Grendel
Well-Known Member
Hamas are clearly a terrorist organisation funded by Iran.
Iran set a mission to wipe Israel off the map.
Im afraid when it invaded into the Israel side of the fence the response was pretty predictable
Israel - Palestinian Conflict (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter napolimp
- Start date
Hamas are clearly a terrorist organisation funded by Iran.
Iran set a mission to wipe Israel off the map.
Im afraid when it invaded into the Israel side of the fence the response was pretty predictable
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Interesting you’ll point to the US propping up Ukraine for political purposes, but not Israel.
Why is killing innocent civilians predictable?
Modern militaries, which would include Israel, are more than capable of targeting specific enemy compounds or infrastructure. I just read that Israel struck a mosque in Gaza City today.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Rightly or wrongly the people on both sides seem to dehumanise the others. I’ve seen footage of Israeli citizens saying some disgraceful stuff, and obviously we’ve seen Hamas and the like. It seems so deep seated on a cultural level that I’m not sure how you get to a point of trust between the two.
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
It won't be an issue eventually, Palestine will cease to exist, probably not in my life time but it won't be long unfortunately.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Unfortunately Gaza is the most densely populated place in the world. Not defending anyone here but it is impossible to launch a military operation in Gaza without it effecting/killing innocent civilians.
Various Israeli officials have compared the Hamas attacks to 9/11. Some of the footage is similarly chilling and clearly completely indefensible. Obviously with that comes the calls for an indiscriminate military response from Israel, backed by the west. And just like the military response to 9/11, I can’t see how that is something we should be cheerleading for, or expecting to improve the situation.
Ian1779
Well-Known Member
A ceasefire has to be first priority, but not many calls for it sadly.
Hamas is for sure a terrorist organisation whilst the Israeli government behave like terrorists.
As I mentioned on another thread, if you unequivocally condemn Russia in its role as aggressor trying to steal land that isn’t theirs, then you surely should say the same about Israel.
Hamas is for sure a terrorist organisation whilst the Israeli government behave like terrorists.
As I mentioned on another thread, if you unequivocally condemn Russia in its role as aggressor trying to steal land that isn’t theirs, then you surely should say the same about Israel.
stupot07
Well-Known Member
This seems like a fair way of describing it.
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
Calm down , have said 2 things and carried on with my day , not worked up in the slightest
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
That’s the whole state of Palestine, I’m talking specifically about Gaza.
Otis
Well-Known Member
When you look historically far more Palestinians have been killed or injuries compared to Israeli's
Infographic: The Human Cost Of The Israeli-Palestinian Conflict
This chart shows Israeli & Palestinian deaths/injuries documented by the UN in Gaza and the West Bank.www.google.com
This is a good summary
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Yes. Very sad isn't it and a real mess.
Both sides carry culpability. I have no idea why we are all so pro Israel.
There has been so much land grabbing going on for many, many decades.
The violence just breeds more violence and I don't know what the answer is, but the very pro stance in the UK and especially the US, towards Israel has always worried me.
Hamas and the stance of Israeli state government both continue to ensure the conflict perpetuates indefinitely.
Clearly Hamas are terrorists. They wish the total destruction of Israel. But it doesn't make the Israelis any better.
As always, it's the innocent that suffer the most.
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Evo1883
Well-Known Member
jimmyhillsfanclub
Well-Known Member
No argument from me that Hamas are a terrorist organisation, but I would point out they won a democratic election in 2006 (but it all turned to shit pretty much immediately after that)
Also worth pointing out that Hamas do actually recognise the state of Israel based on the borders before the 1967 war.
Shame the Israelis dont.
Also worth pointing out that Hamas do actually recognise the state of Israel based on the borders before the 1967 war.
Shame the Israelis dont.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Hamas is recognised as a terrorist organisation by the West isnt it?
rob9872
Well-Known Member
Has this always been an issue? My grandad had some 'peace keeping' medals from staying on in Palestine just after the 2nd World War. I always assumed it was to do with WW2 tbh but presumably same conflict.
Disclaimer- as I said above not well versed in this so have no opinion to share.
Disclaimer- as I said above not well versed in this so have no opinion to share.
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Evo1883
Well-Known Member
Jewish people were relocated to the region after ww2 , it's more complicated than simply that though still
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
Considering the subject matter its been a civilised debate, new territory for SBT!
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
I'm genuinley not worked up , was a bit miffed with the tag ..
This subject has been covered several times on here so maybe that's why it's more civilised
New territory is the objective word.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
When you are a specific race of people that all your neighbours want to be nuked off the planet and are not even recognised as human beings I don’t think it’s that simple. I think it’s understandable to feel somewhat threatened 24 7 in that environment
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Well your non political post was deliberately the opposite
The media bias element is beyond parody given Jeremy Bowen has frequently been criticised for his pro Palestine stance
Jeremy Bowen on Gaza: how impartial is the BBC’s Middle East Editor? | TheArticle
Jeremy Bowen’s “Letter from Gaza” in the current [...]
www.thearticle.com
I was replying to one sentence by Ian1779.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
I was also referencing your claim of media bias in your OP - it’s clear you are coming from a specific stance
Well your non political post was deliberately the opposite
The media bias element is beyond parody given Jeremy Bowen has frequently been criticised for his pro Palestine stance
Jeremy Bowen on Gaza: how impartial is the BBC’s Middle East Editor? | TheArticle
Jeremy Bowen’s “Letter from Gaza” in the current [...]
Not at all. My knowledge of the Israel - Palestinian conflict is much poorer than it should be. I approached reading about the conflict over the weekend with no bias whatsoever. My observations in the original post were just that, observations based on what I've been reading and seeing. I've read articles from a number of different outlets which would be considered to be both sides of the spectrum in UK media. I'm seeing strong outrage for death of civilians on the Israel side, and a shying away from the deaths on the Palestinian side. I'm also seeing government and public buildings lit up in Israeli flag and colours. That is literally what I'm seeing from this weekends coverage, what do you want me to say?
Have you actually read my original post? Because I lay this out pretty clearly with examples. For some reason your contribution is an article from over 2 years ago, about one guy in the media. I'm not even seeing a Palestinian angle on the news from the BBC this weekend?
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Grendel
Well-Known Member
Well the simple problem is Jews are not welcome in the Middle East. The Islamic population generally is the most racist population on earth and wants them gone.
After all the current shadow minister for crime reduction (what a title) says - why can’t all those Jews be shipped over to the US then there won’t be a problem
Why are you glossing over the fact that Israel are murdering innocent civilians? And not only that but insinuating it's warranted because Israel are "backed into a corner by the middle east"?
Nowhere have I even insinuated that actions by Hamas can be considered anything other than terrorism and a murderous rampage. Is it not OK to take issue with the murdering of innocent civilians by both Hamas and the Israeli government, or do you have to choose a side based on which civilians you think deserve to die more? And if innocent civilian don't deserve to die, do we have to light up buildings in support of one of the regimes carrying out the killings?
Do you have an official racism power rankings to hand, or is this just something you’ve decided about 1.5 billion people collectively?
Como
Well-Known Member
I always thought Napoleon said that God was on the side of the big battalions, he did not, a corruption of a Voltaire quote.
You just have to look at the geography of the area and the population sizes and realise there will become a time when Israel will cease to exist, Israel has to win every time.
One thing that has always amused me is that Gaza has a border with Egypt, yet it is Israel that has allowed workers to cross its border and supplies electricity. The Egyptians do not seem very keen to help their brothers. Make of that what you will.
I seriously doubt the Hamas leadership are at much risk, or their families, probably ensconced in Villas somewhere in the Gulf. Certainly suits the need of Iran, and from their perspective a relatively cheap and low risk operation.
You just have to look at the geography of the area and the population sizes and realise there will become a time when Israel will cease to exist, Israel has to win every time.
One thing that has always amused me is that Gaza has a border with Egypt, yet it is Israel that has allowed workers to cross its border and supplies electricity. The Egyptians do not seem very keen to help their brothers. Make of that what you will.
I seriously doubt the Hamas leadership are at much risk, or their families, probably ensconced in Villas somewhere in the Gulf. Certainly suits the need of Iran, and from their perspective a relatively cheap and low risk operation.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
The Egypt side is pretty much all desert although it does supply a small amount of electricity Israel is the main electricity and water supplier into Gaza.