chiefdave
Well-Known Member
No it isn't.
No it isn't.I agree but it can’t involve Ni being different to Britain. It is part of Great Britain for goodness sake.
It's not part of Great Britain, it's part of the United Kingdom
In that case then, we will end up with a hard border.
Watching the news. What a mess.
So anyway. Where does this leave brexit? The EU are united behind Dublin and won’t accept a hard border between the North and South of Ireland and the DUP won’t accept a border between Northern Ireland and the rest of the U.K. meaning that it won’t get voted through parliament as the Tories don’t have a majority without the DUP.
Sorry I did mean UK. You knew what I meant I’m sure as all the know it alls came out and corrected me in typical fury and anger as normal. Genuine apologies again.
I don’t think it doesn’t have to end in a hard border. I don’t think it will. The Uk government has said it won’t implement a hard border itself. If one is erected it would be the Irish government to do it but they said they don’t want one either.
The point being there is no appetite from ether side for it.
Technically no but in practice yes it would. The Tories would have a minority government so would struggle to pass anything in parliament. They would really have no other choice than to call an election unless they can find someone else to go in with them.If the DUP pull out of their arraignment with the government does that mean a general election?
So now we’re know it alls for pointing out your crass mistakes. You are the one who told us the Northern Irish are all proud Brits. Let’s see what happens. You are the one who said everyone knew what they were voting for. Obviously not. You were the one who said people voted for control of our borders. How? No one wants a border. Apart from your minority proud Brit unionist party. How do you know whether the Irish will erect it? If anyone erects it on the ROI side, it will be an external EU border. Maybe the EU erect it. Or, maybe the Brexit Brits will have to erect it to stop smuggling including people smuggling if the EU refuse to erect one.
The Irish border situation is something I didn't even think about and have no idea how to solve it, it'll cause problems whatever way they try to resolve it.
I would be interested to hear possible solutions though.
I would be interested to hear possible solutions though.
Dump brexit? It was only an advisory referendum after all
We’ve give it our best go and it didn’t really work out. It’s become a girlfriend who was appealing while you were getting to know her but now you’ve got to know her you’ve realised she’s a psychopath
Lib Dems in exchange for another referendum...?Technically no but in practice yes it would. The Tories would have a minority government so would struggle to pass anything in parliament. They would really have no other choice than to call an election unless they can find someone else to go in with them.
Fair enough Tony, thanks for the explanation and apologies for the wind up!Foster is an English name. Oh that’s not her maiden name you might say. You’re right, her maiden name is Kelly. Wholly Irish and predominantly Catholic which can only really lead you to one conclusion. Her family converted to the Protestant faith and most likely during the potato famine to receive the kings shilling as it was known. She’s as Irish as they come, Scotland has nothing to do with her unless her family left Ireland to return at some point later. In which case she’s still as Irish as they come, Northern Irish but still from the Ireland. What you’ve done is the equivalent of telling someone of Indian heritage and their ilk to move back to Pakistan. It’s ignorance of the highest level.
You then bring hard brexit into it as if you somehow understand where she is coming from. You don’t. She needs a hard brexit. The face of Northern Ireland is changing, the Catholic faith has caught up the Protestant faith in terms of numbers and set to pass and now you have the scenario where a large portion of the Protestant faith especially in the border counties like Fermanagh where she is from rely on the south for trade and work would rather see a united Ireland than lose their livelihood which is what a hard brexit with a border in Ireland could do. She won’t accept a border with the rest of the U.K. because she knows ultimately where that is going, so she’s fighting to remain British. Regardless of the costs. She knows the feeling on the ground, she’s not stupid. Especially the feeling in her own constituency and she’s fighting to save her identity.
It isn't just the Tories that are scared of Corbyn becoming PM.There is just no way that I can see this is going to work, especially now parliament has the final say on any Brexit deal.
1. NI is given special treatment as was mooted today - DUP votes it down.
2. We refuse Ireland's demands and a hard border comes into effect and we revert to WTO tariffs - The Conservative centrists vote it down.
3. We retain access to the single market, customs union and freedom of movement - The Conservative right votes it down
The problem is made worse given that we're on a limited time frame. I personally don't see how we get anywhere without another election but the Conservatives will never call one because they're scared to death of Corbyn becoming PM
Everyone should be behind not wanting a hard border in Ireland.So anyway. Where does this leave brexit? The EU are united behind Dublin and won’t accept a hard border between the North and South of Ireland and the DUP won’t accept a border between Northern Ireland and the rest of the U.K. meaning that it won’t get voted through parliament as the Tories don’t have a majority without the DUP.
Yes it would be a minority government. But only just. For a vote to be lost for the Tories it would mean everyone from all parties to vote against them. Everyone would also have to turn up. Then you have the rebels that don't vote the way that they are told to.Technically no but in practice yes it would. The Tories would have a minority government so would struggle to pass anything in parliament. They would really have no other choice than to call an election unless they can find someone else to go in with them.
Yes it would be a minority government. But only just. For a vote to be lost for the Tories it would mean everyone from all parties to vote against them. Everyone would also have to turn up. Then you have the rebels that don't vote the way that they are told to.
I don't see it as a big enough problem to cause another general election just yet. But it depends on what the Tories want to push through. This makes me a bit happier on having a Tory government.
Yes simple, the Republic of Ireland can leave the EU superstate any time it likes.
The Irish border situation is something I didn't even think about and have no idea how to solve it, it'll cause problems whatever way they try to resolve it.
I would be interested to hear possible solutions though.
Sorry I did mean UK. You knew what I meant I’m sure as all the know it alls came out and corrected me in typical fury and anger as normal. Genuine apologies again.
I don’t think it doesn’t have to end in a hard border. I don’t think it will. The Uk government has said it won’t implement a hard border itself. If one is erected it would be the Irish government to do it but they said they don’t want one either.
The point being there is no appetite from ether side for it.
Everyone should be behind not wanting a hard border in Ireland.
But this is where the difficulties start.
Is there going to be a trade deal? If there is then there is not a certain need for a hard border anywhere. If there is no trade deal then some sort of hard border will be needed even if just for transportation of goods. This is why I have always said that a trade deal should be decided on before the problem of what to do with Ireland is decided.
There is just no way that I can see this is going to work, especially now parliament has the final say on any Brexit deal.
1. NI is given special treatment as was mooted today - DUP votes it down.
2. We refuse Ireland's demands and a hard border comes into effect and we revert to WTO tariffs - The Conservative centrists vote it down.
3. We retain access to the single market, customs union and freedom of movement - The Conservative right votes it down
The problem is made worse given that we're on a limited time frame. I personally don't see how we get anywhere without another election but the Conservatives will never call one because they're scared to death of Corbyn becoming PM
Yes that’s about the size of it. It’s a stalemate at the moment.
Your second paragraph shows why I'm so disparaging of the DUP. They will never get beyond their sectarian beliefs.
Something May should have realised when she got into bed with them. Clearly she didn’t. Hence the mess we’re in.
Everyone should be behind not wanting a hard border in Ireland.
But this is where the difficulties start.
Is there going to be a trade deal? If there is then there is not a certain need for a hard border anywhere. If there is no trade deal then some sort of hard border will be needed even if just for transportation of goods. This is why I have always said that a trade deal should be decided on before the problem of what to do with Ireland is decided.
I made a rushed error, the way you act it was if I voted for brexit!
Hang on, you’re the same poster who is in denial about German politics and merkels situation at the moment. You deny the rise of far right and far left groups across the EU. You told every leave voter to be ashamed of themselves in what was a free democratic choice and vote. (My personal favourite) You demonstrated a clear ignorance to the bond markets earlier this thread. You can’t admit Sweden is in a really bad place because of their violent crime rate rise. The nhs and housing market and suppressed wages has nothing to do mass immigration. Oh and Greece was fucked anyway was a classic line from you.
As for the border in Ireland, there is no appetite for a hard border from anyone. It requires a special solution to a very complex country and situation. Again you seem to be wanting a hard border? I know you don’t but stop banging on about it then. No one does.
That reality was obvious when she got into bed with them like Tony saidIt looks like the reality of getting involved with them is finally beginning to dawn on her. The future of the country could well come down to whether or not the DUP agree.
Such a strange thing to post.It isn't just the Tories that are scared of Corbyn becoming PM.
Made up facts again. Worse than Astute.
I posted what the latest on Merkel’s situation is. I also said from the start that no one wants another election and that I think she will form a coalition. I was surprised that the FDP wouldn’t play ball ( which I posted on here ).
I don’t deny the rise of the right. I pointed out that is regional in Germany. More in the East than the West. I also keep pointing out that it is still „only“ 1 in 8 who voted AfD as a whole. Others like to make out it was 1 in 6 or more.
I didn’t tell every leave voter to be ashamed of their vote. I told you as you obviously don’t have a clue what you voted for.
Sweden isn’t a really bad place. I just posted a comparison between Lobdon and Stockholm which shows it is Stockholm is no worse than London. I think the rest will be better than the UK apart from some ghetto type areas. Like to see some facts on that not just National Socialist opinions from certain sources.
The NHs has a lot to do with an ageing population, lack of funding and a lack of staff. Not purely because of migrants.
Greece was not a wealthy country before the EU. It’s tax system was weird. Every new government created new civil service jobs for its friends, some people were tax exempt- military, shipping- people retired very early and there was no large scale industrial base. They had a great run on tick in the EU until the crisis where they were left exposed. Now you like to blame the EU for everything. I say it is not so simple.
The housing market has a lot to with lack of investment in affordable housing going back years. More single households. Land banks. An ageing Population. Etc.. and more immigrants including non EU. It’s not purely because of the EU.
You take the simplest argument in all cases. A classic leaver. Not able to comprehend the various situations and saying that anyone who points out your lack of knowledge must be wrong.
I am well aware of why exchange rates fluctuate.
Despite me constantly saying that I am against border controls- I live in a country with 8 land borders. Millions cross borders every day on the continent. It would be plain stupid to reintroduce internal EU border throughout Europe on a.peemanent Basis. You voted for border control on UK external borders and accuse me of wanting a border on the island of Ireland? You are utterly bonkers.
And beyond doubt I have questioned her from the start.But hasn't it demonstrated beyond all doubt that Theresa May is totally incapable of running even a piss-up in brewery?
They won't do that, this is a bit of hard line posturing to curry favour with DUP supporters. Remember Foster has her own issues to face, the Ash for cash scandal hasn't gone away.If the DUP pull out of their arraignment with the government does that mean a general election?
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