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Scotland v England (1 Viewer)

  • Thread starter M&B Stand
  • Start date Jun 7, 2017
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Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 10, 2017
  • #71
SkyBlue_Bear83 said:
Lucky equaliser, southgate out
Click to expand...

The premier league means the managers job is impossible.

The same happened with cricket in the 70's and early 80's when an influx of overseas players made development impossible.

We have no quality players as the premier league can't be bothered to develop.

I can't even be bothered to watch games now and the players who are picked aren't interested
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 10, 2017
  • #72
England won that's the main thing. Another 3 points in the bag.
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 10, 2017
  • #73
Grendel said:
The premier league means the managers job is impossible.

The same happened with cricket in the 70's and early 80's when an influx of overseas players made development impossible.

We have no quality players as the premier league can't be bothered to develop.

I can't even be bothered to watch games now and the players who are picked aren't interested
Click to expand...

do you think timing played a part in what was a poor game? Playing a big game after a 2-3 week break at the end of a long season?
 

CJ_covblaze

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #74
Grendel said:
The premier league means the managers job is impossible.

The same happened with cricket in the 70's and early 80's when an influx of overseas players made development impossible.

We have no quality players as the premier league can't be bothered to develop.

I can't even be bothered to watch games now and the players who are picked aren't interested
Click to expand...

Wouldn't say we don't have any quality players. Walker, Rose, Dier, Dele, Kane and Lallana would get into most international sides (depending on their system).

I agree about the Premier League. We need a winter break introduced. There was a study done a couple of years ago which showed that if you play in a league without one you're 400 times more likely to be injured either before or during a tournament. That obviously goes for both our players and the foreigners. The only way it could be implemented efficiently though is if there is a complete shut down for 2-4 weeks. No training. No overseas trips to play games.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #75
Grendel said:
The premier league means the managers job is impossible.

The same happened with cricket in the 70's and early 80's when an influx of overseas players made development impossible.

We have no quality players as the premier league can't be bothered to develop.

I can't even be bothered to watch games now and the players who are picked aren't interested
Click to expand...

IMO it's more to do with a lack of investment at grassroots level compared to other countries.
 
M

Macca

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #76
Pure dog shit football
 
Reactions: bringbackrattles

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #77
The U20's look a very talented lot. Let's hope they can make the step up to full international.
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #78
For anyone who didn't watch the semi-final, England looked a much better team technically than the Italians, which is encouraging.
 
W

westcountry_skyblue

Guest
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #79
CJ_covblaze said:
Wouldn't say we don't have any quality players. Walker, Rose, Dier, Dele, Kane and Lallana would get into most international sides (depending on their system).

I agree about the Premier League. We need a winter break introduced. There was a study done a couple of years ago which showed that if you play in a league without one you're 400 times more likely to be injured either before or during a tournament. That obviously goes for both our players and the foreigners. The only way it could be implemented efficiently though is if there is a complete shut down for 2-4 weeks. No training. No overseas trips to play games.
Click to expand...
The top premier league teams couldn't help themselves could they though they'd be off to the far east and the USA playing friendlies,It's all about money CJ.
 

CJ_covblaze

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #80
Otis said:
For anyone who didn't watch the semi-final, England looked a much better team technically than the Italians, which is encouraging.
Click to expand...

Very encouraging. That side is very promising.
 

CJ_covblaze

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #81
westcountry_skyblue said:
The top premier league teams couldn't help themselves could they though they'd be off to the far east and the USA playing friendlies,It's all about money CJ.
Click to expand...

Just prevent them from doing it. Financial sanctions won't work. Points is an easy one. Moto GP and F1 manage it. For an allotted amount of time the factories are shut down and team staff aren't even allowed to email each other.
 
Reactions: westcountry_skyblue

bringbackrattles

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #82
Let's face facts here England just aren't a good International side. It was a poor match contested between two average teams. Yes we may have a few talented players but at International level that means little.Okay we go to Russia in the Finals but we all know it'll end in abject failure again as it always does.
As for Hart in goal he goes to pieces in an England top and you're just waiting for a clanger or two !
 
Reactions: Earlsdon_Skyblue1 and lifeskyblue
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SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #83
Otis said:
Yep. Too much fancy Dan, tappy, tappy, flicky, flicky football that consistently didn't work all evening.

Added to that there was a constant lack of creativity from the middle of the park with both Dier and Livermore in defensive roles. Sloppy passing too from the pair and a lot of losing possession.

When Dier first came into the England side I thought we had uncovered a gem, but lately he has been distinctly average and as for Livermore, I simply cannot see an international player in there anywhere.

Rashford had a poor game too.

Draw was a fair result. Scotland didn't threaten at all until those two free kicks. England had enough chances to bury the game (two good saves, clearance off the line, hit the post )

Draw the fairest result.
Click to expand...
The fact we took as you indicate - a decidedly defensive approach in midfield against a renowned free-scoring Scotland - says it all really.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
 
Reactions: Otis
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SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #84
Captain Dart said:
Not as if it is a surprise he gets easily beaten on 30yd free kicks. Wish they'd try an alternative goalie.
Click to expand...
They did...he broke a leg, but is coming back...hopefully

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SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #85
Gazolba said:
I don't think you are giving Scotland enough credit.
Every time an English player got the ball they were surrounded by three Scottish players. Scotland pressed really well.
Click to expand...
Yes, I agree that Scotland deserve credit.

I also think the Scots harrying approach has been mildly-effective against even Germany (as in Germany narrowly won) in the last year or so. But overall this puts us together with the footballing greats like Lithuania & Poland. Which, in truth, IS the right level given our tournament performances for the last 15yrs

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #86
clint van damme said:
do you think timing played a part in what was a poor game? Playing a big game after a 2-3 week break at the end of a long season?
Click to expand...
And Scotland had the edge there because..?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #87
SkyblueBazza said:
And Scotland had the edge there because..?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Because they are busy tossing cabers the same time England players are just tossing themselves off?
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #88
Sick Boy said:
IMO it's more to do with a lack of investment at grassroots level compared to other countries.
Click to expand...
Same thing G means ultimately.

The Premier League is simply about big business & making money for the top 6. The rest simply make the numbers up usually...but make for a reasonably healthy business. PL attitude to the England is simply one of tolerance. They robably couldn't give a damn whether England exists. Otherwise they might do more to accommodate the national side having more training sessions together amongst other things. The tail is wagging the dog!

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
 
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SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #89
Otis said:
For anyone who didn't watch the semi-final, England looked a much better team technically than the Italians, which is encouraging.
Click to expand...
Until we play the Italians

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #90
SkyblueBazza said:
And Scotland had the edge there because..?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I was referring to the overall quality of the game.
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #91
CJ_covblaze said:
Wouldn't say we don't have any quality players. Walker, Rose, Dier, Dele, Kane and Lallana would get into most international sides (depending on their system).
Click to expand...
We have quality players and have had going back a number of years but they never seem to be able to produce when it counts. How often have we breezed through qualification and then done nothing in the tournament itself while teams with weaker squads progress.

For me grassroots is a huge problem. The lack of pitches and coaches. The other problem is we consistently have teams who perform at the various youth levels then the players get scooped up by PL teams and the progression ends. Dion was on the TV the other day talking about how his move from Cambridge to Man Utd was a big deal as at the time players didn't jump divisions like that, you'd up a division at a time getting games and proving yourself. These days the slightest bit of promise and you're signed up before you've even played a full season, in some cases before you've even played a game.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #92
Jake Livermore shouldn't be nowhere near an England squad let alone the starting eleven
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #93
Otis said:
The U20's look a very talented lot. Let's hope they can make the step up to full international.
Click to expand...
Most of them will struggle to make the transition to first team. Look at solanke, one of the star men for England and already been binned off by Chelsea
 

CJ_covblaze

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #94
SkyblueBazza said:
Until we play the Italians

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

They're not that good. Not much better than us if at all. Both teams are some way behind the likes of Germany, Belgium and France.

chiefdave said:
We have quality players and have had going back a number of years but they never seem to be able to produce when it counts. How often have we breezed through qualification and then done nothing in the tournament itself while teams with weaker squads progress.

For me grassroots is a huge problem. The lack of pitches and coaches. The other problem is we consistently have teams who perform at the various youth levels then the players get scooped up by PL teams and the progression ends. Dion was on the TV the other day talking about how his move from Cambridge to Man Utd was a big deal as at the time players didn't jump divisions like that, you'd up a division at a time getting games and proving yourself. These days the slightest bit of promise and you're signed up before you've even played a full season, in some cases before you've even played a game.
Click to expand...

Bang on the money.

SkyBlue_Bear83 said:
Jake Livermore shouldn't be nowhere near an England squad let alone the starting eleven
Click to expand...

Christ knows why he started. The Ox should've. It's where he's played all season. Tbf he certainly did well when he came on further forward though!
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #95
SkyBlue_Bear83 said:
Most of them will struggle to make the transition to first team. Look at solanke, one of the star men for England and already been binned off by Chelsea
Click to expand...
Binned off by Chelsea, yet picked up by Liverpool.

Hardly a step down at all really and it may well be simply because he will get more of a chance of first team football at Liverpool.
 
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SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #96
clint van damme said:
I was referring to the overall quality of the game.
Click to expand...
Ah right - thought you were making excuses for us not beating them like we should - quite comfortably if we have any realistic ambitions

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S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #97
Otis said:
Binned off by Chelsea, yet picked up by Liverpool.

Hardly a step down at all really and it may well be simply because he will get more of a chance of first team football at Liverpool.
Click to expand...
I disagree Otis...only 3 places...but 17pts is big step down in terms of level

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Covstu

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #98
SkyblueBazza said:
I disagree Otis...only 3 places...but 17pts is big step down in terms of level

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Not when it comes to first team experience. This lad will grow twice as much at Liverpool
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 11, 2017
  • #99
Covstu said:
Not when it comes to first team experience. This lad will grow twice as much at Liverpool
Click to expand...
Yep fair point...he gets to play with & against better quality than in Chelsea reserves

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2017
  • #100
Otis said:
Binned off by Chelsea, yet picked up by Liverpool.

Hardly a step down at all really and it may well be simply because he will get more of a chance of first team football at Liverpool.
Click to expand...
Chelsea are consistently in the champions league and challenging for the big titles domestic and Europe. Liverpool are not, it looks a pretty big step down.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2017
  • #101
SkyblueBazza said:
Yep fair point...he gets to play with & against better quality than in Chelsea reserves

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
But it would be even better if he was given that chance at Chelsea rather than Liverpool.

He was player of the tournament and not wanted by any of England's most successful clubs over the last 15 years. Thats the issue here
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2017
  • #102
SkyBlue_Bear83 said:
Chelsea are consistently in the champions league and challenging for the big titles domestic and Europe. Liverpool are not, it looks a pretty big step down.
Click to expand...
Disagree. Wouldn't say it was a 'big step' down. And absolutely no point being where he is hardly going to get a look in. Just how many young homegrown players get to play in th Chelsea first team?

Liverpool are much more adept at giving young players a chance.

I don't think it is being perceived by the media as a big step down. Just a move to where he will get a better chance.
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2017
  • #103
And also, aren't we going off on a bit of a tangent? English players are much more likely to play for England at Liverpool than they are at Chelsea. Chelsea notoriously constantly go foreign in their recruitment.

If we are talking about young English players coming through and playing for their country then I don't think we can ask for much more than them playing at the top end of the Premier League and Liverpool are indeed in the Champions League this coming season anyway.
 

Covstu

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2017
  • #104
Otis said:
And also, aren't we going off on a bit of a tangent? English players are much more likely to play for England at Liverpool than they are at Chelsea. Chelsea notoriously constantly go foreign in their recruitment.

If we are talking about young English players coming through and playing for their country then I don't think we can ask for much more than them playing at the top end of the Premier League and Liverpool are indeed in the Champions League this coming season anyway.
Click to expand...
Agree but I think its an element of Chelsea wanting the readymade finished article whereas Liverpool would be more patient with someone with raw talent. If that was English or foreign I don't think it matters to them. The only way Chelsea will change is to change the rules on foreign intakes (maybe Brexit will help!!).
The gulf isn't that big in my opinion, they have CL football equally and both play at the top of the premier league. He wont win as much as if he was at Chelsea but he will play 3 or 4 times as much. I can see Sturridge depart at some stage however.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2017
  • #105
Well that is exactly the point I'm making, its a direct criticism of Chelsea's policy and others alike. What chance do we have of producing the best senior players when our very best youth players can't play in our best teams.
 
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