Do you want to discuss boring politics? (30 Viewers)

[Grendel]

If only you’d displayed the same kind of rage about the Tories pulling the UC uplift as you do about Rayner’s potty mouth.

I couldn’t care less about her but she’s a moron and any other leader would have fired her not wimped around saying “it’s not language I’d use” - in power she could say it about US i residents German chancellors anyone. She’s a cretin and isn’t fit to wash dishes in a pub let alone he deputy prime minister

You are very welcome to her

 

---

[CCFCSteve]

Starmer looks less like the right man by the day. Haven't given up on a cushy by-election to sneak in Andy Burnham as the person who I think could do what you're suggesting.

Agree about Burnham. I think the fact he’s seen as being outside the London/Westminster bubble will help him as well. would need something dramatic for it to happen before next election though

 

[Grendel]

Starmer looks less like the right man by the day. Haven't given up on a cushy by-election to sneak in Andy Burnham as the person who I think could do what you're suggesting.

It’s never going to happen as mad as hatter members and union leaders control the party. Starmer needs to stop pretending he is Blair and grow a pair and be like Kinnock and stand up to the fruitcakes

 

[Deleted member 9744]

Everyone loves a bit of left on left violence. Same reason Brexit got the publicity it did before the public gave a shit: lots of Tory infighting. And any question that can make politicians splutter and stumble is going to keep being asked.

OK let's just keep going with this rubbish and let this incompetent Government keep wrecking people's lives.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

It’s never going to happen as mad as hatter members and union leaders control the party. Starmer needs to stop pretending he is Blair and grow a pair and be like Kinnock and stand up to the fruitcakes

Kinnock also lost?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Agree about Burnham. I think the fact he’s seen as being outside the London/Westminster bubble will help him as well. would need something dramatic for it to happen before next election though

3 years is a long time in politics. To me he'd be a unifying figure for the new and traditional base of the party while attracting disgruntled Tories with generally being competent up in Manchester.

He'll also be wary of taking the poisoned chalice at the wrong time

 

[Grendel]

Kinnock also lost?

always would but laid foundations by alienating the left

 

[Ian1779]

I couldn’t care less about her but she’s a moron and any other leader would have fired her not wimped around saying “it’s not language I’d use” - in power she could say it about US i residents German chancellors anyone. She’s a cretin and isn’t fit to wash dishes in a pub let alone he deputy prime minister

You are very welcome to her

Thank you for illustrating my point.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

always would but laid foundations by alienating the left

Well I mean Starmer's alienated teachers and the unions at least, must count for something?

 

[Grendel]

Thank you for illustrating my point.

well I’m sure a lot if others will and actually Starmer would enhance his position in the country overnight if he fired her. Of course he won’t as the union cabal and the members won’t let him. That’s what they are unsuitable for office

 

[Grendel]

Well I mean Starmer's alienated teachers and the unions at least, must count for something?

The actual teachers and actual union members don’t care really and that’s the point - they aren’t going to vote Tory - Labour needs to concentrate on voters and not the moron members and tossers like mccloskey

 

[Ian1779]

The actual teachers and actual union members don’t care really and that’s the point - they aren’t going to vote Tory - Labour needs to concentrate on voters and not the moron members and tossers like mccloskey

They won’t vote Tory you’re right, but the more Starmer alienates them the more will take their vote elsewhere or stay at home.

 

[Grendel]

They won’t vote Tory you’re right, but the more Starmer alienates them the more will take their vote elsewhere or stay at home.

I hate to break it to you but teachers don’t win elections

 

[Ian1779]

I hate to break it to you but teachers don’t win elections

No they don’t - but Labour needs every voter it can get. They aren’t inspiring anyone new with their insipid ideas.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I hate to break it to you but teachers don’t win elections

They don’t but you just said he needs to alienate the left. Well he seems to be doing very well at that yet still getting nowhere.

 

[shmmeee]

We all love to slag Starmer off, but genuinely quality joke in his speech:

“My dad was a tool maker. Although, in a way so was Boris Johnson’s”

 

[David O'Day]

This speech is really good and is what the Labour Party should be about, pure aspiration for ordinary people and the hope that things can get better.

The hecklers have destroyed themselves and they just sound lame and sad now.

 

[skybluetony176]

Got to laugh at the £15.00 an hour heckles. By the next GE the labour shortage will probably ensure £15.00 isn’t high enough.

 

[Ian1779]

This speech is really good and is what the Labour Party should be about, pure aspiration for ordinary people and the hope that things can get better.

The hecklers have destroyed themselves and they just sound lame and sad now.

I agree about the hecklers… it’s not the time.

 

[shmmeee]

I agree about the hecklers… it’s not the time.

The left showing it’s political naivety again. Having a big bust up and childish chanting plays right into Starmers hands right now.

The approach the left Dems took after Bidens confirmation as candidate would’ve been much more productive: conditional support rather than outright opposition.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

The left showing it’s political naivety again. Having a big bust up and childish chanting plays right into Starmers hands right now.

The approach the left Dems took after Bidens confirmation as candidate would’ve been much more productive: conditional support rather than outright opposition.

With the end result of rolling over anyway.

 

[shmmeee]

With the end result of rolling over anyway.

But more influence. Compare what’s likely to pass under Biden with what passes under Obama.

What you call rolling over is smart negotiation. They’re getting more than they did by asking for way more then rolling back as a compromise.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

But more influence. Compare what’s likely to pass under Biden with what passes under Obama.

What you call rolling over is smart negotiation. They’re getting more than they did by asking for way more then rolling back as a compromise.

What I call rolling over is when push comes to shove going along with something you don’t really believe in. All Starmer is missing is a figure like Bernie to get the left all to fall in line and be quiet

 

[shmmeee]

What I call rolling over is when push comes to shove going along with something you don’t really believe in. All Starmer is missing is a figure like Bernie to get the left all to fall in line and be quiet

That’s politics unless you live in a dictatorship.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

What I call rolling over is when push comes to shove going along with something you don’t really believe in. All Starmer is missing is a figure like Bernie to get the left all to fall in line and be quiet

Whilst I do agree with the sentiment and I get immensely frustrated when I have to accept something that I know could be better, often the alternative is to get nothing at all. Surely it is better to take a small step in the right direction which will give you a better starting position to renegotiate later, however frustrating that is.

It's being pragmatic. Obama knew he was never going to get a universal healthcare system through so he got something that will help pave the way in future. Same as you'd never get a ban on guns at the moment so you get more stringent checks and try to limit the types of guns and where they can be carried. It's nowhere near enough but it puts you in a better position for the future to get there in the end.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Whilst I do agree with the sentiment and I get immensely frustrated when I have to accept something that I know could be better, often the alternative is to get nothing at all. Surely it is better to take a small step in the right direction which will give you a better starting position to renegotiate later, however frustrating that is.

It's being pragmatic. Obama knew he was never going to get a universal healthcare system through so he got something that will help pave the way in future. Same as you'd never get a ban on guns at the moment so you get more stringent checks and try to limit the types of guns and where they can be carried. It's nowhere near enough but it puts you in a better position for the future to get there in the end.

With respect the Obama stuff is nonsense. He had a supermajority and had just been elected. He didn’t go for universal healthcare because he didn’t really believe in it himself, same as Biden. The American people are in favour of single payer healthcare, the corrupt politicians are not. Go figure

 

[fernandopartridge]

The left showing it’s political naivety again. Having a big bust up and childish chanting plays right into Starmers hands right now.

The approach the left Dems took after Bidens confirmation as candidate would’ve been much more productive: conditional support rather than outright opposition.

Biden didn't make 10 pledges that he didn't have any intention of keeping though, did he?

 

[shmmeee]

Biden didn't make 10 pledges that he didn't have any intention of keeping though, did he?

Which pledges has he said he’ll break?

 

[fernandopartridge]

This speech is really good and is what the Labour Party should be about, pure aspiration for ordinary people and the hope that things can get better.

The hecklers have destroyed themselves and they just sound lame and sad now.

I wouldn't say that, it was pretty vague with no real aspiration to anything better than tinkering with the status quo. The same new Labour supply side stuff that has no real impact:

 

[fernandopartridge]

Which pledges has he said he’ll break?

He hasn't named any specifically but

Starmer: I’m ready to break pledges to make Labour electable

Keir Starmer has said he is willing to tear up the promises he made during the Labour leadership election if it is needed to make the party electable.

www.independent.co.uk

There is an argument that he had misleadingly presented common ownership of utilities as akin to nationalisation in his election material. Yet he broke that one the other day. I've no idea what he means by common ownership, wouldn't be surprised if he suggests everybody buy shares off Sid like Maggie did.

 

[shmmeee]

He hasn't named any specifically but

Starmer: I’m ready to break pledges to make Labour electable

Keir Starmer has said he is willing to tear up the promises he made during the Labour leadership election if it is needed to make the party electable.

www.independent.co.uk

There is an argument that he had misleadingly presented common ownership of utilities as akin to nationalisation in his election material. Yet he broke that one the other day. I've no idea what he means by common ownership, wouldn't be surprised if he suggests everybody buy shares off Sid like Maggie did.

I understand common ownership as like Corbyns energy policy: co-ops either worker or customer owned rather than state owned.

There seems to be a lot of bad faith and assumptions about what he’ll do in the future here.

For me I’m glad he’s focused on winning, it’s step one. I’m not convinced he can do that but I understand his approach. When we’ve got some actual policy to oppose from a sitting government then I’ll hold him to it, until then it’s all irrelevant really.

There’s some positions he’s taken that I’m vehemently against but the idea he’s turning Labour into the Tories isn’t a credible take IMO. If anything he’s still too socially liberal and left wing for the electorate.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I understand common ownership as like Corbyns energy policy: co-ops either worker or customer owned rather than state owned.

There seems to be a lot of bad faith and assumptions about what he’ll do in the future here.

For me I’m glad he’s focused on winning, it’s step one. I’m not convinced he can do that but I understand his approach. When we’ve got some actual policy to oppose from a sitting government then I’ll hold him to it, until then it’s all irrelevant really.

There’s some positions he’s taken that I’m vehemently against but the idea he’s turning Labour into the Tories isn’t a credible take IMO. If anything he’s still too socially liberal and left wing for the electorate.

Policies don't matter a jot for most people and focussing on that will only lead to more of the same. All about perception and personality and sadly for him he is lacking in both departments

 

[shmmeee]

Policies don't matter a jot for most people and focussing on that will only lead to more of the same. All about perception and personality and sadly for him he is lacking in both departments

Id agree about the latter. Former though he’s actually polling pretty well personally with the public.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Id agree about the latter. Former though he’s actually polling pretty well personally with the public.

Got any recent ones?

 

[shmmeee]

Got any recent ones?

Exclusive: Keir Starmer and Boris Johnson draw level on best PM rating

It is the first time in 13 years the Labour leader has not been behind in this key rating

www.standard.co.uk