Was this Coventry City's worst ever transfer window? (2 Viewers)

[steve82]

Said it at the time, he was trying to shop at Waitrose when he had an Aldi budget. Wasn't even looking at yellow labels.

The thing was he said himself the club was to reliant on loans and needed a identity of its own players.

What did he do in the coming g months to rectify that issue?

He and MV failed to work to the known restrictions to do the best the club could achieve realistically and for a experienced manager that’s poor or stubborn


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[covcity4life]

So if Robins came out and said he wanted to buy the 2 top scorers in the championship for a league 1 club he wouldn't be aiming too high?

dont beleive mowbray was going for top 2 scorers in championship

 

[Nick]

1) who knows when he found out sisu were reducing budget? maybe he put MV there to fight agaisnt this to no avail.

2)shouldn't need to adapt to scenario. adapting would mean buy shit cloggers which wouldnt work tactically,would have got relegated and then it could actually be said it was mowbrays relegation. maybe instead of 6 prime targets he decided 3 prime targets were better than buying 7 or 8 non technical players. regardless the problem is the owners, this has been fan view for decade yet for this one season they are perfect. very odd! mowbray left because he didnt have a team he could work with, in my opinion he was in a situation that he couldnt succeed in. people can say adapt and all that but would pep guardiola adapt? would bielsa? because they have foreign names its ok? no chance, he is a ball playing manager and if you hire him you need back to him. he will succeed if you do this like wba and blackburn. we gave him healthy backing in his 1 full season with us and he got 8th, had we done same again we would have been pushing for top 6 again.

but we didnt, he left honourably with plenty of time for a new manager to get us promoted even and isntead they hired venus and slade and it fell apart. still mowbrays team won the checkatrade with bigi and turnbull shining. so in both seasons he was a success despite only being backed in one.

there you go

What doesn't stack up is if the budget was reduced. Why was he still chasing players above our level towards the end of the window when he also paid a fee for Turnbull? Let's not forget Sordell and Reid would have wanted a quid or two and were signed quite early on.

Would your man Pep be able to rock up at a League 1 Club without a penny to spend on transfers and stand out at that level?

 

[Ccfcisparks]

If Mowbray had Robins' ability with transfers we would be pushing top 6 in the championship right now.

 

[covcity4life]

What doesn't stack up is if the budget was reduced. Why was he still chasing players above our level towards the end of the window when he also paid a fee for Turnbull? Let's not forget Sordell and Reid would have wanted a quid or two and were signed quite early on.

Would your man Pep be able to rock up at a League 1 Club without a penny to spend on transfers and stand out at that level?

maybe instead of 6 prime targets he decided 3 prime targets were better than buying 7 or 8 non technical players.

 

[covcity4life]

If Mowbray had Robins' ability with transfers we would be pushing top 6 in the championship right now.

agree, would love to see current cov team play like mowbrays!

 

[Nick]

maybe instead of 6 prime targets he decided 3 prime targets were better than buying 7 or 8 non technical players.

How does that work?

 

[covcity4life]

How does that work?

lets say he had loads of targets,budget slashed,instead of spreading budget out over lots of players he decides to got for 3 players he wants that were a fit for the original budget with this new reduced budget(reid,sordell,turnbull)

 

[Nick]

lets say he had loads of targets,budget slashed,instead of spreading budget out over lots of players he decides to got for 3 players he wants that were a fit for the original budget with this new reduced budget(reid,sordell,turnbull)

When did the budget get slashed then?

If I had a budget to do my shopping, I wouldn't just spend it all on a nice steak and some wine. I'd have to try and figure out how to get the best for the meals we needed for the budget I had.

 

[covcity4life]

When did the budget get slashed then?

If I had a budget to do my shopping, I wouldn't just spend it all on a nice steak and some wine. I'd have to try and figure out how to get the best for the meals we needed for the budget I had.

and you would have shit meals for a month

with you steak you would enjoy it and even though less food it would keep you alive alongside some shitty peas

2 ways to spend it. like i said dont hire a ball palying manager if you dont want to back him with ball playing footballers(which tend to cost more)

 

[Earlsdon-Loyal-Blue]

Mowbray was the catalyst that got us relegated.

It all started with him. Slade merely pulled the pin out of the grenade he was already given.

Awful, awful transfer window. I remember them pulling season tickets about a week before the transfer window closed. That sounded alarm bells for me and helped me make the correct decision in not buying one.

On this one mate, I agree Mowbray delivered a poor transfer window but Pressley's last window and Slade's January Transfer Window were undoubtedly worse.

Mowbray has to share a good chunk of the blame for our L1 relegation but the grenade analogy implies that the situation was almost impossible to get out of and Slade made it worse.
When Slade joined, we were one point from safety. We weren't in an impossible situation to get out of and I believe if Robins had been brought in at the point, nevermind keeping us up, he would of got us mid-table.

Despite a poor window from Mowbray, an overstay of Venus as caretaker manager, the situation was still avoidable and we were one point from safety and at that moment, Slade managed to blow us into oblivion and send us to the bottom of the table 14 points from safety.

 

[Nick]

and you would have shit meals for a month

with you steak you would enjoy it and even though less food it would keep you alive alongside some shitty peas

2 ways to spend it. like i said dont hire a ball palying manager if you dont want to back him with ball playing footballers(which tend to cost more)

Why does it mean shit meals? If I was to spend time shopping around I could get decent meals for the month without blowing it all on one bit of meat and a bottle of wine.

 

[covcity4life]

Why does it mean shit meals? If I was to spend time shopping around I could get decent meals for the month without blowing it all on one bit of meat and a bottle of wine.

if that was the case every single team in every single league would be good

it is not as simple as shop around in football i am afraid.

 

[covcity4life]

On this one mate, I agree Mowbray delivered a poor transfer window but Pressley's last window and Slade's January Transfer Window were undoubtedly worse.

Mowbray has to share a good chunk of the blame for our L1 relegation but the grenade analogy implies that the situation was almost impossible to get out of and Slade made it worse.
When Slade joined, we were one point from safety. We weren't in an impossible situation to get out of and I believe if Robins had been brought in at the point, nevermind keeping us up, he would of got us mid-table.

Despite a poor window from Mowbray, an overstay of Venus as caretaker manager, the situation was still avoidable and we were one point from safety and at that moment, Slade managed to blow us into oblivion and send us to the bottom of the table 14 points from safety.

yet the man who took us from 1 pt to 14 off safety gets less flack than the one that got us 8th

LOL

 

[Nick]

if that was the case every single team in every single league would be good

it is not as simple as shop around in football i am afraid.

It is when you are a lower league manager without the ability to just go and buy any player you want.

You have 2 choices, play with a system that gets the best out of your current players or find a system which you can realistically recruit for.

If you are saying that somebody like Mowbray or Pep couldn't do a job in the lower leagues as they couldn't get the players they wanted, how does that make them better managers than somebody like John Coleman?

 

[SkyBlueCRJ]

1) who knows when he found out sisu were reducing budget? maybe he put MV there to fight agaisnt this to no avail.

2)shouldn't need to adapt to scenario. adapting would mean buy shit cloggers which wouldnt work tactically,would have got relegated and then it could actually be said it was mowbrays relegation. maybe instead of 6 prime targets he decided 3 prime targets were better than buying 7 or 8 non technical players. regardless the problem is the owners, this has been fan view for decade yet for this one season they are perfect. very odd! mowbray left because he didnt have a team he could work with, in my opinion he was in a situation that he couldnt succeed in. people can say adapt and all that but would pep guardiola adapt? would bielsa? because they have foreign names its ok? no chance, he is a ball playing manager and if you hire him you need back to him. he will succeed if you do this like wba and blackburn. we gave him healthy backing in his 1 full season with us and he got 8th, had we done same again we would have been pushing for top 6 again.

but we didnt, he left honourably with plenty of time for a new manager to get us promoted even and isntead they hired venus and slade and it fell apart. still mowbrays team won the checkatrade with bigi and turnbull shining. so in both seasons he was a success despite only being backed in one.

there you go

1) He knew the club was in a precarious position and shouldn't have assumed. As I said, I have a strong feeling he believed the budget would've been increased due to the success of his first season. But unless he had it in writing (which I highly doubt he did) why suddenly launch a campaign to go after every single Championship reject going? What did he genuinely believe MV was going to do? Convince Joy to part with her millions?

2) I understand what you're saying but why take the job in the first place if he knew that he would have to adapt due to the constraints he'd be under. Surely he knew the financial position we were in. If he thought otherwise he's not just naive, he's an idiot. Like you said he needs a big backing to do well, so why risk a blemish on your career by joining a club who's owners hadn't spent a penny on a player in years? Once again he was setting himself up to fail.

I understand your POV but to simply base all blame on SISU is illogical. SISU are never going to change so by your logic it's like blaming a snake for biting a man who tried to pick it up. It's like as the proverb goes: A snake can change its skin but not its disposition. You're saying TM shouldn't have been expected to adapt, TM equally shouldn't have expected SISU to change their stance.

Plus why are you making out he effectively won us the cheakatrade? We won one checkatrade game whilst under his tenure that season - against West Ham's U21's I might add. He left because he knew that season was going to be a relegation dogfight, if he was that frustrated about the backing or the lack of, surely he wouldn't have signed a 2 year contract extension that summer?

 

[steve82]

1) who knows when he found out sisu were reducing budget? maybe he put MV there to fight agaisnt this to no avail.

2)shouldn't need to adapt to scenario. adapting would mean buy shit cloggers which wouldnt work tactically,would have got relegated and then it could actually be said it was mowbrays relegation. maybe instead of 6 prime targets he decided 3 prime targets were better than buying 7 or 8 non technical players. regardless the problem is the owners, this has been fan view for decade yet for this one season they are perfect. very odd! mowbray left because he didnt have a team he could work with, in my opinion he was in a situation that he couldnt succeed in. people can say adapt and all that but would pep guardiola adapt? would bielsa? because they have foreign names its ok? no chance, he is a ball playing manager and if you hire him you need back to him. he will succeed if you do this like wba and blackburn. we gave him healthy backing in his 1 full season with us and he got 8th, had we done same again we would have been pushing for top 6 again.

but we didnt, he left honourably with plenty of time for a new manager to get us promoted even and isntead they hired venus and slade and it fell apart. still mowbrays team won the checkatrade with bigi and turnbull shining. so in both seasons he was a success despite only being backed in one.

there you go

p.s i am angry tm walked as i felt he could have turned it round and left too soon into the season. that said he got Bburn job so he prob wont regret it!

Fair response... make so useful points

MV was put in the position be hands on with the numbers, in my eyes both were aware of the summer ahead and lack of backing from sisu. That point is widely agreed acro fan base TM should of been backed.

Facts are he wasn’t, if he was in a position he couldn’t succeed in should he of stepped down immediately early summer knowing full well the playing style he implements won’t suit the majority of L1 or L2 players.

Yes he should and we as fans would look back at him with fondness. Instead he stuck around refusing to adapt to the reality of the job and way he was gonna be forced to recruit.
He was now out his depth had no clear plan in a season the loan window closed the same as the transfer window

Now I’m sure he could of used the likely poor budget much more wisely for a experienced manager, in his hole time here he only signed talented kids on loan or names he knew from days gone.
Very few did he look to bring up the leagues, only vincelot or JJ did he do so for cash.

Ps Bigi and Turnbull wasn’t fit for a season, that’s your bread and butter not a day in the sun at the national stadium where Haynes and Beavon shone too. So we will take that scouting report with a pinch of salt


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[covcity4life]

It is when you are a lower league manager without the ability to just go and buy any player you want.

You have 2 choices, play with a system that gets the best out of your current players or find a system which you can realistically recruit for.

If you are saying that somebody like Mowbray or Pep couldn't do a job in the lower leagues as they couldn't get the players they wanted, how does that make them better managers than somebody like John Coleman?

where have i said they can or cant? where have i ever put down coleman?

its pretty obvious that hoofball doesnt work amongst top teams anymore
and its also obvious that tiki taka only works with technical players

i think its unrealistic to expect to be able to find so many diamonds in the rough in 1 summer window. he will know the sorta budget required to get right type of player in and sisu no longer provided it. thus the end of the chapter

now me personally have no doubt that had TM stayed he would have been mid table to chasing playoffsm,thats why im angry he left. but i guess we will never have an answer to that one now, i said it all that season and still say it now, it wasnt so bad it should have got relegated. fact is fans hate that recruitment window so much because of how venus and slade did with that team, had tm stayed it would have been mid table and fans bemoaning sisu for not helping TM take us forward

 

[Nick]

where have i said they can or cant? where have i ever put down coleman?

its pretty obvious that hoofball doesnt work amongst top teams anymore
and its also obvious that tiki taka only works with technical players

i think its unrealistic to expect to be able to find so many diamonds in the rough in 1 summer window. he will know the sorta budget required to get right type of player in and sisu no longer provided it. thus the end of the chapter

now me personally have no doubt that had TM stayed he would have been mid table to chasing playoffsm,thats why im angry he left. but i guess we will never have an answer to that one now, i said it all that season and still say it now, it wasnt so bad it should have got relegated. fact is fans hate that recruitment window so much because of how venus and slade did with that team, had tm stayed it would have been mid table and fans bemoaning sisu for not helping TM take us forward

So that goes back to my point, you adjust your system to work to get you results in the league you are in with the players you have.

If you are in League 1 or 2, you won't be able to go out and buy players to suit a Man City or Barcelona style of play.

Blaming budget is a poor getout really. Especially if the manager knew before hand the situation and there wouldn't be a massive amount to buy who he wanted.

 

[covcity4life]

So that goes back to my point, you adjust your system to work to get you results in the league you are in with the players you have.

If you are in League 1 or 2, you won't be able to go out and buy players to suit a Man City or Barcelona style of play.

Blaming budget is a poor getout really. Especially if the manager knew before hand the situation and there wouldn't be a massive amount to buy who he wanted.

it goes back to my point. you cant play that football without those players. and if you dont want to buy those players dont get a manager that plays that football!

sisu changed the plan halfway,its that simple

and it can be done in league 1 as blackburn got promoted playing amazing footy. their manager was tony mowbray.

 

[Nick]

it goes back to my point. you cant play that football without those players. and if you dont want to buy those players dont get a manager that plays that football!

sisu changed the plan halfway,its that simple

and it can be done in league 1 as blackburn got promoted playing amazing footy. their manager was tony mowbray.

OK, so at what point did it change? He was still trying to bring in players towards the end of the window and paid money for Turnbull.

Didn't he inherit pretty much a Championship squad and have one of the biggest budgets in League one after he had got them relegated? That is more of an exception rather than the rule.

 

[covcity4life]

OK, so at what point did it change? He was still trying to bring in players towards the end of the window and paid money for Turnbull.

Didn't he inherit pretty much a Championship squad and have one of the biggest budgets in League one after he had got them relegated? That is more of an exception rather than the rule.

oh he got them relegated but slade didnt get us relegated? hmmmmmmm

as i have already said he prob spent what budget he did have on a few targets like turnbull rather than a influx of preferred targets

 

[Covstu]

I know TM and MV slightly
TM in particular is a really good, honourable guy
What he had to put up with probably helped MR who was given a more realistic budget when he came in

my hero's!!!

 

[Nick]

oh he got them relegated but slade didnt get us relegated? hmmmmmmm

as i have already said he prob spent what budget he did have on a few targets like turnbull rather than a influx of preferred targets

I made that point especially

If he wasted all of the budget on Turnbull, Reid and Sordell then it is bad planning / management.

 

[covcity4life]

perhaps but my thoughts on that nick are:

1)i still feel any competent manager would not have got anywhere near relegation witht hat team,frustrating TM left it to clowns like venus and slade

2)i wouldnt hire a gourmet chef to plan a kids birth party meals, the poor management came from sisu. just like if man city hired allardyce after pep. no one would blame allardye if he used budget on players like andy caroll or troy deeny , they would be like what you expect to the man city board. mowbray isnt the man for a cheap budget i agree on that. but i dont blame HIM for that.

 

[Nick]

perhaps but my thoughts on that nick are:

1)i still feel any competent manager would not have got anywhere near relegation witht hat team,frustrating TM left it to clowns like venus and slade

2)i wouldnt hire a gourmet chef to plan a kids birth party meals, the poor management came from sisu. just like if man city hired allardyce after pep. no one would blame allardye if he used budget on players like andy caroll or troy deeny , they would be like what you expect to the man city board. mowbray isnt the man for a cheap budget i agree on that. but i dont blame HIM for that.

The poor management was from the people in charge of bringing in players which was TM / MV. If he was a gourmet chef, why was he applying to cook kids birthday meals in the first place?

 

[Covstu]

TM was a lot of things but he wasn't responsible for our relegation, that was Slade and SISU.

Its like a new Prime Minister, they spend their time complaining about the old one and probably dealing with the aftermath of that also. TM blew his wad in season 1 on high value quality loanees, a strategy that failed (but lets face it we all enjoyed the ride) and that ultimately had a knock on effect for S2 where we had to tighten the reigns significantly. All of a sudden these big players were not attracted to the club and we all know the result of that.

Relegation at that point was inevitable and has ultimately helped us rebuild with a more sustainable strategy in having our own assets rather than borrowing.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

On this one mate, I agree Mowbray delivered a poor transfer window but Pressley's last window and Slade's January Transfer Window were undoubtedly worse.

Mowbray has to share a good chunk of the blame for our L1 relegation but the grenade analogy implies that the situation was almost impossible to get out of and Slade made it worse.
When Slade joined, we were one point from safety. We weren't in an impossible situation to get out of and I believe if Robins had been brought in at the point, nevermind keeping us up, he would of got us mid-table.

Despite a poor window from Mowbray, an overstay of Venus as caretaker manager, the situation was still avoidable and we were one point from safety and at that moment, Slade managed to blow us into oblivion and send us to the bottom of the table 14 points from safety.

I agree with a lot of your points mate, I just think Mogga really did a lot more damage than many like to admit.

The fact most people say if we would have appointed Robins we would be safe indicates not only that we'd need a really good manager to be able to have a chance of steering away, but that we were also really in the mire to be in that position in the first place.

The season before we should have been in the playoffs with that squad, so to follow that up with such dross shows an even bigger fall from grace I believe.

No doubts Slade was an absolute joke though!

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

TM was a lot of things but he wasn't responsible for our relegation, that was Slade and SISU.

Its like a new Prime Minister, they spend their time complaining about the old one and probably dealing with the aftermath of that also. TM blew his wad in season 1 on high value quality loanees, a strategy that failed (but lets face it we all enjoyed the ride) and that ultimately had a knock on effect for S2 where we had to tighten the reigns significantly. All of a sudden these big players were not attracted to the club and we all know the result of that.

Relegation at that point was inevitable and has ultimately helped us rebuild with a more sustainable strategy in having our own assets rather than borrowing.

There's no way you can say Mowbray wasn't responsible. He was the one that started the chain of events that led to our relegation.

I really don't understand why people blindly defend him for absolutely everything. Using your political analogy, it's like supporting one party and refusing to criticise them even when they make bonehead decisions, then attacking other parties for every move they make, regardless of what they actually are.

 

[Nick]

There's no way you can say Mowbray wasn't responsible. He was the one that started the chain of events that led to our relegation.

I really don't understand why people blindly defend him for absolutely everything. Using your political analogy, it's like supporting one party and refusing to criticise them even when they make bonehead decisions, then attacking other parties for every move they make, regardless of what they actually are.

I think it's because people could just blame the owners rather than Mowbray. It is easy for a manager to not really get blamed here.

Let's say we didn't have SISU and the fans owned us but had the same budget / break even etc, would more people have blamed him?

 

[steve82]

OK, so at what point did it change? He was still trying to bring in players towards the end of the window and paid money for Turnbull.

Didn't he inherit pretty much a Championship squad and have one of the biggest budgets in League one after he had got them relegated? That is more of an exception rather than the rule.

In fairness to TM he went to a championship club in Blackburn and unfortunately could not save them but was backed at Blackburn in getting promotion by spending likely over a million pounds on two new attacking players in Dack and Samuel, was backed again in January with Armstrong and a fee for Amari Bell amongst other useful additions over two windows.

Here the financial backing wasn’t there, he had no plan what to do for the best without financial backing.

His best option was thanks but I’m walking away that summer at the point he looked to build as circumstances had changed to not what he works within or prepared to do so at this level.

Another manager would of had the opportunity to recruit accordingly on the budget set


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[covcity4life]

The poor management was from the people in charge of bringing in players which was TM / MV. If he was a gourmet chef, why was he applying to cook kids birthday meals in the first place?

the year before it wasnt happy meals , it was a restaurant. if owners decided to make the ritz a bargain buffet place do you not think the chefs would seek employment elsewhere? you would seriously blame a michellen star chef if hes given 4.99 to make a meal worthy of top 6 year end awards? no you would blame the owners of said restuarant who wont give him the budget to do what he does best

 

[covcity4life]

In fairness to TM he went to a championship club in Blackburn and unfortunately could not save them but was backed at Blackburn in getting promotion by spending likely over a million pounds on two new attacking players in Dack and Samuel, was backed again in January with Armstrong and a fee for Amari Bell amongst other useful additions over two windows.

Here the financial backing wasn’t there, he had no plan what to do for the best without financial backing.

His best option was thanks but I’m walking away that summer at the point he looked to build as circumstances had changed to not what he works within or prepared to do so at this level.

Another manager would of had the opportunity to recruit accordingly on the budget set


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agree

i have no doubt another manager could have spent better but they would also never have aimed at playing the same style of football. owners and directors of football are tasked with these strategies. managers like players are just pawns at times.

also worth noting sisu ddint back slade either and his signings were all shit too bar reilly.

at least this thread has established we all owe mowbray for changing sisu for the long term benefit of coventry city football club.

 

[steve82]

agree

i have no doubt another manager could have spent better but they would also never have aimed at playing the same style of football. owners and directors of football are tasked with these strategies. managers like players are just pawns at times.

also worth noting sisu ddint back slade either and his signings were all shit too bar reilly.

at least this thread has established we all owe mowbray for changing sisu for the long term benefit of coventry city football club.

I think that’s the point we all wanted a experienced manager in TM to adapt or be honest and walk away sooner.
He opted to stay but then not maximise the budget adapting, playing a way the type of players he sign can. And let’s be honest he had a blank canvas to try and shape something.

Managers generally have a favoured system and a back up system. So for me he I believe he could of adapted especially given the era he played as a player he could of mustered up a traditional set up side fit for the demands of a season


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[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

I think it's because people could just blame the owners rather than Mowbray. It is easy for a manager to not really get blamed here.

Let's say we didn't have SISU and the fans owned us but had the same budget / break even etc, would more people have blamed him?

That definitely comes into it.

I guess we've had so many bad managers that the decent season (although not really good enough considering) makes him exempt from criticism in some people's eyes.

Mowbray ran over a bunch of school children... 'Yeah, but he almost got us in the playoffs and Slade was the lolipop lady'.