Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (5 Viewers)

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Funny how people talk about an acceptable death rate when it’s not them or their loved ones dying.

Dom said we can't keep locked down forever. So the question is relevant

 

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[Brighton Sky Blue]

I've read so many articles blasting the UK, mainly because I've got many friends (In Czech Republic, Germany, Russia, Spain, Netherlands, and Turkey to name a few) that have regularly been in touch asking what on earth is going on.

Quite a bit of the media I've seen is actively mocking us and they include articles about tory politicians that aren't even Boris.

Compare that with Sweden, and whilst I have seen critical articles, it is nowhere near on the scale than what we have had.

They aren't top of the continental death charts

 

[shmmeee]

I still don’t get the issue here?

Are we implying other countries are leftie anti Boris types and that’s why they think we’re doing badly as opposed to because they data says we’re doing badly?

 

[skybluetony176]

No, I said across the world the UK gets worse press than Sweden on this.

Probably because Sweden is up front and very clearly about its strategy. The U.K. should be no where near as bad as it is considering that our government are claiming lockdown etc. That’s why the U.K. is getting scrutinised in the world press.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

The Guardian's been quite critical of their satrategy, to name but one so-called lefty rag...

Yes, it has been critical to an extent. I've read articles on there about it. No need to make such a snide comment really.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

They aren't top of the continental death charts

Neither were we at one point.

 

[clint van damme]

I've read so many articles blasting the UK, mainly because I've got many friends (In Czech Republic, Germany, Russia, Spain, Netherlands, and Turkey to name a few) that have regularly been in touch asking what on earth is going on.

Quite a bit of the media I've seen is actively mocking us and they include articles about tory politicians that aren't even Boris.

Compare that with Sweden, and whilst I have seen critical articles, it is nowhere near on the scale than what we have had.

Let's be clear, our politicians deserve everything they are getting much and more.
Whether Sweden's politicians do as well doesn't really concern me to be honest.
But even if they do, that doesn't mean ours should be let of the hook.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Probably because Sweden is up front and very clearly about its strategy. The U.K. should be no where near as bad as it is considering that our government are claiming lockdown etc. That’s why the U.K. is getting scrutinised in the world press.

So are you saying it is true that we are getting a lot more stick?

I can't work it out. Some say I'm wrong, and some say I'm right for the wrong reasons.

It really does feel like it doesn't go down when you come on this thread and don't tow the narrative.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Neither were we at one point.

When Italy was in crisis at the start it got the lion's share of the coverage. Now it's 3 months on and we are clearly the worst, plus the second biggest economy on the continent. I don't really get your point, our government deserves to be the main focus for its awful handling of the outbreak and even now evidence is emerging that they ignored the SAGE recommendations on school reopening to go ahead with their own thing.

The government can't be trusted to keep its own citizens safe.

 

[clint van damme]

You're falling into a trap here, the furlough money and support for self employed is the only thing keeping the economy going as there is and still will be limited demand otherwise.

Sent from my ELE-L29 using Tapatalk

True. But it's clear these schemes are being wound down.
People aren't going to accept lock down restrictions and no income.
That's why we needed to get it right during the lockdown and we haven't.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Let's be clear, our politicians deserve everything they are getting much and more.
Whether Sweden's politicians do as well doesn't really concern me to be honest.
But even if they do, that doesn't mean ours should be let of the hook.

I don't think ours should be left off the hook. I think some people are just surprised when I talk about another country because the frothing of tory bashing has to take a brief pause for a second.

I've said numerous times they have dealt with it appallingly.

My issue is that other countries are generally being let off the hook.

I haven't seen it published almost anywhere that Norway has closed its land border with Sweden for the first time in eleventy billion years, but in Turkey everyone knows who Matt Hancock is. It's mental.

As you said in your earlier post, you accept Germany's figures are completely out of line with the rest of the world. Why isn't that being talked about?

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

When Italy was in crisis at the start it got the lion's share of the coverage. Now it's 3 months on and we are clearly the worst, plus the second biggest economy on the continent. I don't really get your point, our government deserves to be the main focus for its awful handling of the outbreak and even now evidence is emerging that they ignored the SAGE recommendations on school reopening to go ahead with their own thing.

The government can't be trusted to keep its own citizens safe.

I agree with your point about the UK inwardly looking, but I'm not talking about that.

See my reply to Clint for a bit more clarity.

 

[clint van damme]

So are you saying it is true that we are getting a lot more stick?

I can't work it out. Some say I'm wrong, and some say I'm right for the wrong reasons.

It really does feel like it doesn't go down when you come on this thread and don't tow the narrative.

What does it matter?
Our government has been poor, our death rate is high.
What comfort would you get from Sweden getting more stick in the world press if it is true that they are being treated less harshly?

 

[Skybluefaz]

4 months in and we are starting to put a system in place to control people coming into the country

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I agree with your point about the UK inwardly looking, but I'm not talking about that.

See my reply to Clint for a bit more clarity.

Well for starters the USA has got quite a lot of criticism on here and rightly so seeing as they're the worst on the planet. In the other cases, it's probably because we're British so have focused on what goes on in this country lest it go even more on a tangent than it already has. I reject the idea though that it's all about hitting the Tories-they're in charge and have fucked up. We could discuss Turkey sending infected refugees across the Greek border but it's probably of much less interest because it won't affect anyone here.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

What does it matter?
Our government has been poor, our death rate is high.
What comfort would you get from Sweden getting more stick in the world press if it is true that they are being treated less harshly?

So now you are kind of saying I might have a point, but that I just shouldn't care about it?

 

[skybluetony176]

So are you saying it is true that we are getting a lot more stick?

I can't work it out. Some say I'm wrong, and some say I'm right for the wrong reasons.

It really does feel like it doesn't go down when you come on this thread and don't tow the narrative.

I can’t say I’ve noticed but then I haven’t looked. But if we are the government has provided the ammunition. They’ve systematically failed. We had a lockdown that in many respects never was, we had the benefit of hindsight from being 2 weeks behind Italy and Spain only to squander it, we deliberately sent the disease into care homes, we have a PM who ignored his own advice and caught it etc etc etc etc. If the world press are knocking them over it’s only because Boris and co are standing them up. It’s a fuck up and a national disgrace, we have the second highest death toll in the western world when we really never should have if it had been handled correctly. I would be more shocked if the world press wasn’t talking about this embarrassment Boris has overseen.

 

[clint van damme]

I don't think ours should be left off the hook. I think some people are just surprised when I talk about another country because the frothing of tory bashing has to take a brief pause for a second.

I've said numerous times they have dealt with it appallingly.

My issue is that other countries are generally being let off the hook.

I haven't seen it published almost anywhere that Norway has closed its land border with Sweden for the first time in eleventy billion years, but in Turkey everyone knows who Matt Hancock is. It's mental.

As you said in your earlier post, you accept Germany's figures are completely out of line with the rest of the world. Why isn't that being talked about?

But this is our country and therefore our main concern
It works the other way in that countries who have done a great job of controlling it don't get mentioned that often either.

I have a daughter working as a carer who was struggling to get PPE, their are people on here with relatives who work for the NHS, people with young kids that are being returned to return to s to, Why would we be more concerned with What is going on in Sweden or Germany?

 

[clint van damme]

So now you are kind of saying I might have a point, but that I just shouldn't care about it?

You can care about it if you want that a your prerogative. There's nothing wrong with that.
I'm just far more concerned with What's going on here.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Well for starters the USA has got quite a lot of criticism on here and rightly so seeing as they're the worst on the planet. In the other cases, it's probably because we're British so have focused on what goes on in this country lest it go even more on a tangent than it already has. I reject the idea though that it's all about hitting the Tories-they're in charge and have fucked up. We could discuss Turkey sending infected refugees across the Greek border but it's probably of much less interest because it won't affect anyone here.

I'm not saying you're wrong with what you have said, but the US generally gets a lot of criticism anyway because of Trump.

Again though, I'm talking mainly about world news. We are run by buffoons but my God don't people want to hammer it home.

 

[Blind-Faith]

So when Boris gave his speech on that Sunday night , the R was between .5 and .9 . Now we’re being told it’s between .7 and 1. Starting to creep up slightly already.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

But this is our country and therefore our main concern
It works the other way in that countries who have done a great job of controlling it don't get mentioned that often either.

I have a daughter working as a carer who was struggling to get PPE, their are people on here with relatives who work for the NHS, people with young kids that are being returned to return to s to, Why would we be more concerned with What is going on in Sweden or Germany?

Again, I'm not arguing about anyone's comments about the UK. I agree with a lot of them.

I just personally feel like on the world stage people like the hammer us. I wouldn't mind as the UK is going downhill in my view, but other countries get away with similar stuff as our sins.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I'm not saying you're wrong with what you have said, but the US generally gets a lot of criticism anyway because of Trump.

Again though, I'm talking mainly about world news. We are run by buffoons but my God don't people want to hammer it home.

Trump is getting the most and quite rightly, he's talking about taking ineffective drugs on national broadcasts. If it seems like the UK and USA are getting the bulk of criticism, it's because they're two of the worst countries in the world for handling this disease and also both major economies. Do you think we have an anti-UK agenda or something?

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Trump is getting the most and quite rightly, he's talking about taking ineffective drugs on national broadcasts. If it seems like the UK and USA are getting the bulk of criticism, it's because they're two of the worst countries in the world for handling this disease and also both major economies. Do you think we have an anti-UK agenda or something?

I'm generally a bit fed up of the UK myself but I really feel (especially as someone that travels a hell of a lot normally) that a lot of people do like to kick us in.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I'm generally a bit fed up of the UK myself but I really feel (especially as someone that travels a hell of a lot normally) that a lot of people do like to kick us in.

Well that's because as a country we don't have a particularly glamorous history, with some noteworthy exceptions. I'd say more but I'll probably be called sneering or condescending by the same types who create the bad image you're unhappy about.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Priti Patel won't let me visit a country with hardly any cases but wants to send me back to school in the worst country on the continent. Makes sense.

 

[chiefdave]

What false fucking information, I said we tested more than yesterday which we did? What’s false about that?!?!?

This weeks numbers are:

Monday 67,409
Tuesday unavailable due technical issue with data collection system
Wednesday 60,744
Thursday 67,681
Friday 80,297

So a bit of an increase today but nowhere near the 100K promised every day by the first of this month let alone the 200K a day promised by the first of next month - only 9 days to go and 5 of those are weekend / bank holiday.

 

[chiefdave]

What is an acceptable death rate, in your view?

Sir Patrick Vallance said a "good outcome" would be keeping deaths below 20,000. The FT modelling, which is a cautious estimate so if anything likely to be lower than the true number, put excess deaths currently at 63,600 so I think we're way past what anyone could say was acceptable or a good outcome.

 

[chiefdave]

No, I said across the world the UK gets worse press than Sweden on this.

Compare that with Sweden, and whilst I have seen critical articles, it is nowhere near on the scale than what we have had.

I've seen plenty of criticism of Swedens stance so its definitely out there. We're always going to see more about the UK as that is what is more likely to be discussed given it directly impacts us.

The other thing is compare what is being criticised. Sweden are being questioned on their approach but not how they are relaying their message to the population or implementing their approach. Here its not just questions about the approach being taken its how badly they are putting the information across (on multiple occasions the government have been shown to be misleading the public) and how badly they are implementing it.

 

[Ian1779]

That’s why I said 0?

I’m not talking about you directly to be fair... but people are happy to talk about ‘calculated risk’ when their own calculated is zero. MP’s insisting kids should go back to school but not a single child of an MP in a private school will go back. Public transport is packed - not one of those fuckers is catching the tube into Westminster.
However fan boys of these clowns lap it up...

 

[SkyBlueDom26]

I’m not talking about you directly to be fair... but people are happy to talk about ‘calculated risk’ when their own calculated is zero. MP’s insisting kids should go back to school but not a single child of an MP in a private school will go back. Public transport is packed - not one of those fuckers is catching the tube into Westminster.
However fan boys of these clowns lap it up...

But we can’t sit in lockdown forever or until a vaccine is found? We need to find a way

 

[Ian1779]

But we can’t sit in lockdown forever or until a vaccine is found? We need to find a way

No one said we could...

Ive got an idea that seems to have caught on in other countries, it’s called test track and isolate.

For a country that supposedly needed to make its own way in the world as the EU was holding us back - we seem to have made ourselves simply look like the world clowns....

 

[SkyBlueDom26]

No one said we could...

Ive got an idea that seems to have caught on in other countries, it’s called test track and isolate.

For a country that supposedly needed to make its own way in the world as the EU was holding us back - we seem to have made ourselves simply look like the world clowns....

From June the 1st we will be able to!!!!

 

[chiefdave]

From June the 1st we will be able to!!!!

Government admits NHS app will not be ready for launch of contact tracing scheme
Not to worry, we won't have an app like everywhere else in the world. We'll get loads of people in to do it manually.
Coronavirus: contact-tracing applicants in England wrongly told hiring paused

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

I have genuinely found this weeks figures a bit depressing. I honestly expected them to be better than they have been.

I thought they might be a little bit worse as it was around now I expected the VE day celebrations to start showing in the figures. More concerned over what it will be like at the start of June as the lockdown easing starts to show.