The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (70 Viewers)

[martcov]

Do ya honestly rekon remain would win? Not a chance

Yes, I do, but I was accepting your point that leave would convincingly win for argument’s sake and saying let’s go for it. You can’t lose.

 

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[SkyBlueDom26]

Yes, I do, but I was accepting your point that leave would convincingly win for argument’s sake and saying let’s go for it. You can’t lose.

There won't be another ref though, if corbyn gets behind a peoples vote he will lose all the leaver voters from his party

 

[Grendel]

Because I’m speaking factually?

No you are talking rubbish which is acknowledged by sensible remain voters now on here

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Do ya honestly rekon remain would win? Not a chance

It's certainly far from a foregone conclusion but it'd have every chance of doing so.

Last referendum was very close and the consensus is that leave voters came out in force while many who preferred remain didn't due to apathy and overconfidence as they felt it highly likely that remain would win. So now they know whats at stake a great many more would turn out (although the youth vote you never know) Plus if Remain actually didn't make such a ham fisted effort of their campaign a second time round (no guarantee of that) and actually showed what would be lost

Also, if you make it absolutely clear what you're voting for (ie no deal) there are a significant number of leavers who actually wanted to keep certain parts and were under the impression in the first referendum we could pick and choose. This time they'll have to decide whether the bits they want to lose are more important than the bits they want keep and are willing to put up with that pain and inconvenience. I reckon there's a fair few with business interests who would decide it wasn't.

Some would possibly change from Remain to Leave because they felt like after the referendum it should be adhered to but a second referendum would IMO be much closer than the first.

 

[Grendel]

No one wins though on a second referendum - it’s another cluster fuck which will end up a minority result one way or another so again it will not be accepted and we just start all over again.

 

[SkyBlueDom26]

No one wins though on a second referendum - it’s another cluster fuck which will end up a minority result one way or another so again it will not be accepted and we just start all over again.

Exactly, there has been 1 referendum which leave won. There won't be another one

 

[Grendel]

The other factor anyway is Farage.

It does not matter what anyone thinks of Farage he is easily the most skilled at mobilising support from the elements of society that have been let down in society. Him against Charisma Cable, U Turn Corbyn and Boarding School Lucas is no contest

Bring Johnson in clowning around and it’s a knock out contest

Then what? Crash and burn

 

[SkyBlueDom26]

The other factor anyway is Farage.

It does not matter what anyone thinks of Farage he is easily the most skilled at mobilising support from the elements of society that have been let down in society. Him against Charisma Cable, U Turn Corbyn and Boarding School Lucas is no contest

Bring Johnson in clowning around and it’s a knock out contest

Then what? Crash and burn

Why isn't farage still your avatar?

 

[Grendel]

Why isn't farage still your avatar?

One day only

 

[SkyBlueDom26]

One day only

He'd be Disappointed with that

 

[martcov]

No you are talking rubbish which is acknowledged by sensible remain voters now on here

What was wrong then?

 

[martcov]

Businesses are more prepared to accept this than you’d believe. They may not want it but the general view is a resolution will be had

The negotiating strategy all along was totally wrong. The strategy should have been to prepare for leave first on the worst terms and not even speak to the Eu until then. Instead May is like some sales manager whose got some dealer support to offer her dealers. She’s told the maximum is 5 grand but get as low as you can

Every dealer May stumbles into she drops her trousers and hands the 5 grand over

The Eu knew under her they’d be safe, now not so. The tactics on both sides will change very quickly

London is under threat of losing influence as a financial centre:

Brexit fallout sees New York overtake London as world’s leading financial centre

 

[Grendel]

What was wrong then?

The simple fact that intelligent posters acknowledge we have to leave and it’s the type of leave that needs to be decided

Another referendum just continues a civil war

 

[Grendel]

London is under threat of losing influence as a financial centre:

Brexit fallout sees New York overtake London as world’s leading financial centre

Again irrelevant and shows how embarrassingly out of touch you now are on here

 

[martcov]

The simple fact that intelligent posters acknowledge we have to leave and it’s the type of leave that needs to be decided

Another referendum just continues a civil war

Some may do, but others see leave, especially no deal leave, as a disaster to be avoided at all costs.

Here is an example of the, possible, effect of labour going full out remain based on polls:
FactCheck: would Labour win an election if it backed remain?

 

[martcov]

Again irrelevant and shows how embarrassingly out of touch you now are on here

It is not irrelevant and has been warned about from the word go.

 

[martcov]

The simple fact that intelligent posters acknowledge we have to leave and it’s the type of leave that needs to be decided

Another referendum just continues a civil war

Whereas crashing the country to carry out a misguided and flawed referendum will put the matter to rest?

 

[Grendel]

Whereas crashing the country to carry out a misguided and flawed referendum will put the matter to rest?

No that’s why I’ve said the public needs to decide how to leave in a dignified and as mutually exclusive manner as possible

 

[martcov]

No that’s why I’ve said the public needs to decide how to leave in a dignified and as mutually exclusive manner as possible

Or to remain if the people see that as a better alternative to what is on the table as leaving. If, as you claim, intelligent remainers see the necessity of leaving, leavers see the necessity of leaving and all negative points are irrelevant anyway, then it will be a walk over and any remain vote will be a futile protest vote. Great. Your points will have been proved and the country can move on. Why are you worried about people voting on any deal v remain? You can’t lose according to yourself.

 

[ccfc92]

The simple fact that intelligent posters acknowledge we have to leave and it’s the type of leave that needs to be decided

Another referendum just continues a civil war

Fuck me, imagine a civil war in todays Britain. You'd have gender fluid hipsters holding up signs while some little hood rat shanks them and everybody else focusing on selfies rather than actually going toe to toe with someone.

 

[martcov]

Fuck me, imagine a civil war in todays Britain. You'd have gender fluid hipsters holding up signs while some little hood rat shanks them and everybody else focusing on selfies rather than actually going toe to toe with someone.

No. The weapons of choice are stocked by Burger King, 5 guys and MacDonalds. Readily available. At the War of the Roses the choice of side was shown by a red rose or a white rose. Remain supporting lefties have gone for pink or light coloured milk shakes. The right wing ers have yet to decide a suitable retaliatory colour milkshake.

 

[Grendel]

Or to remain if the people see that as a better alternative to what is on the table as leaving. If, as you claim, intelligent remainers see the necessity of leaving, leavers see the necessity of leaving and all negative points are irrelevant anyway, then it will be a walk over and any remain vote will be a futile protest vote. Great. Your points will have been proved and the country can move on. Why are you worried about people voting on any deal v remain? You can’t lose according to yourself.

Again the point sales over your head

 

[ccfc92]

No. The weapons of choice are stocked by Burger King, 5 guys and MacDonalds. Readily available. At the War of the Roses the choice of side was shown by a red rose or a white rose. Remain supporting lefties have gone for pink or light coloured milk shakes. The right wing ers have yet to decide a suitable retaliatory colour milkshake.

Surely the remain lefties should not discriminate against the colour of milkshakes, unlike the racist leavers?

 

[martcov]

Surely the remain lefties should not discriminate against the colour of milkshakes, unlike the racist leavers?

The light coloured milkshakes have a connection to white racists, which is why UKIP gets targeted. So I think the right wing racists should throw brown milkshakes at snowflakes because of the snowflakes encouraging Islamists, or maybe red because of their commie hippy Guardian remainer views. ( joking of course)

 

[ccfc92]

The light coloured milkshakes have a connection to white racists, which is why UKIP gets targeted. So I think the right wing racists should throw brown milkshakes at snowflakes because of the snowflakes encouraging Islamists, or maybe red because of their commie hippy Guardian remainer views. ( joking of course)

That makes sense to be fair :joyful:

 

[Astute]

We can leave, just not with no deal which was never what was suggested by the leave campaigns.


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I don't seem to remember it being said we would leave with a deal either.

 

[djr8369]

I don't seem to remember it being said we would leave with a deal either.

Strange as the leave campaigners repeatedly stressed what a good deal we would get.


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[skybluetony176]

I don't seem to remember it being said we would leave with a deal either.

You really wasn’t paying attention then. The EU will bend over backwards to do a deal with us, cheese blah blah blah, wine blah blah blah, German cars blah blah blah, easiest deal in history said Liam Fox etc etc etc.

 

[Sick Boy]

No one wins though on a second referendum - it’s another cluster fuck which will end up a minority result one way or another so again it will not be accepted and we just start all over again.

Depressingly, you’re probably correct. This is why a compromise has to be found and the EEA would be a fair outcome between the two.

The UK would lose its voice and influence within Europe but the country is bitterly divided and that isn’t going to go away anytime soon.

 

[Sick Boy]

I don't seem to remember it being said we would leave with a deal either.

At one point they were claiming that the UK could enjoy the exact same benefits of the Single Market without being in it. Some were even saying that leaving it didn’t have to mean leaving the SM.

 

[Sick Boy]

Fuck me, imagine a civil war in todays Britain. You'd have gender fluid hipsters holding up signs while some little hood rat shanks them and everybody else focusing on selfies rather than actually going toe to toe with someone.

It sounds like a shit version of Black Mirror.

 

[djr8369]

At one point they were claiming that the UK could enjoy the exact same benefits of the Single Market without being in it. Some were even saying that leaving it didn’t have to mean leaving the SM.

“Nobody is talking about leaving the single market”




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[skybluetony176]

“Nobody is talking about leaving the single market”




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Which in a matter of weeks turned into we know what we voted for.

 

[Sick Boy]

“Nobody is talking about leaving the single market”




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Missing this

 

[martcov]

At one point they were claiming that the UK could enjoy the exact same benefits of the Single Market without being in it. Some were even saying that leaving it didn’t have to mean leaving the SM.

Boris Johnson said he would vote to remain in the CU and SM before the referendum.