Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (130 Viewers)

[Brighton Sky Blue]

This was the book I got it from, being discussed on More or Less which is an excellent programme

BBC World Service - More or Less, Missing women from drug trials

Looks interesting. Probably the most revolutionary legal drug provided though is I think the contraceptive pill

 

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[shmmeee]

Looks interesting. Probably the most revolutionary legal drug provided though is I think the contraceptive pill

Definitely.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

I did actually ask my mate for a blast on her fag when she came to see me yesterday, luckily she’s a good mate and completely ignored me

I can't begin to describe how much that would break social distancing rules!

 

[Ian1779]

So true.

Facebook algorithms going in to overtime on your feed.

 

[CCFCSteve]

Yeah, the minimal infections and deaths in numerous countries that locked down earlier clearly aren't a reliable measure yet against the 20k plus we've had here.

Not really, or not yet anyway, unless the virus disappears or until a vaccine has found.

If a country has locked down sooner/better then their infections and deaths will of course be a lot less at the moment. However, assuming (and it’s still a big assumption) that (a large majority of) people can’t catch it twice, there will also be more people who can catch it in those countries in future waves in those countries I presume it may also spread quicker in those countries as there are more people to catch it.

Of course if a vaccine/better treatments are found quickly those that have currently been the best in tracing, tracking and suppressing the virus will ultimately have been the most successful in tackling it. At the very least they are certainly buying themselves more time to find better treatments, get better prepared etc (and find a potential vaccine) which has got to be a good thing. However, if on the other hand a vaccine solution isn’t found then eventually a majority of people will get it so it will be more how patients are treated and it’s essential that countries remain below their health service capacity (I’d imagine if the outbreak had hit in the autumn and peaked over the winter most health services wouldn’t have coped - this is still my concern regarding the second wave, however, hopefully by then we will have better ability to control the spread, as well as better treatments and capacity)

ps Just to clarify, I’m saying this with little (fuck all !!!) scientific knowledge, just applying logic to what I’ve read/understood to date so won’t be offended if people shoot me down. There are so many variables at play it’s almost impossible to guess what will happen in the coming months (or longer)

 

[shmmeee]

Amazing

 

[SkyBlueCRJ]

The lack of PPE is obviously shocking but the fact that up to half of Europe's deaths are in care homes is absolutely appalling. Interesting article from a GP in the UK who claims that her early warnings were ignored by public health authorities. Forget heads rolling there could well be legal investigations on individuals once the dust settles from this.

GP calls for action after 125 of her care home patients die of Covid-19

 

[djr8369]

Now there is open talk of social distancing lasting all year and beyond it's going to be interesting to see what that actually means in practice while trying to get more of the economy going and how that will affect business decisions. If you run a restuarent you might be hoping you can open for table service soon. If you run a bar/club you might be thinking there's no future for you. Plus, what happens to those employees? Is furlough extended for them until then or does some more generous benefit system come into place and a lot of those people gradually change jobs into industries that are busier? What happens to industries like tourism? What about the countries who rely on it as a substantial part of their economy?

 

[djr8369]

Grendel must have a bad hangover. He's usually busy moving last nights goalposts or deflecting by now.

 

[Walsgrave]

Now there is open talk of social distancing lasting all year and beyond it's going to be interesting to see what that actually means in practice while trying to get more of the economy going and how that will affect business decisions. If you run a restuarent you might be hoping you can open for table service soon. If you run a bar/club you might be thinking there's no future for you. Plus, what happens to those employees? Is furlough extended for them until then or does some more generous benefit system come into place and a lot of those people gradually change jobs into industries that are busier? What happens to industries like tourism? What about the countries who rely on it as a substantial part of their economy?

If this continues beyond June, which is not out of the question, then I think it will be increasingly hard for the government to justify paying people in non-essential jobs for not working when key workers are not only likely to be paid very little, but also are the ones who are going to have to pick up the tab for this through higher taxation in future. All furlough is doing is increasing inequality by providing big handouts for those who are already likely to be privileged.

 

[David O'Day]

Now there is open talk of social distancing lasting all year and beyond it's going to be interesting to see what that actually means in practice while trying to get more of the economy going and how that will affect business decisions. If you run a restuarent you might be hoping you can open for table service soon. If you run a bar/club you might be thinking there's no future for you. Plus, what happens to those employees? Is furlough extended for them until then or does some more generous benefit system come into place and a lot of those people gradually change jobs into industries that are busier? What happens to industries like tourism? What about the countries who rely on it as a substantial part of their economy?

There isn't a chance that will happen

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[David O'Day]

What you are most likely to see is the lifting and tightening as required of the restrictions. Chris Whitty hinself said yesterday they would have to take into account if the restrictions where going to have themselves an adverse effect on the nations health

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[David O'Day]

Why is that racist? It isnt. I'm not racist. You are. Your obsessed with bringing colour/race into everything. Is that all you've got? One daft comment from 6 months ago? The majority of us dont give a shit what colour/race people are. Its bigots like you that keep bringing it up. You're obsessed with trying to divide us.

It's not racist to want to drown immigrants?

Ok Derek

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[Astute]

I don’t know if you’re being facetious but infection rate and the severity of the infection are two different things. If I had to make an educated guess I would put it down to one or several of the hundreds of chemicals in tobacco smoke that is hostile to the virus. I could imagine this in particular in houses covered in ash over the years.

If you’re a regular smoker however and get infected then you’re in big big trouble. And I know I get pulled up for ‘I have a degree’ but here it’s directly relevant-I’m not just guessing

So I'm being facetious. You've got the degree.

Yes infection rates and severity are different. But I didn't say about the severity. The article didn't say about severity. Yet I am the one who is supposedly being facetious.

So let's forget about your point scoring. Why are smokers 80% less likely to get the virus if these numbers are correct?

 

[The coventrian]

It's not racist to want to drown immigrants?

Ok Derek
Cool story david.
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[Nick]

This is madness.

Why is it allowed still? You can't walk round a country park but you can queue up for a burger.

 

[CCFCSteve]

This is madness.

Why is it allowed still? You can't walk round a country park but you can queue up for a burger.

Idiots - both Five Guys (obviously no attempt to get people to social distance) and the people in the queue !

 

[Nick]

The whole idea of it is to have food delivered surely? Going into town and queuing for a burger defeats the object.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

So I'm being facetious. You've got the degree.

Yes infection rates and severity are different. But I didn't say about the severity. The article didn't say about severity. Yet I am the one who is supposedly being facetious.

So let's forget about your point scoring. Why are smokers 80% less likely to get the virus if these numbers are correct?

I wasn't being arsey I just couldn't tell

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Missus got told off by some shop staff in Sainsbury's for looking too closely at stuff. She's visually impaired but was told 'they're not a protected group'

 

[Nick]

Have they started to delve into all of the deaths they are announcing?

We saw it with the young lad who died in Coventry of "COVID-19" but the doctor said he had COVID-19 but he didn't die from it.

Are there stats which say how many people per month die of cancer, flu, heart disease etc?

In the care homes when they are saying the deaths, are they testing people after they have died to say whether they had it or not? I know depending on the size of care homes they have deaths every couple of days.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Think you are absolutely correct about that!

 

[djr8369]

There isn't a chance that will happen

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Which bit and what's your alternative?

 

[djr8369]

Have they started to delve into all of the deaths they are announcing?

We saw it with the young lad who died in Coventry of "COVID-19" but the doctor said he had COVID-19 but he didn't die from it.

Are there stats which say how many people per month die of cancer, flu, heart disease etc?

In the care homes when they are saying the deaths, are they testing people after they have died to say whether they had it or not? I know depending on the size of care homes they have deaths every couple of days.

I don't think they are testing but many homes are seeing many more deaths than normal.

 

[Nick]

Just looked, a positive test result isn't required for somebody to have died from Coronavirus.

Bit mad really.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

The lack of PPE is obviously shocking but the fact that up to half of Europe's deaths are in care homes is absolutely appalling. Interesting article from a GP in the UK who claims that her early warnings were ignored by public health authorities. Forget heads rolling there could well be legal investigations on individuals once the dust settles from this.

GP calls for action after 125 of her care home patients die of Covid-19

It doesn't help their cause that many of their advisors have link to eugenic beliefs and letting the frail and elderly die. This virus is almost their wet dream if only there wasn't that pesky thing called scrutiny.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Not really, or not yet anyway, unless the virus disappears or until a vaccine has found.

If a country has locked down sooner/better then their infections and deaths will of course be a lot less at the moment. However, assuming (and it’s still a big assumption) that (a large majority of) people can’t catch it twice, there will also be more people who can catch it in those countries in future waves in those countries I presume it may also spread quicker in those countries as there are more people to catch it.

Of course if a vaccine/better treatments are found quickly those that have currently been the best in tracing, tracking and suppressing the virus will ultimately have been the most successful in tackling it. At the very least they are certainly buying themselves more time to find better treatments, get better prepared etc (and find a potential vaccine) which has got to be a good thing. However, if on the other hand a vaccine solution isn’t found then eventually a majority of people will get it so it will be more how patients are treated and it’s essential that countries remain below their health service capacity (I’d imagine if the outbreak had hit in the autumn and peaked over the winter most health services wouldn’t have coped - this is still my concern regarding the second wave, however, hopefully by then we will have better ability to control the spread, as well as better treatments and capacity)

ps Just to clarify, I’m saying this with little (fuck all !!!) scientific knowledge, just applying logic to what I’ve read/understood to date so won’t be offended if people shoot me down. There are so many variables at play it’s almost impossible to guess what will happen in the coming months (or longer)

With a vaccine a fair way off an accurate 'who's had it' test will be the next best

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Idiots - both Five Guys (obviously no attempt to get people to social distance) and the people in the queue !

It's not even a Five Guys - it's just saying how many people are allowed in the store at any one time.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

It's not even a Five Guys - it's just saying how many people are allowed in the store at any one time.

Is G at the back of the queue?

 

[djr8369]

What you are most likely to see is the lifting and tightening as required of the restrictions. Chris Whitty hinself said yesterday they would have to take into account if the restrictions where going to have themselves an adverse effect on the nations health

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Well yes but what does that look like? What is lifted or relaxed and what is kept in place to keep Ro at or below 1?

 

[djr8369]

This is madness.

Why is it allowed still? You can't walk round a country park but you can queue up for a burger.

Yet McDonalds drive through closed.

 

[David O'Day]

Which bit and what's your alternative?

The restrictions remaining until there is a vaccine.

It's not going to work economically or practically. You can't keep people in lockdown for up to 18 months as it will be worse for peoples health and they are liable to start to ignore it.

You need to wait until the transmission data is down and then go back to the test and track methods. That requires high testing capacity but that will happen eventually.



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[CCFCSteve]

With a vaccine a fair way off an accurate 'who's had it' test will be the next best

In terms of trying to return the country to some form of normality a reliable antibody test will be massive, as I think will be the NHS app if they can get it up and running (issues with Apple/android around data protection) - which can automatically notify you if you’ve been around someone diagnosed with Covid

I think we are starting an antibody study of 20k people today/very soon

 

[David O'Day]

Just looked, a positive test result isn't required for somebody to have died from Coronavirus.

Bit mad really.

Yep the out of hospital deaths are what is recorded on the death certificate and that does not require confirmation.

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[wingy]

Universities are expecting 230,000 fewer students – that's serious financial pain | Jo Grady

Have wondered what this particular sphere of economic activity will look like come September/October.