Do you want to discuss boring politics? (24 Viewers)

[clint van damme]

Because these discussions tend to go around and round in circles, with well-made points (e.g. round identity politics and brexit) simply not responded to, and where they are there is the well-honed use of contradiction, responding to tone, and ad hominems, with a nice bit of condescension and passive-aggressiveness tossed into the mix.

And in the vacuum that's created, we get the juvenile posts about the working class being a bunch of racist knobs.

come on mate, you're clearly a clever guy.
You're telling me why people have had enough of Labour, I'll accept all of it, but if they've had enough of the 'elite' and the 'establishment', why do they think that someone like Duncan Smith or Rees Mogg has their interests at heart?
You can't just keep saying because people keep calling the working class racist. What do the tories offer?

 

---

[Evo1883]

There's no point.

Moving on

 

[Grendel]

nah. That's not it.
Not saying people aren't aspirational but that's not what the tories offer.

Do Labour offer working classes an aspiration to middle class private schools for their children and big holidays it is that just for the Labour politicians and union leaders? If everyone achieved this who would vote for Labour? Think about it

 

[Evo1883]

come on mate, you're clearly a clever guy.
You're telling me why people have had enough of Labour, I'll accept all of it, but if they've had enough of the 'elite' and the 'establishment', why do they think that someone like Duncan Smith or Rees Mogg has their interests at heart?
You can't just keep saying because people keep calling the working class racist. What do the tories offer?

Why do you keep voting Labour when it's membership is something like 70% middle class and it's MPs are all rich as fuck like the Tories too?

What's the massive difference here in 2021

It's hardly anti establishment itself

 

[clint van damme]

Why do you keep voting Labour when it's membership is something like 70% middle class and it's MPs are all rich as fuck like the Tories too?

to be brief, we've had austerity, which is a political ideology not an economic strategy, which has been disastrous, we've seen opportunist cunts take advantage of covid to rinse the public purse, (37 billion track and trace, come on, wake up for fucks sake), I 'm hoping for something different.
I'm personally better off under the tories but I don't think going forward my kids, or more importantly, society will be.

 

[Evo1883]

to be brief, we've had austerity, which is a political ideology not an economic strategy, which has been disastrous, we've seen opportunist cunts take advantage of covid to rinse the public purse, (37 billion track and trace, come on, wake up for fucks sake), I 'm hoping for something different.
I'm personally better off under the tories but I don't think going forward my kids, or more importantly, society will be.

I don't care either way , I question myself when I slag them off and still vote for them .

I understand totally why people don't, working class or not

 

[Grendel]

to be brief, we've had austerity, which is a political ideology not an economic strategy, which has been disastrous, we've seen opportunist cunts take advantage of covid to rinse the public purse, (37 billion track and trace, come on, wake up for fucks sake), I 'm hoping for something different.
I'm personally better off under the tories but I don't think going forward my kids, or more importantly, society will be.

If you were from a working class background worked colloidal hours to get a big house the big car the private education for your children would the Labour Party shake your hand and encourage this ambition?

 

[clint van damme]

If you were from a working class background worked colloidal hours to get a big house the big car the private education for your children would the Labour Party shake your hand and encourage this ambition?

Do you think the tories encourage working class aspiration?

Because I don't think they do.
I Spent 15 years working stupid hours, didn't get lthe big car or house or private education for the kids but I've done ok. But I think that's despite the tories not because of them.

 

[PVA]

Clint has asked about 15 times and no one can answer (or chooses not to).

 

[Evo1883]

People have answered clint , several times

Youre choosing to not listen

If people lives aren't dramatically effected by this tory government on a personal level , as people's attitudes have shifted from the collective to the individual , then all you've got left is wether People like you or not.

And People clearly don't dislike the tories as much as they dislike Labour .

It's In black and white

 

[PVA]

No they haven't.

All they've given is reasons why Labour are crap or reasons not to vote Labour, which is fine but not the question being asked.

 

[Grendel]

Do you think the tories encourage working class aspiration?

Because I don't think they do.
I Spent 15 years working stupid hours, didn't get lthe big car or house or private education for the kids but I've done ok. But I think that's despite the tories not because of them.

Er you’ve avoided the question

 

[Evo1883]

No they haven't.

All they've given is reasons why Labour are crap or reasons not to vote Labour, which is fine but not the question being asked.

This is so frustrating , this is exactly how I think labour MPs talk amongst themselves
.

"I don't get it David , they can't stand the things we say or do , why won't they vote for us , what do the tories offer "

Honestly it's mental

They don't offer you , it's as simple as that

 

[PVA]

This is so frustrating , this is exactly how I think labour MPs talk amongst themselves
.

"I don't get it David , they can't stand the things we say or do , why won't they vote for us , what do the tories offer "

Honestly it's mental

They don't offer you , it's as simple as that

Are you going to answer the question or not?

If you can't then just say, it's fine.

 

[Evo1883]

Are you going to answer the question or not?

I have what the actual fuck is wrong with you

 

[clint van damme]

Er you’ve avoided the question

Not really, I'd admire aspiration, I think, and hope, Labour do, I don't think the tories encourage it in the working class.

I think they applaud coruption like Matt Hancock and his family rinsing the public purse in a crisis.

 

[Grendel]

Are you going to answer the question or not?

Tories by a landslide - the answer you need to get used to

 

[clint van damme]

Tories by a landslide - the answer you need to get used to

That's not an answer as to why.

 

[Grendel]

Not really, I'd admire aspiration, I think, and hope, Labour do, I don't think the tories encourage it in the working class.

I think they applaud coruption like Matt Hancock and his family rinsing the public purse in a crisis.

The Blair government was mired in corruption

 

[Evo1883]

That's not an answer as to why.

Because they'd rather vote for anybody but you ... that's why

 

[PVA]

I have what the actual fuck is wrong with you

You've just repeated time and time again what you don't like about Labour.

You haven't said what's so appealing about the tories other than they're not Labour and you're no worse off than you were 12 years ago

 

[PVA]

Tories by a landslide - the answer you need to get used to

So you can't answer it either, cool.

 

[Evo1883]

You've just repeated time and time again what you don't like about Labour.

You haven't said what's so appealing about the tories other than they're not Labour and you're no worse off than you were 12 years ago

OK here's a question .

Why do Labour keep losing if the tories are so bad , and why are the working class voting for them in their droves if Labour offer them more

 

[clint van damme]

Because they'd rather vote for anybody but you ... that's why

Me? I'm not a politician. Weird answer

 

[PVA]

OK here's a question .

Why do Labour keep losing if the tories are so bad , and why are the working class voting for them in their droves if Labour offer them more

Still haven't answered the question...

 

[Evo1883]

Me? I'm not a politician. Weird answer

I was referring to you as in Labour...not you particularly clint mate ffs

 

[clint van damme]

OK here's a question .

Why do Labour keep losing if the tories are so bad , and why are the working class voting for them in their droves if Labour offer them more

You've literally just asked the question I've asked at least half-dozen times.

 

[PVA]

You've literally just asked the question I've asked at least half-dozen times.

Fucking amazing

 

[Evo1883]

Still haven't answered the question...

Answer mine so I can gauge what you think the reason is that Labour keep losing , because if they offer the working class more then why are they leaving them in their droves

You won't accept the fact people genuinely really dislike your MPs and membership ..so what is the answer

 

[Evo1883]

You've literally just asked the question I've asked at least half-dozen times.

So why do you think it is then ? If my answer isn't enough ...what do you think is the reason

 

[Grendel]

That's not an answer as to why.

Because Labour does not want people to join the middle classes as oddly it’s clue is in the title

It’s consigned to the history books

 

[Ian1779]

OK here's a question .

Why do Labour keep losing if the tories are so bad , and why are the working class voting for them in their droves if Labour offer them more

Do you think the heavy media bias in favour of the Conservatives helps to contribute to this disdain for Labour you describe?

 

[Evo1883]

Do you think the heavy media bias in favour of the Conservatives helps to contribute to this disdain for Labour you describe?

No , Labour don't need no help from the media .

Social media is available for Labour MPs to freely make complete twats of themselves on a regular basis

Social media strangely enough seems to coincide with the beginning of Labour's massive unpopularity with the working class .. coincidence?
Hasn't helped for sure

 

[Grendel]

Do you think the heavy media bias in favour of the Conservatives helps to contribute to this disdain for Labour you describe?

No not at all - oh sorry Ian it’s intelligent people like you who can sift the bias and brain dead working class zombies who are thicker and read the sun who are influenced

Vote winning argument

 

[PVA]

Answer mine so I can gauge what you think the reason is that Labour keep losing , because if they offer the working class more then why are they leaving them in their droves

You won't accept the fact people genuinely really dislike your MPs and membership ..so what is the answer

Jesus christ, just asking clint's question again

And 'my' MPs and membership? I'm not a Labour member. I've voted Labour once in my lifetime.