn’t their fault either
 
Mcbean

Mcbean

Well-Known Member
Still shelling going on - coms are particularly poor for the Russian army - Putin wants Mariupol as it gives him a corridor to Crimea where they can have a Southern naval base and a quicker access to the West - that is his stage one objective
 
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