Well yes, obviously the food should have nutritional value
You can make the same argument about any government intervention, "But what if it's bad"
Do you want to discuss boring politics? (11 Viewers)
- Thread starter mrtrench
- Start date
You can make the same argument about any government intervention, "But what if it's bad"
Nick
Administrator
Well no, "should" is common sense. Somebody has a kid, they feed it and keep it healthy.
I'm not having that people can't afford to give their kids a breakfast before school unless it's an extreme situation.
If people want to get additional childcare, then they pay for it themselves.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
But as I’ve said the reality is that many parents don’t. So what now? Moralising about their parents doesn’t help the kid and if you leave a kid to be fucked up you’ll be spending an awful lot more further down the line on police health and benefits.
We have a school schedule based on the 1800s where the woman stayed at home and the kids came back to help with harvest during the summer. Is it really so crazy to suggest this doesn’t work in a modern two income 9-5 world?
Nick
Administrator
If a kid is starving (see Daniel Pelka, eating from bins) then social services should be straight in and dealing with things properly.
If kids are old enough to know if they want to eat breakfast and their parents are refusing it, or if the kid is too young and the parents don't offer it. It's a parental issue and should be dealt with.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
How?
Have you fucking seen the caseload of your average social services worker? This is just delusional stuff I’m sorry.
Nick
Administrator
Delusional to think that social services should be dealing with kids who's parents refuse to feed them?
If Person A fires out 5 kids and refuses to feed them (even though they will be getting benefits for that reason) then where does it stop? They don't clothe them either so that's on everybody else too? If the kids aren't being looked after properly, that's when social services / police and the authorities should be involved.
How about stopping benefits of parents who refuse to feed their kids and then ordering in a proper meal service where the kids get proper meals?
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
Suspicious = non-white
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
There are people who cannot afford it though
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
Who is it then?
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
There are working people who struggle to afford to feed kids, not everybody with 5 kids is on benefits Nick. You are so unbelievably blinkered.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Delusional to think that social services should be dealing with kids who's parents refuse to feed them?
If Person A fires out 5 kids and refuses to feed them (even though they will be getting benefits for that reason) then where does it stop? They don't clothe them either so that's on everybody else too? If the kids aren't being looked after properly, that's when social services / police and the authorities should be involved.
How about stopping benefits of parents who refuse to feed their kids and then ordering in a proper meal service where the kids get proper meals?
If you know anything of the pressures on social services yes it’s delusional. Like Homer Simpson’s Garbage Man delusional. There’s just not the resources or the processes to deal with this after the fact. We can’t even get a handle on serious abuse let alone Monster for breakfast.
We all know if everyone was a perfect citizen we wouldn’t need laws and enforcement but it’s not a particularly useful thought because they’re not and never will be.
Nick
Administrator
Blinkered or just sensible? If somebody is working and has 5 kids and can't afford them then they probably should have pulled out.
Like I said, make 5 sets of overnight oats with some fruit in and job done.
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
In an ideal world this would happen but this would need a huge investment in social services which realistically isn't going to happen no matter how much it is needed.
Anyone who has had to deal with social services will tell you the idea of them suddenly taking on a huge additional caseload is a non starter. I'm supposed to have quarterly meetings with social services about my Dads care, he's into year three and I've met with them once, for a few minutes, via zoom.
We've got teachers talking about taking toasters into school and making kids toast every morning because the majority of their class is turning up hungry. Should it have been dealt with before it got to this point? Absolutely it should have but we are where we are and if the quickest / cheapest resolution is providing every school kid with breakfast then shouldn't we start from there?
Nick
Administrator
So they should probably reevaluate their situation if they can't afford to feed their kid breakfast.
If people have 5 kids and they can't afford to feed them, they shouldn't have had 5 kids.
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
thought I'd logged into mumsnet by mistake
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
Circumstances change don't they? The cost of living has gone through the roof, it's very plausible that somebody who could previously afford basics now can't. How do you not understand that?
"they should get another job then"
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Great stuff. Well just get them to suck the kids back up their fanny you fucking moron.
Nick
Administrator
Circumstances change don't they? The cost of living has gone through the roof, it's very plausible that somebody who could previously afford basics now can't. How do you not understand that?
"they should get another job then"
Thats why I said re-evaluate their situation.
Maybe it's just me that if my finances meant I struggled to feed my daughter I'd be doing everything possible within my power to sort it rather than whinging about somebody else not doing it for me.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Because you’re a good parent. Well done here’s a gold star
Now what about kids who aren’t as lucky as yours?
Nick
Administrator
I'm the moron for living within my means and would do anything it takes to give my child the basics. OK then.
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
Selling drugs?
Nick
Administrator
Because you’re a good parent. Well done here’s a gold star
Now what about kids who aren’t as lucky as yours?
I only have one, sensible you see. I didn't just start a production line without thinking about whether I can afford it or not.
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
I'm the moron for living within my means and would do anything it takes to give my child the basics. OK then.
How do you know these people are not doing everything they can?
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
I'm the moron for living within my means and would do anything it takes to give my child the basics. OK then.
No you’re the moron who goes “well you should have considered every possible life outcome before having kids”. Shit happens man. Illness. Addiction. Family breakdown.
Once a kid is born it’s born. Saying “I wouldn’t start from here” is just pointless bollocks.
Nick
Administrator
Nah, it's easier to just say "everybody else should pay to raise my kids" and spend my money on other shit.
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
What are you talking about? Nobody is saying that, there aren't people in those circumstances demanding breakfast clubs you clown. It's services recognising a problem and doing something to intervene.
Nick
Administrator
Because if they can't afford to or choose not to give their kids a breakfast (whether on benefits or working or a mixture of both) then I'd suggest they aren't.
I'd bet that it's very minimal where people literally can't after they have evaluated their financial situation and made cuts where they can.
Nick
Administrator
Giving them a sausage batch isn't going to fix that....
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Well between some random on the internet with strong opinions and decades of educational research I know which one I’m going with.
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
Well there is a boat load of research behind the benefits of nutrition
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
Children in the UK are shorter, fatter and sicker due to poor diet and poverty, report suggests
Campaigners from The Food Foundation charity called on the next government to take action to "reverse the current trajectory" and warned that failure to do so might increase pressure on the NHS.
Giving kids from families that can’t afford it a healthy nutritious breakfast, is great and a good use of cash
Giving all kids whether they need it or not, a substandard breakfast, not so good
I’ve seen what hospitals give patients recovering from illness and medical procedures to eat, so unfortunately I dont hold out much hope.
Giving all kids whether they need it or not, a substandard breakfast, not so good
I’ve seen what hospitals give patients recovering from illness and medical procedures to eat, so unfortunately I dont hold out much hope.