Sky Blue Pete
Well-Known Member
We’ve had fabulous players in the past and not done as well
Qatar World Cup 2022 (11 Viewers)
- Thread starter covboy1987
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Liquid Gold
Well-Known Member
This all reminds me of watching the Italia 90 documentaries and seeing the press rip into Air Bobby for no other reason than the grass is always greener.
ajsccfc
Well-Known Member
Southgate has his faults (I still don't get it with Mason Mount but he's not the only manager to pick him) but he's done a great job all the same. I'd never seen us in a major final before, and that followed a World Cup semi and what I'd argue is the pick of the bunch, the 2018–19 UEFA Nations League bronze medal
Otis
Well-Known Member
Yes, really.
Look at Mount and Saka for their clubs.
Quite often the biggest attacking threat.
We have some fabulous attacking talent and real skill in our ranks, but play too defensively and our defence clearly isn't good enough.
Otis
Well-Known Member
That is true. We too defensive under Capello and Ericksson too
Liquid Gold
Well-Known Member
That's the reason why we play defensively. If we had prime Ferdinand, Cole and Terry at the back then we would be able to be more adventurous but if we played Keegan ball with this lot then we'd be ripped apart at the back.
Otis
Well-Known Member
I didn't. I thought he was an excellent manager.
Otis
Well-Known Member
Yes and I get why we play both Rice and Phillips. It makes sense.
But we need to allow our attacking players to attack.
Mount isn't the same player for England and Kane often gets completely isolated
This is why I like Grealish. I know he can be hit and miss, but he puts defences on the back foot. Sterling has the ability to do the same.
As I say, I think Southgate has done alright, but he needs to get the balance right between defence and attack and at times we are far too defensive.
1ccfc
Well-Known Member
Just my opinion, but I think we've been really lucky in the last 2 tournaments with the draw. When you look at the world cup, yes we got to the semi finals, but when you look at the opposition, surly we would have expected no less and maybe more? We lost in the group to Belgium which ironically turned into a good result, as it left us playing Columbia in the last 16 and Sweden in the quarters. We then lost to Croatia in the semi after being 1 - 0 up at half time and lost to Belgium again in the 3rd place game. Of the 7 games we played we lost 3. Again, in the Euros we had a decent draw. We topped a poor group scoring 2 goals in 3 games. Yes, the Germany result was good, but moving on would we not have been more surprised to lose to Ukraine or Denmark who we met in the quarters and semis? Italy were there for the taking, but for me our tactics were so negative. I'm sure most will disagree with my opinion, but that's the beauty of sport.
Liquid Gold
Well-Known Member
Much better than barely scraping a group of USA, Algeria and Tunisia then getting battered by Germany.
Sky Blue Pete
Well-Known Member
Who have we lost to in the past ? We have shown ourselves able to lose to any country at major finals in the past it’s a good thing we’ve beaten teams we should beat I think
1ccfc
Well-Known Member
Just me being facetious, but would that be USA, Algeria and Slovenia
1ccfc
Well-Known Member
To be fair you are right in what you say in that over the years England have it in them to lose to anyone. That doesn't make our results of beating teams we probably should any better, it just highlights that maybe England have underachieved over the years. We had the 'golden generation' who didn't perform. I just feel with Southgate, he goes into each game with the same mentality of let's not lose regardless of the opposition. To a degree I can understand this mentality, but surly as a game develops and evolves so should we? If we had been bolder in the Euros I really think we would have beaten Italy.
Sky Blue Pete
Well-Known Member
The road not travelled though we may have been soundly beaten but yep I agree
CJ_covblaze
Well-Known Member
Thought it was the right result in the end. Fairly even game. It was frustrating how often we weren’t taking the chances Germany were gifting us. Haven’t seen any of the game back yet but my first thought on the penalty was that he was offside. Pickford’s kicking was pretty shoddy and he didn’t look great for the goal but he pulled off some very important stops. It’s a shame Tomori and Foden had to withdraw. I would’ve like to have seen both in the side.
Hopefully for Italy we go to 5 at the back. We’re so much better with that formation. They looked awful last week at Wembley. Baffling what a difference a few months make.
Hopefully for Italy we go to 5 at the back. We’re so much better with that formation. They looked awful last week at Wembley. Baffling what a difference a few months make.
All down to the players he picks in that formation though. I’ve got no issue with five at the back if he plays wing backs in the the wide roles as you say Andy. Also if you play five, plus Rice and Phillips, then Mount in your front three, there’s a lack of creativity/flair in the team*
This is where it becomes a bit of a concern for me and I quite like Southgate as a manager
Of course I want our front three to work back when necessary but they should be in the team first and foremost to focus on creating and scoring goals
* You also probably don’t get Bellingham in that formation which is a real shame
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Yes, though I generally think Eriksson got a bit of a bad rap considering one was basically blundered by David Seaman against the eventual winners, we had a legit winning goal cancelled out against the Portuguese hosts and the third was a typical penalty exit.
Frostie
Well-Known Member
We don't have any decent LBs/LWBs fit, that's the problem.
SBAndy
Well-Known Member
Was thinking less of the current games and more back to the Euros when Trippier was inexplicably picked.
Frostie
Well-Known Member
Wasn't that only for the opening game v Croatia? Shaw started every other game. Trippier was picked for that one for tactical reasons, playing up against his Atletico teammate etc. & ultimately that decision was proved right, he was excellent.
HuckerbyDublinWhelan
Well-Known Member
I don’t get the argument that we had easy draws. I’m the World Cup we were supposed to play Germany and Argentina… wasn’t our fault Germany didn’t get out of a group with Sweden. I’m sure Argentina had an easy draw and struggled
likewise in the euros. Holland should have been our semi final opponent - they got beat by the Czech Republic. We played the draw we did becuase the supposed better sides lost to the teams we played.
with Southgate he’s done great - but should
Have done better. Croatia, Holland and Italy he made the same mistakes of playing too negatively. We sat on slender leads until the inevitable happens. Look at his midfield. Mount, Rice Phillips…. We’re a much more creative side with Bellingham, Foden, Sterling, Saka and Grealish.
the midfield should easily start as Rice, Bellingham, Grealish, Foden, Saka. But Southgate is too frightened to try that
likewise in the euros. Holland should have been our semi final opponent - they got beat by the Czech Republic. We played the draw we did becuase the supposed better sides lost to the teams we played.
with Southgate he’s done great - but should
Have done better. Croatia, Holland and Italy he made the same mistakes of playing too negatively. We sat on slender leads until the inevitable happens. Look at his midfield. Mount, Rice Phillips…. We’re a much more creative side with Bellingham, Foden, Sterling, Saka and Grealish.
the midfield should easily start as Rice, Bellingham, Grealish, Foden, Saka. But Southgate is too frightened to try that
Otis
Well-Known Member
He certainly made a big mistake against Italy. They were there for the taking.
As I said before, I am fine with Phillips and Rice, but then if you also play Mount in a subdued role too, you are negating so much forward play.
HuckerbyDublinWhelan
Well-Known Member
I think you can play Phillips or Rice, there’s no need for 2 holding midfielders, it just stifles our actual strength and that is that we finally have extremely talented creative players.
Italy was frustrating because we played well for 20 mins and went into our shell. Had we got a second we’d have coasted.
CJ_covblaze
Well-Known Member
I’m ok with Bellingham being used sparingly at the moment. He’s 18 and we have overused players early on in the past. I find when there are the two sitting it makes us less defensive if anything. When the ball leaves their box having two there means more often than not we can push back into their box. Similar to when an NFL team uses two Quarterbacks. It creates confusion and gives them more potential situations to cover. It also should be noted that when we’ve gone with 4 at the back it didn’t work. Hungary at Wembley springs to mind.
I do like the idea of Grealish being fresh off the bench with 20-30 minutes to go. That is probably a more effective way to use him as the combination of his fresh legs coupled with a tiring defence can cause more problems in that shorter period than him playing for the opening 60-70.
I can’t disagree with any of those comments individually, however, added together, the way Southgate sees it, it means five at the back, two holders, Mount in a front three and to date an inability to break down the best teams
For me that system works/is possibly our best option but it has to have the right players in certain positions ie proper wing backs and attackers in the front three. My concern with Southgate is he slots his favourites/more defensive leaning players in those key positions. I’m saying that as someone who likes Southgate and think he’s done a great job to date but sometimes we have been too predictable and easy to defend against and ultimately fallen short in key moments of the big games
Sky Blue Harry H
Well-Known Member
Mount - not scored in last 17 England games. Ward Prowse - took one good corner, half an hour in.
Sky Blue Harry H
Well-Known Member
Shippers is on holiday though.
Gynnsthetonic
Well-Known Member
When did Italy start playing in Sky Blue, it was always really dark blue, it is nice though wouldn't mind something similar for us one year.