The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (17 Viewers)

[skybluetony176]

Not to the Eu which was always her real government.

OK, let’s pretend you’re right for a second. If that’s the case then why did ALL the brexit candidates step aside allowing her to become PM basically unchallenged?

 

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[skyblueinBaku]

And here tou go again making up a story as in what I am supposed to have said.

So where did I even mention the USA or Trump? But whilst on the subject the USA is our biggest export above any country in the EU. And I am still sure that a deal would be agreed with the EU before the first two years are up. Yes they hold all the cards because of the ineptitude of those previously involved. But we are too much of a big market to totally ignore. But a deal might not be done for ages after. Anyone who says they know what will happen is lying.

We will be using Skype. Waiting until we see if we leave at the end of October or not before deciding what to do with phones.

My wife spends a lot of time talking to relatives abroad. She says that there are often problems with Skype and prefers What'sApp or evem Facebook.

 

[skybluetony176]

The astonishing revelation a leave without s deal option was never even mentioned let alone be the primary negotiating stance of the UK at the very beginning shows May was just a dribbling euriphile working with the Eu to create a leave but no leave option

David Davis was in charge of negotiations in the very beginning. Presumably another dribbling europhile?

 

[Grendel]

OK, let’s pretend you’re right for a second. If that’s the case then why did ALL the brexit candidates step aside allowing her to become PM basically unchallenged?

Because they knew they’d not get through to the final 2 - Johnson has avoided the fate of many Tory candidates and avoided the inevitable stain of defeat and has played the game very well

 

[Grendel]

David Davis was in charge of negotiations in the very beginning. Presumably another dribbling europhile?

Davis wasn’t in charge of anything. Civil servants were in charge and towing the line

 

[skybluetony176]

Because they knew they’d not get through to the final 2 - Johnson has avoided the fate of many Tory candidates and avoided the inevitable stain of defeat and has played the game very well

But they had the “will of the people” on their side. Your reply makes no sense in either reality or in the context of your original comment.

What’s the fate of many Tory candidates? A dose of reality?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Because they knew they’d not get through to the final 2 - Johnson has avoided the fate of many Tory candidates and avoided the inevitable stain of defeat and has played the game very well

What so he waited for it to get so bad he could jump in as PM? People like you are his wet dream

 

[Grendel]

But they had the “will of the people” on their side. Your reply makes no sense in either reality or in the context of your original comment.

What’s the fate of many Tory candidates? A dose of reality?

No it’s the fate of Willie Whitehall which Johnson observed well

 

[skybluetony176]

Davis wasn’t in charge of anything. Civil servants were in charge and towing the line

So why did he accept the appointment? Raab too for that matter? Are you suggesting that May hoodwinked brexit backing MP’s, cabinet members and party members into not realising that she’s a “dribbling europhile”?

 

[Grendel]

What so he waited for it to get so bad he could jump in as PM? People like you are his wet dream

People like you are Jeremy Corbyn wet dream and it’s why once again labour will spend many more years in a political wilderness and wonder why

 

[Grendel]

So why did he accept the appointment? Raab too for that matter? Are you suggesting that May hoodwinked brexit backing MP’s, cabinet members and party members into not realising that she’s a “dribbling europhile”?

Well on that basis why would the leader of the Lib undems vote with the Tory whip more than Michael Gove?

 

[skybluetony176]

No it’s the fate of Willie Whitehall which Johnson observed well

You seemed to have failed to observe that in the last Tory leadership contest it’s Tory party members who elect their leader not “Willie Whitehall” and the victor by some margin was the face of the brexit campaign. If they’d have stayed the course there’s no way based on actual events not supposition that May would have won. So the original question is still unanswered. Why did they all step aside and let a “dribbling europhile” take control of their victory?

 

[skybluetony176]

Well on that basis why would the leader of the Lib undems vote with the Tory whip more than Michael Gove?

I note you’re dodging the question. Any chance you’ll answer it?

 

[Sick Boy]

No it worked with a pro Eu government to fudge a Hotel California deal

Yeah there were no Brexiteers leading negotiations. May’s hard nosed anti EU rhetoric was then rejected by the electorate with her snap election (the one where Labour were going to get crushed for a generation).

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

People like you are Jeremy Corbyn wet dream and it’s why once again labour will spend many more years in a political wilderness and wonder why

Not an argument-social democratic policies are considerably more popular than small c conservative ones. It's about the policies not the individual

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I note you’re dodging the question. Any chance you’ll answer it?

Don't be silly he still can't admit his mistake from 2017

 

[skybluetony176]

Yeah there were no Brexiteers leading negotiations. May’s hard nosed anti EU rhetoric was then rejected by the electorate with her snap election (the one where Labour were going to get crushed for a generation).

May drew the Red Lines and the brexit camp cheered her like a hero . Now she’s just another name on the list of people, organisations, countries etc to blame. I’m waiting for the day when the majority of leavers accept responsibility for their campaign and vote and stop blaming everything from those that didn’t vote for this shit storm, the failure of the lack of magic by positive thinking and basically anyone who isn’t responsible for sorting this out.

 

[Grendel]

You seemed to have failed to observe that in the last Tory leadership contest it’s Tory party members who elect their leader not “Willie Whitehall” and the victor by some margin was the face of the brexit campaign. If they’d have stayed the course there’s no way based on actual events not supposition that May would have won. So the original question is still unanswered. Why did they all step aside and let a “dribbling europhile” take control of their victory?

Oh the answer is very obvious and it’s staring you in the face

 

[Astute]

Before the first 2 years of what are up?

So have you suddenly forgotten that Barnier said hardly anything will change for two years if we left without a deal to protect those who trade with us in the EU? Or is it just best to forget?

 

[Astute]

That’s assuming there’s a transition period and we don’t follow either of the plans from leavers to go straight onto WTO tariffs or blanket zero tariffs.


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So Barnier is a liar?

 

[Astute]

He’s not saying you did he’s using it as an example of a country looking for a trade deal and how that might play out.




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Try reading again and not defending someone as bad as yourself at trying to make everything sound as bad as you can.

 

[Astute]

My wife spends a lot of time talking to relatives abroad. She says that there are often problems with Skype and prefers What'sApp or evem Facebook.

Sorry meant WhatsApp. Busy at work.

 

[skybluetony176]

Oh the answer is very obvious and it’s staring you in the face

I know the answer. I’m just curious if you’ll admit it. Which as yet you haven’t.

 

[Astute]

Yeah there were no Brexiteers leading negotiations. May’s hard nosed anti EU rhetoric was then rejected by the electorate with her snap election (the one where Labour were going to get crushed for a generation).

May agreed a way out of the EU that kept us in the EU. I didn't want it. You didn't want it. Hardly anyone wanted it. She couldn't push it through parliament. No side wanted it.

So what was good about what May and the EU came up with?

 

[Astute]

You seemed to have failed to observe that in the last Tory leadership contest it’s Tory party members who elect their leader not “Willie Whitehall” and the victor by some margin was the face of the brexit campaign. If they’d have stayed the course there’s no way based on actual events not supposition that May would have won. So the original question is still unanswered. Why did they all step aside and let a “dribbling europhile” take control of their victory?

Because they couldn't get enough votes. But you know this.

 

[skybluetony176]

Because they couldn't get enough votes. But you know this.

How could they not get enough votes? It’s an elimination contest. Enough votes is second place getting 1 more vote than third place in the final round of votes amongst elected Tory MP’s and then the final 2 go to the party members. The actual reality as the last leadership contest shows is that a leaver standing against a remainer would have won comfortably. There isn’t an ounce of fact in your reply. I know that. IIRC Ledsom was also ahead in the Tory membership polls.

 

[Sick Boy]

So have you suddenly forgotten that Barnier said hardly anything will change for two years if we left without a deal to protect those who trade with us in the EU? Or is it just best to forget?

Of course it would change, you’d be naive at best if you think it wouldn’t do.

 

[Sick Boy]

May agreed a way out of the EU that kept us in the EU. I didn't want it. You didn't want it. Hardly anyone wanted it. She couldn't push it through parliament. No side wanted it.

So what was good about what May and the EU came up with?

It wasn’t staying in the EU, the Customs Union is not the EU.

 

[Sick Boy]

Try reading again and not defending someone as bad as yourself at trying to make everything sound as bad as you can.

What are you on about? What he said is correct, I wasn’t saying you were. Stop playing the victim.

 

[djr8369]

Try reading again and not defending someone as bad as yourself at trying to make everything sound as bad as you can.

Ok whatever. You keep making arguments out of nothing while telling everyone you’re the only one who can see both sides.

Try being less combative and you might actually be able to have a conversation with someone.


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[djr8369]

So Barnier is a liar?

No he’s talking about a transition period. Many of the plans being mooted wouldn’t have a transition period.


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[shmmeee]

May agreed a way out of the EU that kept us in the EU. I didn't want it. You didn't want it. Hardly anyone wanted it. She couldn't push it through parliament. No side wanted it.

So what was good about what May and the EU came up with?

What would be better?

It was the shiniest turd. Customs Union or SM would be better but you’d froth even more about “still in the EU”.

If that’s not good enough for Brexiters then they’ve admitted Brexit is a bust and we should revoke. There’s no magical deal that’s better.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Would you like to explain why those countries allowed to make trade deals with us won't want to?

It is just like those so called cliff edge doomsday sayers. The EU said nothing would change for at least 2 years after us leaving. They say it is to protect their remaining members. Are you going to tell me that there is no chance of sorting out a trade deal in this time?

Or would you like to explain how they don't want everything to change the day we leave to protect their remaining members but they will want it ti change afterwards?

These questions are always ignored by certain people on here. It doesn't go with what they preach. It is like when you said to me that whole regions around the EU won't be badly affected. They would be if your predictions are correct. But you only push one side across constantly.

The whole debacle is shit. It has split my family up from myself. Now all phone companies have changed their terms and conditions on their 'fair usage policies'. I have been waiting for someone to blame it on Brexit. But it is greed. After Brexit it will get worse. Ex pats have used 02 for years. Now they are left with worthless contracts. I am with EE and have been for over 20 years. In another 2 weeks they will charge 70p a minute to accept a call and £2.70 a minute to make a call if you spend 2 months out of 4 out of the country. You get it back if you spend 2 months back in the UK. And this is before Brexit. But I guarantee you that it will be blamed on Brexit.

The withdrawal agreement was why nothing would change. Jesus wept

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[Astute]

It wasn’t staying in the EU, the Customs Union is not the EU.

Not being able to leave the EU until the EU says we can leave is leaving the EU?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Oh the answer is very obvious and it’s staring you in the face

A few possibilities

1) They knew a good Brexit deal couldn't be struck

2) They wanted May to balls up and say 'I told you so'

3) They knew both 1) and 2) and wanted a route into power when it went balls up

Doesn't make your crushes look too good in any case