Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (4 Viewers)

[CCFCSteve]

The Imperial College team stepped in and warned the government that the plan they had started off with would kill 250,000 people. So our government had to change direction, causing more delays. I know there is a temptation to edit history here, because they have presided over one of the biggest mistakes any government has ever made, but they are the facts here.

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Looks like that link might not work- here's the first patagraph- "About 250,000 people would have died in the UK under the government’s previous strategy for dealing with the coronavirus crisis", according to Imperial College researchers.

I was saying earlier that whoever makes the decision in terms of ending the lockdown, I just hope they make it following scientific and medical advice.

As far as I’m aware that Imperial college research team was set up to advise the government. They produced their report and the government followed their advice.

Do I think the government and their advisors hoped they wouldn’t have to put the country into full lockdown, yes. When it became apparent that there wouldn’t be the capacity in the health service to deal with the pandemic without a lockdown they implemented those measures. I don’t believe that’s editing history.

ps as I’ve said before, the bigger question for me is did they utilise the time they brought themselves with the good initial track and trace (self isolation) policy to get other areas in order. such as ventilator numbers/orders (we’ll probably find out this/next week - I hope so but not sure) and testing of NHS staff and their families to ensure workforce is not kept away from frontline unnecessarily (appears not currently). I still can’t get my head around the PPE distribution situation, apparently 300m+ pieces of PPE was distributed over the last fortnight. So it appears to be there, just some hospitals etc are running out and not getting replenishments quickly enough.

 

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[Grendel]

I was saying earlier that whoever makes the decision in terms of ending the lockdown, I just hope they make it following scientific and medical advice.

As far as I’m aware that Imperial college research team was set up to advise the government. They produced their report and the government followed their advice.

Do I think the government and their advisors hoped they wouldn’t have to put the country into full lockdown, yes. When it became apparent that there wouldn’t be the capacity in the health service to deal with the pandemic without a lockdown they implemented those measures. I don’t believe that’s editing history.

ps as I’ve said before, the bigger question for me is did they utilise the time they brought themselves with the good initial track and trace (self isolation) policy to get other areas in order. such as ventilator numbers/orders (we’ll probably find out this/next week - I hope so but not sure) and testing of NHS staff and their families to ensure workforce is not kept away from frontline unnecessarily (appears not currently). I still can’t get my head around the PPE distribution situation, apparently 300m+ pieces of PPE was distributed over the last fortnight. So I think it’s there, just some hospitals etc are running out and not getting replenishments quickly enough.

Far too sensible for here

 

[Flying Fokker]

Also as this forum now seems to have become a small band of left wing frothers venting their spleen perhaps one of you can explain the labour policy on politicians pay

The Blair government voted several times for inflation busting pay rises and then an independent body was set up

In 2015 it suggested a £7,000 pay rise in austerity Britain for MPs

Many labour MPs said it sent out a wrong message. The SNP MPs gave the pay rise to charity. However, despite the indignation I do not think any Labour MP did the same or indeed in 2017 when the rise was around 3% - there may be some but I can’t find any

There’s me thinking it was old GMK patrons....it’s all a bit ‘Topsy Turvy, What?’

 

[skybluetony176]

Many good points in your post Tony and I don’t disagree.
I think all governments do some good but also fuck up over time. for personal reasons I have a distinct lack of faith and trust in all sides!

Don’t disagree Moff. Didn’t that go disappointingly well

 

[David O'Day]

Let's home that no one else feels pressured to be a strongman leader and takes the required time off if sick

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

What's your point?
I don't know how most of them have performed apart from those 3 and Spain, France, Begium, Italy and the Netherlands to be honest.
But again, it's deflection, I'm pointing out where our government, the one I pay my taxes to has fucked up. I'm sure the citizens of those countries will do the same.

You haven't answered any of my question.

I totally get your point and you're absolutely right in what you said in your post there.

That being said, what's strange is a lot of my friends around Europe are pointing and laughing at us. They seem to be being told that we are a bit of an embarrassment in how we handled it. I don't really get it as most other countries have behaved quite similar to us, and Sweden for example is a category worse. They don't seem to get any stick though.

 

[David O'Day]

But people are talking about Boris. They'll say get well soon to make sure we know they're a good guy and then caveat it with a list of reasons why they don't like him, its crass at best.

Surely it's best just to leave it for a couple of days? I can assure you, no government advisors are looking into this forum to see what we think the next move should be.

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Doing the right thing is bad now?

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

But people are talking about Boris. They'll say get well soon to make sure we know they're a good guy and then caveat it with a list of reasons why they don't like him, its crass at best.

Surely it's best just to leave it for a couple of days? I can assure you, no government advisors are looking into this forum to see what we think the next move should be.

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No, but 'Coventry Live' might do an article:

'5 things Sky Blues Talk think about government strategies.'

 

[Liquid Gold]

I totally get your point and you're absolutely right in what you said in your post there.

That being said, what's strange is a lot of my friends around Europe are pointing and laughing at us. They seem to be being told that we are a bit of an embarrassment in how we handled it. I don't really get it as most other countries have behaved quite similar to us, and Sweden for example is a category worse. They don't seem to get any stick though.

Europe is a bit of a clusterfuck all round as far as I can tell. East Asia they’ve done it correctly by the looks of things but they have experience from SARS etc. Hopefully we learn the lessons and prepare our health service for every eventuality after this.

 

[clint van damme]

I totally get your point and you're absolutely right in what you said in your post there.

That being said, what's strange is a lot of my friends around Europe are pointing and laughing at us. They seem to be being told that we are a bit of an embarrassment in how we handled it. I don't really get it as most other countries have behaved quite similar to us, and Sweden for example is a category worse. They don't seem to get any stick though.

I've hardly criticised the government for the way they've handled it.
I've criticised them for how under prepared we are.
The couldn't have seen it coming rhetoric is a smokescreen.
As I have asked repeatedly, why, going into the crisis, did Germany have almost 5 time as many beds per 100,000 as the UK?

 

[David O'Day]

What's the right thing? Chatting shit on a football forum?

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No stating you hope a fellow human being gets better.

 

[BornSlippySkyBlue]

Ok, so you don't understand. It's in very poor taste.

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What, so because someone is poorly nobody is allowed to comment on any mistakes that person might have made in their political career? The career that they chose, knowing full well they would be the target for criticism should things not work out perfectly.

Is the logical extension of that, should he die (and let’s all agree nobody wants anyone to die, c**t or not) that we cannot comment on any of it because it would then be in poor taste? Sorry, bullshit reasoning. He’s in hospital, nobody wants him to die. He’s not immune to criticism (or Covid 19 apparently) and nor are his decisions and / or policies.

Personally I hope it provides him with a genuine insight into the shit that NHS staff have to wade through on a daily basis, and I hope he sees the real version, not the sanitised media friendly photo opportunity version he usually sees when visiting hospitals and pretending to be ‘the party of the NHS’ (and yes, they did say that).

 

[clint van damme]

Not a member of a political party then - still if he had killed him it’s a start I suppose

Oh dear.

 

[SeaSeeEffCee]

Not a member of a political party then - still if he had killed him it’s a start I suppose

What are you even trying to say?

You said no-one wanted Corbyn to die when someone literally carried out an attack on an event he was hoping Corbyn was at in an attempt to kill him. Once again proven that all you do is chat utter shit and ignore everything that doesn't support your own agenda. I'm sure you'll bring up some obscure thing that a Labour politician did in the 1951 to argue that it's all Labour's fault that this bloke carried out said attack. Political point scoring at this time in disgusting unless you're the one doing it I'm sure.

 

[Flying Fokker]

Would Labour's policy of investing in the NHS have helped or hindered the efforts?

I’d like to say help. The NHS will change as a result of this current crisis. As with all jobs, people are doing things they would not do. One thing for certain, Labour would pour money in...

 

[David O'Day]

What, so because someone is poorly nobody is allowed to comment on any mistakes that person might have made in their political career? The career that they chose, knowing full well they would be the target for criticism should things not work out perfectly.

Is the logical extension of that, should he die (and let’s all agree nobody wants anyone to die, c**t or not) that we cannot comment on any of it because it would then be in poor taste? Sorry, bullshit reasoning. He’s in hospital, nobody wants him to die. He’s not immune to criticism (or Covid 19 apparently) and nor are his decisions and / or policies.

Personally I hope it provides him with a genuine insight into the shit that NHS staff have to wade through on a daily basis, and I hope he sees the real version, not the sanitised media friendly photo opportunity version he usually sees when visiting hospitals and pretending to be ‘the party of the NHS’ (and yes, they did say that).

This

 

[Flying Fokker]

We best hope Germany still has some space for us given we have less ICU beds per 1000 than both France and Italy. I’m sure that’s the point you’re making.

Fill the Nightingale hospitals first before we talking sending people anywhere else.

 

[Flying Fokker]

But people are talking about Boris. They'll say get well soon to make sure we know they're a good guy and then caveat it with a list of reasons why they don't like him, its crass at best.

Surely it's best just to leave it for a couple of days? I can assure you, no government advisors are looking into this forum to see what we think the next move should be.

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Thanks, I’m reassured.

 

[Grendel]

Oh dear.

It’s only a joke

 

[skybluetony176]

But people are talking about Boris. They'll say get well soon to make sure we know they're a good guy and then caveat it with a list of reasons why they don't like him, its crass at best.

Surely it's best just to leave it for a couple of days? I can assure you, no government advisors are looking into this forum to see what we think the next move should be.

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Boris, Doris over the road, it’s irrelevant who it is. Heavens forbid but if Boris needs a ventilator and there isn’t one available are you saying we shouldn’t criticise his government for failing a Coronavirus patient? It’s not crass if it’s relevant. To say he has shit hair would be crass as it’s irrelevant. A lack of ventilators and PPE is very relevant so in no way could be crass.
As someone else pointed out we’ve all witnessed and some personally experienced the failings caused in the NHS over the last ten years. What’s crass is seeing my grandmother having to be rushed into hospital three times in her last 2 months and each time being put on a gurney in a corridor, 6 hours the shortest time and 12 the longest. This was only a couple of years ago and it wasn’t even winter. This is the only time I’ve ever been glad that she’s gone because the thought of going through that with her in the current climate is unbearable. Boris will already be receiving the best possible care not simply because of who he is but because there’s capacity at the moment to extend that to everyone else but that ain’t going last. So the questions need asking now.

 

[David O'Day]

Fill the Nightingale hospitals first before we talking sending people anywhere else.

Yeah we've increased capacity massively

 

[Ring Of Steel]

Calling someone whos, if rumours are to believed, life is in the balance a c**t just because you don't agree with his politics really does nothing for you cause I'm afraid.

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Oh come on- stop twisting his words.

 

[Flying Fokker]

Yeah we've increased capacity massively

Then other exhibition halls or even concourses in stadia...providing they are heated and sealed off from the elements.

 

[skybluetony176]

What are you even trying to say?

You said no-one wanted Corbyn to die when someone literally carried out an attack on an event he was hoping Corbyn was at in an attempt to kill him. Once again proven that all you do is chat utter shit and ignore everything that doesn't support your own agenda. I'm sure you'll bring up some obscure thing that a Labour politician did in the 1951 to argue that it's all Labour's fault that this bloke carried out said attack. Political point scoring at this time in disgusting unless you're the one doing it I'm sure.

That’s before you even consider bringing Jo Cox into it.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

The left always scream death to Tory leaders - same with thatcher and even many of them towards Blair - drag to to The Hague and out him in prison - some are now suggesting a national holiday to celebrate Johnson’s death

The left are always going to act like this as they are always in the minority and always show their true colours in times like this

Kind of resenting the lefty generalisations here...

 

[Skybluefaz]

Uefa president says there is no way Liverpool won't be crowned champions, one way or the other

 

[Skybluefaz]

Hopefully good for us

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

The BBC have done an article on the possibility of reopening schools according to an Imperial professor. He says keeping them shut reduces the death rate by ‘only 3-4%’. What does it say when measures are dismissed because they don’t save *enough* lives?

 

[Skybluefaz]

Let's hope that filters down then. Has to really, I'm not even worried anymore.

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I'm kind of in that mindset whilst always remembering we are Cov, and bad stuff happens to us

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Kind of resenting the lefty generalisations here...

G has gone full Ben Shapiro today, it’s a shame

 

[SeaSeeEffCee]

The BBC have done an article on the possibility of reopening schools according to an Imperial professor. He says keeping them shut reduces the death rate by ‘only 3-4%’. What does it say when measures are dismissed because they don’t save *enough* lives?

3-4% of the UK population is 2 million people. Obviously not every one in the country will get the virus but even if only a quarter did that would still be 500k deaths. What an utterly insane suggestion.

 

[TomRad85]

I'm kind of in that mindset whilst always remembering we are Cov, and bad stuff happens to us

Yeh I'm trying to shake off the 'its Cov, it must go wrong' thing. Its difficult but to fuck us they'd have to fuck a lot of other teams too, so hopefully safety in numbers.

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[djr8369]

G has gone full Ben Shapiro today, it’s a shame

More entertaining than Tiger King though.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

G has gone full Ben Shapiro today, it’s a shame

Thats not a bad comparison, true colours unfortunately revealed. It was certainly one hell of a meltdown.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

I've hardly criticised the government for the way they've handled it.
I've criticised them for how under prepared we are.
The couldn't have seen it coming rhetoric is a smokescreen.
As I have asked repeatedly, why, going into the crisis, did Germany have almost 5 time as many beds per 100,000 as the UK?

I think what you've said is completely reasonable to be honest. I agree with it.

I'm not sure about Germany though. The virus is pretty much the same everywhere, I don't understand their situation. In fact I would go so far as to say I don't believe it.