Grendel
Well-Known Member
Just heard Paul Nuttall say the same thing. You and UKIP in harmony. My my
Start shutting down every Saudi funded Mosque for a start.
Just heard Paul Nuttall say the same thing. You and UKIP in harmony. My my
How could you justify locking someone up for opinions? Totally unworkableThey could if detention was allowed for this sort of behaviour.
This is now required.
If not this will become a weekly event all over this country.
I agree with much of Grendel's sentiments on this . If our stance doesn't change in the way this is dealt with it will become a regular theme.
What we are good at in this country are candle lit prayers, minute silences, laying of flowers and sending our heartfelt condolences to the families of the victims.
It doesn't stop the next attack and it's simply a question of time before it happens all over again.
It almost makes me laugh to see politicians saying we need to go about our normal business and stand up to these terrorists. When the people of Manchester went to work the next day in a "show of solidarity" they went to work because they had to. Life went on because it had to. They have to earn a living. They have families to support. It doesn't mean they're not afraid, angry or sad.
We may well stand together in a show of defiance but if some bastard decides to blow me to kingdom come outside of Tesco it'll be simply another bunch of flowers tied to a lamp post with the words "he went about his daily business" I'm sure the BBC would pick that one out and tell everyone how brave I was.
How could you justify locking someone up for opinions? Totally unworkable
How could you justify locking someone up for opinions? Totally unworkable
What...you mean give all our home grown extremists access to guns, bullets, grenades, missiles & bombs?Just out of interest, how many people here would be more than happy if they called all men under 40 up for service to eradicate these extrememists, both here and abroad?
I'd suggest that some vetting might be needed.What...you mean give all our home grown extremists access to guns, bullets, grenades, missiles & bombs?
Yeah, that would work!
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I'm over 40 so would be well happy.Just out of interest, how many people here would be more than happy if they called all men under 40 up for service to eradicate these extrememists, both here and abroad?
The western worlds (mainly America & ourselves ) decision making in the Middle East
'primarily Iraq' which has cost over 1 million innocent lives,
It Has opened up the biggest 'can of worms" imaginable and Our governments Have
Absolutely no idea how to put the lid back on.
And it was all done in the name of Oil and massive rebuilding infrastructure contracts,
Handed out to members of the Bush administration, Cheney and Rumsfold etc.
Unfortunately for us you "reap what you sowe"
Never going to happen mate, whilst it's clear the whole area is unstable, volatileLets start by stopping all dealings with Middle East countries. Financial restrictions if properly done would have an impact.
Everyone'll just go onto redtubeShut down sites like Britain Fist
Some very good points.These are all things that we can start doing now.
- Financial restrictions on certain countries.
- Stop selling arms to dubious regimes.
- Pull out of all military intervention in the region.
- Pressure on Turkish and Iraqi governments to recognise Kurdistan.
- People like Blair investigated properly with potential war crime trials.
- Require all mosques to submit accounts with strict details as to where funds are coming - those that are suspect should have all activities suspended pending investigation.
- Ban all single faith schools, Muslim, Christian, Jewish. All. We're a multi-faith, multi-cultural society and no segregation should take place. Kids taught to standardised national curriculum.
- Correctly fund police and give them tools to carry out their job.
- Use mirroring to replicate radical Islamic sights but going through GCHQ servers so anyone visiting sights is instantly put on a watch list. Home Sec then approves all internet activity monitored and any further suspicious activity deemed a criminal offence.
- More air time given to moderate Muslims, Sidiq Khan for example, to show that success is possible as a British Muslim.
- Shut down sites like Britain Fist who perpetuate hate and divisions in society.
- Moderate British Muslims in all mosques to monitor any potential suspicious activity
I'd also have a look at the laws regarding hate speech and introduce community service schemes. Anybody caught spreading bile online will be forced to do 30 days unpaid work in the affected communities. Anti-Muslim hate speech will mean work in a Mosque. Terrorist supportive statements will mean working for victim support charities. 2nd offence is prison.
We should make sure that atrocities like this are not used for political gain. The message should be repeated, yes there is obviously a problem with radical Islam and we are trying to rectify this using the steps above, this is still the safest time our civilisation has ever had. Live your life without worry or panic.
A few days ago I was called warp minded for suggesting Islamic terrorism is our current greatest threat. It hasn't even been a week and there has been another attack.
You can blame the government, foreign affairs, Saudi Arabia all you want, but this just gives a free pass to your local jihadi's who are the ones plotting and carrying out the attacks.
The reality is they are going to get worse and more common, and the degrees of separation are only going to close in. I've highlighted in the other thread my ideas of what should be done to try and combat this, the problem is, we are, and we have been too tolerant to this posinous extreme ideology. Vitue signalling and the like isn't working, we need to be hard and zero tolerant.
May probably isn't the answer, but people that say the Labour goverment are need to go and have a word with themselves.
RIP to the victims.
So if they're unsuitable...we simply eradicate them then?I'd suggest that some vetting might be needed.
These are all things that we can start doing now.
- Financial restrictions on certain countries.
- Stop selling arms to dubious regimes.
- Pull out of all military intervention in the region.
- Pressure on Turkish and Iraqi governments to recognise Kurdistan.
- People like Blair investigated properly with potential war crime trials.
- Require all mosques to submit accounts with strict details as to where funds are coming - those that are suspect should have all activities suspended pending investigation.
- Ban all single faith schools, Muslim, Christian, Jewish. All. We're a multi-faith, multi-cultural society and no segregation should take place. Kids taught to standardised national curriculum.
- Correctly fund police and give them tools to carry out their job.
- Use mirroring to replicate radical Islamic sights but going through GCHQ servers so anyone visiting sights is instantly put on a watch list. Home Sec then approves all internet activity monitored and any further suspicious activity deemed a criminal offence.
- More air time given to moderate Muslims, Sidiq Khan for example, to show that success is possible as a British Muslim.
- Shut down sites like Britain Fist who perpetuate hate and divisions in society.
- Moderate British Muslims in all mosques to monitor any potential suspicious activity
I'd also have a look at the laws regarding hate speech and introduce community service schemes. Anybody caught spreading bile online will be forced to do 30 days unpaid work in the affected communities. Anti-Muslim hate speech will mean work in a Mosque. Terrorist supportive statements will mean working for victim support charities. 2nd offence is prison.
We should make sure that atrocities like this are not used for political gain. The message should be repeated, yes there is obviously a problem with radical Islam and we are trying to rectify this using the steps above, this is still the safest time our civilisation has ever had. Live your life without worry or panic.
Just out of interest, how many people here would be more than happy if they called all men under 40 up for service to eradicate these extrememists, both here and abroad?
People need to think about this from the other side too - what if all Middle East countries had shown some form of solidarity & stopped dealing with us when the original Iraq invasion took place? NO OIL!Lets start by stopping all dealings with Middle East countries. Financial restrictions if properly done would have an impact.
there is no free pass. there is looking at the problem from both sides however
foreign policy causes a lot of the terrorism as they are revenge/justice motivated in the killers warped minds.
but nothing changes fact they are evil disgusting human beings and killing innocents does not make up for innocents lost in their homeland or the land of their family or religion etc
its the fact so few in this world can see it from both sides that makes me worry. this is not good vs evil. this is evil vs evil with the good getting the worst of it in england and middle east.
These are all things that we can start doing now.
- Financial restrictions on certain countries.
- Stop selling arms to dubious regimes.
- Pull out of all military intervention in the region.
- Pressure on Turkish and Iraqi governments to recognise Kurdistan.
- People like Blair investigated properly with potential war crime trials.
- Require all mosques to submit accounts with strict details as to where funds are coming - those that are suspect should have all activities suspended pending investigation.
- Ban all single faith schools, Muslim, Christian, Jewish. All. We're a multi-faith, multi-cultural society and no segregation should take place. Kids taught to standardised national curriculum.
- Correctly fund police and give them tools to carry out their job.
- Use mirroring to replicate radical Islamic sights but going through GCHQ servers so anyone visiting sights is instantly put on a watch list. Home Sec then approves all internet activity monitored and any further suspicious activity deemed a criminal offence.
- More air time given to moderate Muslims, Sidiq Khan for example, to show that success is possible as a British Muslim.
- Shut down sites like Britain Fist who perpetuate hate and divisions in society.
- Moderate British Muslims in all mosques to monitor any potential suspicious activity
I'd also have a look at the laws regarding hate speech and introduce community service schemes. Anybody caught spreading bile online will be forced to do 30 days unpaid work in the affected communities. Anti-Muslim hate speech will mean work in a Mosque. Terrorist supportive statements will mean working for victim support charities. 2nd offence is prison.
We should make sure that atrocities like this are not used for political gain. The message should be repeated, yes there is obviously a problem with radical Islam and we are trying to rectify this using the steps above, this is still the safest time our civilisation has ever had. Live your life without worry or panic.
No, I can think from the otherside. My point is that there are people that like to twist the knife in and infer that we deserve it, although never directly admit to it.
I have said countless times we need to withdraw from the middle east and cut ties with Saudi immediatey. I also think however, installing people into power who want to do away with our defences, MI5, and open the borders up even more need to check their own policies along with the criticism of others.
No, I can think from the otherside. My point is that there are people that like to twist the knife in and infer that we deserve it, although never directly admit to it.
I have said countless times we need to withdraw from the middle east and cut ties with Saudi immediatey. I also think however, installing people into power who want to do away with our defences, MI5, and open the borders up even more need to check their own policies along with the criticism of others.
People need to think about this from the other side too - what if all Middle East countries had shown some form of solidarity & stopped dealing with us when the original Iraq invasion took place? NO OIL!
Let us stop dealing with Middle East countries now...NO OIL.
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Always on about borders.... As usual these tossers live here. The borders are not the main problem. We live on an island and control our borders. The problem is that these religious books are horrific. They all tell of stonings and executions etc. for minor crimes ( e.g. in the bible, death penalty for gathering sticks on the sabbath ). WTF? If a political party were to write about the horrific ways you should treat unbeleivers, or even your wife and children if the do "wrong" they would be in major trouble with the law. But, if it's written in some dubious old holy book nothing will be done. Why?
The people attacked by these sick bastards didn't deserve this crap. Nor do the people who will be killed and maimed by our and Trump's weapons ( many more than in this incident ) which we openly and without discussion sold to a bizarre monarchy which allows it's citizens to propagate one of these pathetic desert religions.
We must put religion in it's place. That includes the god who Bush, Blair and May talk to. By accepting the supernatural, we are on the same level as muslims - some of whom take things in their book literally. Look at how religious our society is. Head of State is the defender of the faith. FFS, let us grow up and set an example of secular life.
These are all things that we can start doing now.
- Financial restrictions on certain countries. (Plenty of banks in the Middle East they could use...so minimal impact)
- Stop selling arms to dubious regimes. (The Russians & Chinese would be in their element)
- Pull out of all military intervention in the region. (We have allies amongst various rebel factions that if we abandon will never win back if they succeed in gaining power...or they & their families would be brutalised before death)
- Pressure on Turkish and Iraqi governments to recognise Kurdistan. (Then the Turks & Iraqui's living in Kurdistan kick-off...the needle returns to the start of the song & we all sing along like before)
- People like Blair investigated properly with potential war crime trials. (ABSOLUTELY YES)
- Require all mosques to submit accounts with strict details as to where funds are coming - those that are suspect should have all activities suspended pending investigation. (I think you mean 'funds are going'...not sure if this is already a requirement or not, but ought to be. Source of funds received ought to be recorded too - at least loosely)
- Ban all single faith schools, Muslim, Christian, Jewish. All. We're a multi-faith, multi-cultural society and no segregation should take place. Kids taught to standardised national curriculum. (ABSOLUTELY YES)
- Correctly fund police and give them tools to carry out their job.(Not sure we are a million miles from this already...its simply that the true scale of the problem isn't known so how many police do you need & what tools?)
- Use mirroring to replicate radical Islamic sights but going through GCHQ servers so anyone visiting sights is instantly put on a watch list. Home Sec then approves all internet activity monitored and any further suspicious activity deemed a criminal offence.(Most of that you would expect to have been happening 5-10yrs or more ago. It has to be remembered that criminal offences introduced could quite easily drive the baddies further underground...& at the same time leave much more innocent people & organisations open to arrest - veering towards a police state!)
- More air time given to moderate Muslims, Sidiq Khan for example, to show that success is possible as a British Muslim. (ABSOLUTELY NOT. Faith & success should not be broadcast together...it might raise false expectations & lead to even greater disaffected murderers)
- Shut down sites like Britain Fist who perpetuate hate and divisions in society. (Never heard of it)
- Moderate British Muslims in all mosques to monitor any potential suspicious activity (I feel pretty certain that the vast majority in the congregation & leadership of every mosque is fairly moderate to extreme & against violence & such acts)
I'd also have a look at the laws regarding hate speech and introduce community service schemes. (Already laws & sentencing laid down.. maybe needs redefining & stronger sentencing) Anybody caught spreading bile online will be forced to do 30 days unpaid work in the affected communities. (All covered by existing hate laws & sentencing) Anti-Muslim hate speech will mean work in a Mosque. (Good idea...all those reporters from the tabloids would love it) Terrorist supportive statements will mean working for victim support charities. 2nd offence is prison.
We should make sure that atrocities like this are not used for political gain. (That is never gonna happen...it will always be a means to achieve power or at least an audience by someone) The message should be repeated, yes there is obviously a problem with radical Islam (RELIGION) and we are trying to rectify this using the steps above, this is still the safest time our civilisation has ever had. Live your life without worry or panic.(From the safety of their own security blanket)
I ain't the prime minister buddy, but I would support physical action rather than words.LOL what?
and how exactly would this work?
And what if they are refused entry? Other nations happily put them straight back on the next plane back to Britain! Then what?I ain't the prime minister buddy, but I would support physical action rather than words.
Possession of one of these flags should be instant deportation. i.e. Straight on the next plane to wherever your grandparents came from.http://video.dailymail.co.uk/previe...5191099595/964x580_MP4_593257075191099595.mp4
Ever seen the Terminal?And what if they are refused entry? Other nations happily put them straight back on the next plane back to Britain! Then what?
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And they say..."no weapons...no oil"...then what?I get your point - however there are some things we could do immediately for example, we could stop trading weapons with Saudi Arabia and Yemen.
Other things that may be more of a challenge would be stopping Turkey buying oil from ISIS.
IMO there appears to be a lack of desire on the part of those that could make a difference...
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