Southport Stabbing (76 Viewers)

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I thought the reference to Phillips was the Muslim comments which led him to be banned from the Labour Party

There was no quote cited in that post.

 

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[Brighton Sky Blue]

Yes and people were arrested who had just converted to Islam who planned to carry out a terror attack. Aren't you just assuming he was Christian too?

Let's not pretend that people don't think things, rightly or wrongly. Look at the Manchester Arena Bombings, a security guard had a bad feeling but was too scared to do anything about it.

People will be judging others hundreds of times a day whether they mean to or not, based on loads of different factors.

Of course, if they start smashing things up based on it then it's completely different.

Terrorists have common strategies regardless of their ideology. If your first thought in reaction to Southport was ‘he’s a Muslim’, maybe it’s you that needs to do some introspection as well.

 

[Grendel]

There was no quote cited in that post.

I think that’s semantics. Sultana and the anti semite Naz shah said his comments were racist and a stain on the party.

 

[PVA]

Let's not pretend that people don't think things, rightly or wrongly.

People can think what they like.

We just don't want to read those thoughts on here when they're racist thoughts.

That's all there is to it.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

I think you'll find he did say it, but I'm not prepared to waste time digging around just to prove a point to what I assume to be a group of school sixth formers.

When it comes to mass stabbings in public places in Europe (and beyond), well yes, many such attacks are performed by Muslims in the name of Allah.

Just looking at Wikipedia- Nigerians are among the best performing student groups in the country. Numbers in private schools are growing and they outperform almost all other groups by 21.8%.

For you though they’re just “predisposed to fraud”. Which sums up the issue with people like you, you hurl stereotypes around in order to classify groups however you want to.

 

[Nick]

Terrorists have common strategies regardless of their ideology. If your first thought in reaction to Southport was ‘he’s a Muslim’, maybe it’s you that needs to do some introspection as well.

My first thought was "fucking hell thats awful, poor kids" but lets not pretend people don't have thoughts. about things. Like when it came out about Taylor Swift concerts being targetted, if people didn't have a thought of "are they linked" then they are lying.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I think that’s semantics. Sultana and the anti semite Naz shah said his comments were racist and a stain on the party.

As the post is written anyone would believe they are the poster’s own views. A lazy attempt to tar people based on where they were born and to assume the religion of the attacker based on how he attacked.

It being allowed to stay up on here is a disgrace.

 

[Grendel]

Just looking at Wikipedia- Nigerians are among the best performing student groups in the country. Numbers in private schools are growing and they outperform almost all other groups by 21.8%.

For you though they’re just “predisposed to fraud”. Which sums up the issue with people like you, you hurl stereotypes around in order to classify groups however you want to.

It’s a growth industry in Nigeria

Fraud: A thriving trend in Nigeria’s challenging economy

punchng.com

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

It’s a growth industry in Nigeria

Fraud: A thriving trend in Nigeria’s challenging economy

punchng.com

I get that you want to be a contrarian but you might want to think before going down this particular rabbit hole.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

It’s a growth industry in Nigeria

Fraud: A thriving trend in Nigeria’s challenging economy

punchng.com

That’s Nigeria, not the U.K. But you knew that didn’t you, and you’re now going to do your usual thing of being “contrary” for attention.

 

[Grendel]

I get that you want to be a contrarian but you might want to think before going down this particular rabbit hole.

Im not being anything. Saying Nigeria is one of the main countries for fraud I don’t believe is racist. I also have never believed saying grooming gangs are more likely to be Pakistani Muslims isn’t racist.

I think there is a fine line between freedom of expression and suppression as some find certain comments offensive - it’s often a subjective debate

 

[Nick]

Genuine Question, do people really want to police thoughts? Everybody who thought that the southport attacker might have been muslim based on what they heard being racist? These are thoughts....

Obviously, people will have thoughts and conclusions, often right and often wrong. Acting on them and attacking mosques is completely wrong (even if it came that he was muslim).

Let's not pretend people don't have thoughts though. If people say they don't (both positive or negative) then they are lying.

 

[Grendel]

That’s Nigeria, not the U.K. But you knew that didn’t you, and you’re now going to do your usual thing of being “contrary” for attention.

i think plenty of people are seeking attention on here and desperate to provoke this discussion again

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Im not being anything. Saying Nigeria is one of the main countries for fraud I don’t believe is racist. I also have never believed saying grooming gangs are more likely to be Pakistani Muslims isn’t racist.

I think there is a fine line between freedom of expression and suppression as some find certain comments offensive - it’s often a subjective debate

Noted for when you next think certain posters should be banned.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

Im not being anything. Saying Nigeria is one of the main countries for fraud I don’t believe is racist. I also have never believed saying grooming gangs are more likely to be Pakistani Muslims isn’t racist.

I think there is a fine line between freedom of expression and suppression as some find certain comments offensive - it’s often a subjective debate

He’s clearly suggesting that Nigerians in the U.K. are “predisposed to fraud”.

 

[Grendel]

He’s clearly suggesting that Nigerians in the U.K. are “predisposed to fraud”.

That’s not how I read it

 

[Ring Of Steel]

That’s not how I read it

What a surprise.

 

[shmmeee]

That is different to ascribing different criminal acts to different nationalities seeking to live here.

Sure. But overall any visa agreement is based on assumptions about the people coming from that country. We trust US citizens more than Afghani citizens for a reason.

But to the point I don’t think there’s any evidence of an increase in fraud from Nigerian immigrants. Why would they move to the UK police’s jurisdiction before committing online fraud??

 

[Grendel]

The reality is that certain cohorts are predisposed to certain types of crime - Albanians seem to speciaise in weed farming, Nigerians fraud etc.

Romanians are a bit of a curved ball - not sure if they have a specific area, although Roma are considered a bit of a pain.

The Southport attack used an approach flavoured by Islamic militants, so people couldn't be blamed for jumping to conclusions. I still would not be too surprised if the attacker was a recent convert or had dabbled in some way.

This is the quote. So my interpretation is Nigerians specialist crime is internet fraud which is what I’d have come up with if asked the question.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

Noted for when you next think certain posters should be banned.

Which appears to be a pretty regular occurrence

 

[Grendel]

Which appears to be a pretty regular occurrence

Is it?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

This is the quote. So my interpretation is Nigerians specialist crime is internet fraud which is what I’d have come up with if asked the question.

He is almost literally saying that Nigerian immigrants are predisposed to fraud.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

This is the quote. So my interpretation is Nigerians specialist crime is internet fraud which is what I’d have come up with if asked the question.

Oh sure it is, in a thread about U.K. groups & immigration.

 

[Grendel]

He is almost literally saying that Nigerian immigrants are predisposed to fraud.

Nigerian national extradited from UK to face fraud charges

Ezennia Peter Neboh, 48, Kennedy Ikponmwosa, 51, and Prince Amos Okey Ezemma, 49, of Madrid, Spain; and Iheanyichukwu Jonathan Abraham, 44, Emmanuel Samuel, 39, and Jerry Chucks Ozor, 43, of London, face federal charges in Miami.

www.ice.gov

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Nigerian national extradited from UK to face fraud charges

Ezennia Peter Neboh, 48, Kennedy Ikponmwosa, 51, and Prince Amos Okey Ezemma, 49, of Madrid, Spain; and Iheanyichukwu Jonathan Abraham, 44, Emmanuel Samuel, 39, and Jerry Chucks Ozor, 43, of London, face federal charges in Miami.

www.ice.gov

Point being? What other conclusion are you meant to draw from what was posted?

 

[Nick]

I find it really baffling that people claim they don't have instant thoughts and assumptions about things.

One of the very first thing that gets checked is a location of something when we are digging into things because 95-100% of the time it is particular countries trying dodgy shit.

It's just the same as the security guard in Manchester who had a gut feeling but was too scared to act on it because he would be labelled. I am pretty sure people make assumptions based on how I look if I am in particular situations, it's normal.

How many people would have racial profiled in their head with their thoughts about getting on a flight after 9/11? How many have had instant thoughts based on a white skinhead?

 

[PVA]

I find it really baffling that people claim they don't have instant thoughts and assumptions about things.

Again, what people think is up to them.

That's very different to posting racial stereotypes on here.

If people want to have those thoughts then fine, but keep it to themselves or share it with other knuckle draggers on X. We don't want to see it on here.

Surely you can see the difference?

 

[Grendel]

Again, what people think is up to them.

That's very different to posting racial stereotypes on here.

If people want to have those thoughts then fine, but keep it to themselves or share it with other knuckle draggers on X. We don't want to see it on here.

Surely you can see the difference?

So if anyone is offended by anything someone puts on here it should be removed?

 

[Sick Boy]

In fairness, Nigeria is one of the most fraudulent countries in the world. On the same list is actually Romania. Both those countries along with Albania have an overrepresented prison population in the UK. If you split it by religion there's also some interesting statistics.

I don't see why we can't talk about this normally and acknowledge these statistics, rather than doing the whole extreme opinions thing. Either painting everybody from one place as one thing on one side, or calling people racist on the other for talking about it. There's never any middle ground and it turns the forum into a playground.

As I mentioned I this thread before there’s a significant population of Albanians in Italy as they’ve been migrating here for decades and they absolutely aren’t over represented in the prison numbers. They’re normal people working and paying taxes like me and you.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

So if anyone is offended by anything someone puts on here it should be removed?

'I think we should get rid of Kasey Palmer' isn't quite in the same realm as 'Nigerian immigrants are predisposed to fraud' but your contrarian mind of course already knows that.

 

[Grendel]

As I mentioned I this thread before there’s a significant population of Albanians in Italy as they’ve been migrating here for decades and they absolutely aren’t over represented in the prison numbers. They’re normal people working and paying taxes like me and you.

Well.

Albanian organized crime groups have become key players in Italy’s criminal landscape, prompting targeted operations from authorities.

Albanian criminal groups in Italy have evolved from small-time criminals to significant players in certain illicit economies, such as cocaine and cannabis trafficking. These groups have expanded their area of operations from large cities such as Rome to smaller towns and rural communities...

riskbulletins.globalinitiative.net

 

[Grendel]

'I think we should get rid of Kasey Palmer' isn't quite in the same realm as 'Nigerian immigrants are predisposed to fraud' but your contrarian mind of course already knows that.

It’s not a contrarian mind - some people get offended others don’t - who judges what is correct and what isn’t?

 

[Nick]

As I mentioned I this thread before there’s a significant population of Albanians in Italy as they’ve been migrating here for decades and they absolutely aren’t over represented in the prison numbers. They’re normal people working and paying taxes like me and you.

It's pretty much a meme over here about Albanians being drug dealers and it's fact about weed farms and prison numbers?

It doesn't mean every albanian is a criminal, of course not. It doesn't mean every albanian should be arrested on sight.

Let's not pretend it doesn't play a part in people's thoughts or investigations of things. It's human nature.

It's just the same as people's first thought about car washes nowadays will be Eastern Europeans. Same as barbers, nail salons will have a lot of asian people.

 

[Sick Boy]

Well.

Albanian organized crime groups have become key players in Italy’s criminal landscape, prompting targeted operations from authorities.

Albanian criminal groups in Italy have evolved from small-time criminals to significant players in certain illicit economies, such as cocaine and cannabis trafficking. These groups have expanded their area of operations from large cities such as Rome to smaller towns and rural communities...

riskbulletins.globalinitiative.net

It’s a tiny percentage of the population. I’ve posted the figures on here before.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

I find it really baffling that people claim they don't have instant thoughts and assumptions about things.

One of the very first thing that gets checked is a location of something when we are digging into things because 95-100% of the time it is particular countries trying dodgy shit.

It's just the same as the security guard in Manchester who had a gut feeling but was too scared to act on it because he would be labelled. I am pretty sure people make assumptions based on how I look if I am in particular situations, it's normal.

How many people would have racial profiled in their head with their thoughts about getting on a flight after 9/11?

Thoughts yes, assumptions not so much. Thoughts are human nature, I agree there.

I know full well that there have been Muslim terror attacks, I also know shitloads of Muslims who are wonderful people, and that the ones who do these things are a tiny minority, but also that when they do happen they are horrific. I also know that Nigeria has a fraud problem, but that in the UK Nigerians are performing really well in education, contributing to the economy and are long integrated, therefore I am able to avoid ‘assumptions’ that “Nigerians are predisposed to fraud” when we’re talking about Nigerians in the UK.

I agree that thoughts are just human nature, but when they become racial stereotypes of entire groups the likes of which are going up on here, I don’t agree one bit.

I see these racist stereotypes as a sign of a lack of intelligence to be honest, an inability to see that the actions of some people doesn’t mean that entire races are put in a box. Not all English people are hooligans, not all Muslims are terrorists, not all Nigerians are fraudsters. Thoughts are one thing and understandable, but deal in fact, not ‘assumptions’