We were too defensive
We should have played Maddison/Foden etc instead
We should have made more subs
If we kept playing indefinitely we might have lost
I call Southgate win bingo!
Euro qualifiers 2024 (5 Viewers)
- Thread starter Otis
- Start date
We were too defensive
We should have played Maddison/Foden etc instead
We should have made more subs
If we kept playing indefinitely we might have lost
I call Southgate win bingo!
David O'Day
Well-Known Member
A team that has to go begging Argentina U21 strikers to play for them.
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
He's at most away games
Think we need a list of teams that are actual legitimate opponents then - I’m just trying to celebrate all these England wins after enduring years of shit, only to be told afterwards they don’t really count.
You’re probably too young to remember how shit it used to be watching England in big tournaments. Then again, going by your posts on the night of the Euros final you might not remember the recent ones either.
Get one of your teachers to tell you about the three England tournaments before that - now those were fantastic days.
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
I mean statistically we picked up more wins under fabio capello , were you not tired of all the winning then ?
means very little
Roy Hodgson has picked up a higher % of points available in matches?
Were we not tired of all the winning then ?
Long story short , we've won nothing , and it's deeply dissapointing as the opposition is fucking shite these days
Hardly like going to Italy in the 90s was it
In terms of what we need today , we've basically wrapped up the group already , which is great
means very little
Roy Hodgson has picked up a higher % of points available in matches?
Were we not tired of all the winning then ?
Long story short , we've won nothing , and it's deeply dissapointing as the opposition is fucking shite these days
Hardly like going to Italy in the 90s was it
In terms of what we need today , we've basically wrapped up the group already , which is great
Tommo1993
Well-Known Member
I’ve probably seen him, per se, used to talk to him a lot, just haven’t for a long time. Went to school with his eldest.
It’s not about who’s done what statistically - I’m not sure any stat that puts Hodgson’s England career above Southgate’s is worth paying much attention to. It’s about what they’ve achieved - how many England managers bar Sir Alf wouldn’t trade their England record for Southgate’s?
People can moan all they like about how every other team is now magically worse than they were in the 90s, or how any other manager would have England winning trophies at a canter - it’s all hypothetical and you can never be proven wrong, it’s the safest argument you can ever make. Southgate clearly has flaws but he’s done a better job in major tournaments than any of his better-paid, better-regarded predecessors, and so long as there’s tangible progress under his leadership then we should keep him there.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
How about present managers - who actually is better - I think a foreign manager would be a joke
it’s worth noting Sven did achieve some tournament credibility and also was lambasted for wasted a golden generation
Mucca Mad Boys
Well-Known Member
Agreed! I don’t really think anyone would come in who is guaranteed to do a better job. Southgate, for his flaws has a good understanding of the players and international football as a whole.
International football is a more tactical game than the top end of club tournaments.
Take the champions league, as it’s a two legged tie, you could lose one match and win the tie. In a World Cup/intercontinental tournament, if you have a bad day and lose, you are out. Therefore, ties are often more closed.
Mucca Mad Boys
Well-Known Member
There’s always a ‘what if’ when Southgate hits a milestone.
We’ve lost to plenty of underperforming Italy sides. Remember 2014?
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
What milestone?
Earlsdon_Skyblue1
Well-Known Member
The thing for me is that the selection of a player like Phillips, and a second half played out in the way it did last night is just repetition to the downfalls we keep seeing under Southgate.
Ok we won, against a poor Italy side, in a glorified friendly (let's face it if we don't qualify it'll be a major embarrassment). The issues we've had weren't corrected though; so whilst it's alright to let off a few fireworks, it doesn't look like we are learning our lesson. People are validated in raising that concern.
Ok we won, against a poor Italy side, in a glorified friendly (let's face it if we don't qualify it'll be a major embarrassment). The issues we've had weren't corrected though; so whilst it's alright to let off a few fireworks, it doesn't look like we are learning our lesson. People are validated in raising that concern.
thekidfromstrettoncamp
Well-Known Member
Vic has come on for Sweden after 65mimutes 2-0 down
thekidfromstrettoncamp
Well-Known Member
3-0 down now Lukaku hatrick.
And how about England? I’d say we’ve pretty clearly improved over the last 10 years. And yet weirdly, the fact that we look so much stronger today relative to the teams who used to routinely batter us a decade ago is more often used as a reason to downplay Southgate’s achievements, rather than to acknowledge the progress we’ve made.
Sky_Blue_Dreamer
Well-Known Member
I agree. You sort of feel like we'll do pretty well, but will ultimately fall short. Fair enough to him, he's got further in tournaments than any other manager but it just feels like we're not making the most of what we've got.
Part of that is because he picks certain players like Mount and especially Phillips ahead of the likes of Foden and Maddison. If you've got Rice and Bellingham you really don't need to pick Phillips as well. With the wealth of attacking midfielders we've got there must be space for one of them in that side instead of Phillips. But if he did leave him out he'd end up picking Mount instead.
I know it's not a nice thing to say but approaching tournaments I sort of hope the like of Mount and Phillips pick up minor injuries that prevent their selection.
Earlsdon_Skyblue1
Well-Known Member
I know what you mean. I think it said everything when France scored in Qatar and his default button was to bring on Sterling and Mount.
We've got some amazing players. Whilst there is definitely some improvement when it comes to pride, there's still some way to go. We've fallen down the same way a few times now and so when he picks Phillips and goes defensive, the level of patience just isn't there.
There's obviously some fans that want us to play 11 up front, but the majority just feel like we could do a little better with what we have, as you say.
I’m not sure where this suggestion has come from that Bellingham is a defensive midfielder - others were saying it during the World Cup too. He gets forward tons, his average position last night was almost the same as Grealish’s. Sure, you can partner him with one holding midfielder instead of two, but it means he can’t get forward anywhere near as much, and we’ve seen how effective he can be during the WC.
CJ_covblaze
Well-Known Member
Back home after a decent trip. Didn’t experience a hint of trouble and the only issues were the shit show of the buses before and after the game and the overcrowding in the away end. Some buses didn’t get to the stadium and those fans missed the game meanwhile the route we had to travel from the ground to the port was ridiculous.
Very happy with the result. First half they weren’t at their best but we were as good as what we were in Seville a few years ago. Second half as expected they came out better and we won ugly. No complaints on the red card. Got what he deserved.
Very happy with the result. First half they weren’t at their best but we were as good as what we were in Seville a few years ago. Second half as expected they came out better and we won ugly. No complaints on the red card. Got what he deserved.
Nuskyblue
Well-Known Member
Yea Englands talent pool is night and day compared to 10 p ago, we definitely are strong enough to be in the conversation win something. Sadly if we don't win anything that will be a stick used to beat Southgate with rightly or wrongly.
I also take the point on board that who would we have in place of Southgate, there is in reality no other English manager to pick from. Of the coaches in the Premier League maybe you'd take Howe at Newcastle and that's about it really.
I’ve got a real issue with playing two DMs with five at the back but now he’s gone four you can see why he plays a couple defensive minded midfielders…Maguire and Stones would struggle without extra protection.
When Philips plays Rice can get forward a bit more as well. I thought Rice was very good Thursday. Needs to move from West Ham in summer though
ps hope he chucks Maddison on for a bit tomorrow. Can’t see him starting for England any time soon but he should definitely be an impact sub
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
We win (again) so we discuss the manager's failings (again)?
David O'Day
Well-Known Member
He almost threw away a 2 goal lead duie to game mismanagement so we discuss the managers failing.
Same shit that people try and pull with Robins. I’ll just enjoy the win, thanks.