WTF? Why? The EU has absolutely nothing to do with our referenda. We were not locked in in the first place. Stick to a fact based discussion.... please.
If that happens and I believe it possible there will be a deep seated hatred and distrust of the EU that wasn't even there before the referendum......and from Remainers who won't want to be made to look stupid for locking us in once again
WTF? Why? The EU has absolutely nothing to do with our referenda. We were not locked in in the first place. Stick to a fact based discussion.... please.
I don't agree with what he said, but believe it is based on the fact it looks like to many we have been backed into a corner, at least to some and so that hatred may increase.
Discussion isn't just about fact, it is also about opinion...
WTF? Why? The EU has absolutely nothing to do with our referenda. We were not locked in in the first place. Stick to a fact based discussion.... please.
That is the problem. It is about opinion. In your case saying that you feel we should stick to the decision good or bad is an opinion. Fair enough. Some agree and some don’t. To say that people will distrust and hate the EU because our country is split because of the referendum is also an opinion, as you rightly say, but it is based on a false premise that the EU had us locked in and has something to do with us holding referenda. Not true. I give more weight to your opinion because it is based on the fact that people did vote leave. My opinion is that no one got what they wanted and the country will probably suffer. Therefore people should now have the opportunity to say either, what you say, go ahead whatever, or no, we didn’t vote to make ourselves, probably, poorer. Let’s remain.
You tell me I am wrong yet you admit that there is no proof.That’s not true. More leavers have changed to remainers. You don’t know why. You are just saying that. There are a lot of people who didn’t know what the EU does, and now know it’s benefits. I have not seen a survey on the reasons for remain growing. You are assuming they don’t like the EU, but are now remain without evidence.
Of course we have been locked in, not legally but to all intents and purposes they have made it all but impossible to leave unless completely on their terms and have repeatedly stalled agreement.........and just to be clear people here won't be angry with Europe and the Europeans.....just the meddling middle men in Brussels and their pointless sleepy parliament.That is the problem. It is about opinion. In your case saying that you feel we should stick to the decision good or bad is an opinion. Fair enough. Some agree and some don’t. To say that people will distrust and hate the EU because our country is split because of the referendum is also an opinion, as you rightly say, but it is based on a false premise that the EU had us locked in and has something to do with us holding referenda. Not true. I give more weight to your opinion because it is based on the fact that people did vote leave. My opinion is that no one got what they wanted and the country will probably suffer. Therefore people should now have the opportunity to say either, what you say, go ahead whatever, or no, we didn’t vote to make ourselves, probably, poorer. Let’s remain.
What I would like to see is, if we were to 'cancel' Brexit, would the economy jump back, and how would the EU view us?
They would love us to stay in. They need our money to waste. And it would send a strong message to those who in the future will get closer to wanting to leave the EU.What I would like to see is, if we were to 'cancel' Brexit, would the economy jump back, and how would the EU view us?
Of course we have been locked in, not legally but to all intents and purposes they have made it all but impossible to leave unless completely on their terms and have repeatedly stalled agreement.........and just to be clear people here won't be angry with Europe and the Europeans.....just the meddling middle men in Brussels and their pointless sleepy parliament.
They would love us to stay in. They need our money to waste. And it would send a strong message to those who in the future will get closer to wanting to leave the EU.
I really would like to see the back of that prick Mark Carney now too. Sick to death of his tales of armagedon, he sounds like the morons who were threatening everyone with economic collapse horror stories pre referendum.......can't these people see they and their threats from other establishment types rub up ordinary folk to vote against them !
You're just talking about economic impact again, consumption, growth, money funnelled into the burgeoning pockets of the already wealthy........many didn't vote because of money, many of those were already poor. The vote was to prevent Merkel's Muslim millions being passed on at a time when terrorism was rife. It was ordinary people concerned at what real say we had in that bias little parliament on the continent, it was about looking around them and seeing the negative impact of 250,000 extra people every year coming to a squeezed little bunch of Islands. It was about constant destruction of green belts for housing, rising crime, grooming gangs, gangs running around with machetes, foreign ghettos on mainland Britain, traffic gridlock, pollution, environmental disaster, hospitals failing, schools overcrowded and full of kids whose first language could be from almost anywhere, faith schools..........it was about identity and us rapidly losing ours !How? They have been transparent all along. They have said you can leave. We can leave after a two year period. Why haven’t we left yet? We want a FTA which we can have after we have settled liabilities, the question of citizens rights ( EU and UK ) and the arrangements for the land border with the EU. Where is the problem? The money has been agreed. Citizens rights shouldn’t be a problem as it is reciprocal. The land border will have to be controlled if the leavers get their wish of „controlling our borders“. It will mess up the GFA, which will cause uproar, but that’s what you voted for. You won get over it. I said at the time Brexit was a stupid decision. I stand by that.
The UK will not get a better deal than the 27 members of the club. Nothing to do with the EU parliament, nor the council, nor the commission. Just plain old common sense. If you thought leaving was going to put the UK in a better position, as was said by the lying scum Brexiteers, then more fool you and be angry at the liars, not the people who told you the obvious, you cannot have your cake and eat it.
I don't know about the rest of you but I'm starting to get a real feeling that Brexit is not going to happen.
Parliament will not give its blessing. May will be kicked out, there will be another referendum and the vote will be 'remain'.
The only doubt will be, will the EU now let us remain, or tell us remain is no longer an option?
I don't like either of them, I want what's best for the country and for the ordinary people, I want to hear a balanced opinion with some realism. I didn't vote leave because of what I was told by these types, I voted because of what I saw and read about every day !No. They painted the worst case scenarios and are taking steps to prevent them happening. If they are successful, as in 2016, you won’t say.. „thanks for being prepared and preventing the worst“. You will say... „ I told you so..na na n na na“.
If you are stupid enough to be rubbed up by professionals doing their job, then there’s no hope is there? Perhaps you would prefer listening to Lord Snooty, who claims that Carney is a failed Canadian politician, which he actually isn’t. He held a non political post in the Canadian civil service. ( Treasury ). The failed politician in this story being Lord Snooty who claimed to have 48 letters, but didn’t and ended up looking a right twat. You probably prefer him to Carney as a member of the ordinary folk who prefer snobby would be aristocrats to look up to than professional respected people.
I've no doubt the economy would get a boost if Brexit was cancelled, however, the problems such a scenario would cause would be far more than just economic.
I don't like either of them, I want what's best for the country and for the ordinary people, I want to hear a balanced opinion with some realism. I didn't vote leave because of what I was told by these types, I voted because of what I saw and read about every day !
I doubt any of the creeps have really represented the people for perhaps 50 years now, no one trusts any of them do they ? No statesmen, just party politics and career enhancing grabbing wankers......who when they fail in parliament are landed with lucrative conjured up positions.....they rarely lose as Rome burns !When all this shit is finally over, one thing I'd like is a massive investigation of what the fuck happened. The Russians, dark money, media bias, think-tanks, cover-ups, the whole fucking system of government.
We're supposed to be a representative democracy. Our representatives have stopped properly representing us, the people. Decisions as important as this should not be put directly to the people, our parliament know this and yet they let it happen. Fucking omnishambles is an understatement.
I am sure that we would be allowed to remain.
However, the complete reversal of the referendum could unleash something dreadful in the UK and massively increase nationalism. Therefore for me the most sensible compromise between the 2 would be membership of the EEA with the ability to apply a brake on migration if the country could demonstrate it was negatively impacting the country.
I would also invest in areas that have been left behind and ignored by those in charge. Whenever I venture up north from the south coast the state of the country is a massive contrast with it down here, again, its a domestic policy of being London-centric.
I doubt any of the creeps have really represented the people for perhaps 50 years now, no one trusts any of them do they ? No statesmen, just party politics and career enhancing grabbing wankers......who when they fail in parliament are landed with lucrative conjured up positions.....they rarely lose as Rome burns !
I doubt any of the creeps have really represented the people for perhaps 50 years now, no one trusts any of them do they ? No statesmen, just party politics and career enhancing grabbing wankers......who when they fail in parliament are landed with lucrative conjured up positions.....they rarely lose as Rome burns !
Dir me coming back a couple of times every year, I really notice the difference in wealth between, when I am as a tourist in London and visiting people in the South East, and some parts of Cov. A few hours waiting in A and E in Cov was an eye opener.
Yes, but voting leave is just handing them even more power to fuck up the common people.
Well I read about innocent people being stabbed in the streets, grooming gangs of rapists, I watch hospital type programmes like 24 hours in A and E where one black lad after another were being brought in with stab wounds, I go to local pubs and I see drugs being openly banded around, I don't see hardly any police around, I read about more and more violent robberies on people and business { Very often by foreign or gypsy gangs }, the village I have lived in all my life is not a village at now, its grown from 5000 to 20,000 and is still growing { Many are Brits pouring out of the Cities to avoid the issues within }, there is no wildlife like there used to be, I see buildings quietly being turned into Muslim meeting rooms etc, faith schools springing up, homelessness on the rise, the roads are shocking, my wife works 10 hour days in a hospital that is so under stress from the demography, sue society, need for interpreters, allowance for various cultural needs etc etc.........that's what I see and hear all the time.Yes, but what did you read and what was the agenda behind it?
Well I read about innocent people being stabbed in the streets, grooming gangs of rapists, I watch hospital type programmes like 24 hours in A and E where one black lad after another were being brought in with stab wounds, I go to local pubs and I see drugs being openly banded around, I don't see hardly any police around, I read about more and more violent robberies on people and business { Very often by foreign or gypsy gangs }, the village I have lived in all my life is not a village at now, its grown from 5000 to 20,000 and is still growing { Many are Brits pouring out of the Cities to avoid the issues within }, there is no wildlife like there used to be, I see buildings quietly being turned into Muslim meeting rooms etc, faith schools springing up, homelessness on the rise, the roads are shocking, my wife works 10 hour days in a hospital that is so under stress from the demography, sue society, need for interpreters, allowance for various cultural needs etc etc.........that's what I see and hear all the time.
Sadly you are probably right but we were given a choice to vote and we perhaps hoped for change for the better........my friends who voted Remain tended to be guys and Gals in rather nice Insurance and Finance jobs, architects and lawyers and working in education etc...........many more who I know who voted Leave had been impacted by companies closing, low wages, awful contracts and working conditions, Eastern European tradesmen undercutting them for building type work, people scared by criminality and terrorism, people who thought the £10 billion per annum could be better spent at home, people who recognized the trade deficit we have with the big European players and thought they would play ball to get a good deal for all...........I don't think anyone Remain or Leave had really known how strong the EU had become and underestimated it's influence on countries national decision making.as I asked in an earlier post, what makes you think that will change post Brexit?
I only see things getting worse.
Well I read about innocent people being stabbed in the streets, grooming gangs of rapists, I watch hospital type programmes like 24 hours in A and E where one black lad after another were being brought in with stab wounds, I go to local pubs and I see drugs being openly banded around, I don't see hardly any police around, I read about more and more violent robberies on people and business { Very often by foreign or gypsy gangs }, the village I have lived in all my life is not a village at now, its grown from 5000 to 20,000 and is still growing { Many are Brits pouring out of the Cities to avoid the issues within }, there is no wildlife like there used to be, I see buildings quietly being turned into Muslim meeting rooms etc, faith schools springing up, homelessness on the rise, the roads are shocking, my wife works 10 hour days in a hospital that is so under stress from the demography, sue society, need for interpreters, allowance for various cultural needs etc etc.........that's what I see and hear all the time.
Successful in 2016?No. They painted the worst case scenarios and are taking steps to prevent them happening. If they are successful, as in 2016, you won’t say.. „thanks for being prepared and preventing the worst“. You will say... „ I told you so..na na n na na“.
Our representatives have stopped representing us?When all this shit is finally over, one thing I'd like is a massive investigation of what the fuck happened. The Russians, dark money, media bias, think-tanks, cover-ups, the whole fucking system of government.
We're supposed to be a representative democracy. Our representatives have stopped properly representing us, the people. Decisions as important as this should not be put directly to the people, our parliament know this and yet they let it happen. Fucking omnishambles is an understatement.
Sadly you are probably right but we were given a choice to vote and we perhaps hoped for change for the better........my friends who voted Remain tended to be guys and Gals in rather nice Insurance and Finance jobs, architects and lawyers and working in education etc...........many more who I know who voted Leave had been impacted by companies closing, low wages, awful contracts and working conditions, Eastern European tradesmen undercutting them for building type work, people scared by criminality and terrorism, people who thought the £10 billion per annum could be better spent at home, people who recognized the trade deficit we have with the big European players and thought they would play ball to get a good deal for all...........I don't think anyone Remain or Leave had really known how strong the EU had become and underestimated it's influence on countries national decision making.
I tried { in my opinion } to point out what I think are the negatives that drove the vote..........and these were real life and happening every year and we've been stuck in the 'Club ' now for 40 years so all this has been under the watch of the EU. Ultimately mass free movement of people from anywhere not just the EU is what has really triggered all this, if immigration was controlled better all along and people were not mindful of our whole cultural identity being dissolved in a huge multi ethnic melting pot that was and is still running out of control then I believe the status quo would remain.
I would remind you Mart that the German population has remained stable and only maintained through some immigration where as ours in the UK has burgeoned to uncomfortable levels in many places in just 25 years. The infrastructure and tax receipts do not seem to have kept up with the increased demands.
Why is it?Yes, but voting leave is just handing them even more power to fuck up the common people.
Successful in 2016?
So yet again they got their predictions totally wrong. Yet you turn it into a success
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